Opie

I'm sorry I was basing my opinion of Manny Legace off of more than just one stat.

Can I see your algorithm fort that prorated number I don't understand how a guy who's full contract is 1.2 mil can go up to 5.47 with less than a full season left? If it is a 1.2 hit for a full year for Detroit why would it be higher with 1/3 of the season left, and why 5 x's higher?

ummm Manny Legace will not get you a top 4 d-man, think of it this way would you trade Kronwall for Legace? Stuart? And there is no way they get a legit Second liner for him either, he has proven to be a great back up mediocre starter, there is not a high demand for that around the league.

I second that, I can not friggin wait for Oct 9th!!!!!!

Can I ask, how did Lowe F-up the Pronger thing? Didn't Pronger demand out?

Not me I said in another thread that Downey is the perfect enforcer for this team!!!!!

They only have 2.237 mil it will be hard to fit Teemu in under that!

One game does not a decent player make. He is an alright winger, could be something more but as of right now meh!

FALSE: And here is why, he was a key ingredient in getting Hossa here, he is good friends with him and told him what it is like in this org, so therefore Kopecky is more valuable!!! Hell, if the wings win the cup and Hossa has a 100pt season I say give Kopecky the MVP! I think due to his knee though Helm will take over for him!

I think if the ZDH line is split they do make it to a PPG this year, if not then they will make it soon enough, the thing about being a PPG player is that you don't have to do it from day one, your prime will ultimately catch you up or in some cases continue your beyond the PPG.

VM1138, OH I was just ranting about the unfortunate state of Pro sports in this era, they are just not what they were in the late 80's early 90's, but then again that was when the sports were still trying to get on something besides ABC's wild world of sports. Sports went from entertainment to big business in a hurry.

-Bolded part: That is an unfair criteria, it is not that Foxboro isn't a nice stadium or couldn't host it, it is that the league won't put the superbowl in a cold weather outdoor stadium. TO your first point about hating rivals, look no further than this board and the Avs haters, it is not that Fans hate other teams more than there own it is that they have a strong emotional tie to there team. What city hosts a tournament is not so much a credit to their fans a lot of that has to due with were that respective sports executives want to see it hosted. Cities fight to host the Superbowl or the final four, the league then selects what they deem to be the best location as far as ease of transportation, weather, etc.... There is a lot of love for Boston sports in the media right now because they hold 2 of the 4 major championships in professional sports and had another team compete for a third. If they get docked for not winning in a century what about the cities that didn't even have teams for that long? Your post makes you sound like a bitter jealous fan, not that you are but it comes off as though you are bothered by the fact that ESPN ( of all things to bother you) is not giving your city enough credit, and to tell you the truth I could give two s***s if they award it to Detroit, Boston, or East El Paso, the awards I care about are awarded at the end of the very last game every season. ESPY's or Title town all of that s*** means squat to me, before you go thinking I think MY team's city should win. Because I root for the Wings, I don't consider myself a true Boston sports fan, in order to be that you must root for all 4 local teams trust me.

mmmm cougar!!!! Back on topic: Notice how in most sports now when the game ends players from both sides are friends, not away from the rink, field, pitch, court, whatever, right on the field they shake hands smile and talk. Rivalries and hatred are all fan driven now. Even the Sox v. Yanks rivalry is just fan based, they players don't give a s*** anymore, they have more allegiance to their alma mater than they do their current team, because it is a job. They play for the pay check now. That is no more evident than watching a football game, at the end of it all of the players meet on the field and talk about old times with big smiles on their faces. How many times do you think Probie walked across the rink to say hi to an old buddy from the other team? Every one wants athletes to be role models, won't somebody think of the children, but I am of the Charles Barkley school of thought, "You don't want me(chuck) to be your child's role model, you want it to be a Teacher or Doctor or you!" Something to that effect!

Gotcha, I misunderstood, obviously!

I think I brought this up before on here but..... If the Pats had not f***ed up and taken the Giants so lightly, or had the Giants not had the best Defensive front 7 of the season (more than likely the cause) I would have had my favorite 4 teams win their respective championships. Now I am sort of a Bandwagon Sox fan, as I stopped watching baseball for like 10 years and then when I picked it back up, I started rooting for the local team, they were still losing at the time though, damn Yankees!!! Pats just sort of rooted for the lovable loser and then they became the lovable underdog winners and now they are the evil Patriots ******, been a lifelong C's fan, just old enough to remember the days of Bird, Mchale and Parrish winning, and then I suffered through the 90's-this year, Luckily I have been a wings fan since then end of the Dead Wings, just enough to give me perspective. What makes us as Boston sports fans so dis likable is that when our teams are down, we let everyone know that the team that is beating us sucks and we should be better, then when we start winning it is like we have no idea what it is like to lose. Good thing most fans around here have the B's to bring them back to earth! But there is no doubting that currently the area is title town, however it wasn't that many years ago that it was also loser-ville. I also think that the Red Sox are responsible for pink sports gear, Do'H

Pro sports in General have changed their way very similarly to the way hockey did, the world is ever evolving including its sports, the NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL and even NASCAR (I hate BTW) have done everything they can to curtail the violence. The leagues are not to blame, the non fan soccer mom who is afraid her child may see a fight or some one act in a violent manner towards another human being is, because then she or the father (if he is still around) will have to explain that violence or violent acts are ok sometimes and not other times. And heaven forbid we as an American Society spend time educating our own children isn't that what schools are for and if not TV definitely is. We (America) as a society have become wussified!!!! Once you start letting political correctness rule your decision making you are making decisions based on the minority, in a country where majority rules? I am not saying minority in terms of race, color, creed, etc, I refer to minority in the fact that Nicolette Sheridan is in towel in a football commercial and one old lady in Bethesda is offended that ad must be removed from TV, so now everyone is walking on egg shells not to offend anyone else. So back to Soccer mom and her child, who not only likes soccer (biggest diving sport in the world, and I am a huge soccer fan, or was) but also likes to play hockey: She watches a clip on Sportcenter or the local new station and sees a player lay an absolute beating on another, she doesn't take the time to know what her Child is interested in, she makes a rash judgment, because that takes less time than a thorough one, and decides hockey = fighting and fighting = bad. So she complains, boom things need to be changed! For example look at how the rules have changed in all sports, NBA added flagrant fouls even though in the 80's the C' Mchale and Parrish both have instances of beating the crap out of players and only getting a regular foul, in today's game it would be a season long suspension. Football, the quarter back, where the camera is focused more often than not can barely be touched, yet linemen who no one cares about anyway (hence the name non skill positions) do things that are criminal on the streets every play (not complaining I am pointing out the discrepancy). NHL, the instigator rule need I say more. MLB, now if you bean a guy or charge the mound it is a suspend able offense, yet running the catcher through the backstop is competitive play? Nascar, guys used to fight in the pits all the time, you did something to cause me to lose, you must deal with my fists aka the consequences. The American society is softening fast, very fast and our sports are not immune to that! I will get off my soapbox now!

TO ME!!!!!!! This is what makes the Stanley Cup the most special trophy in all of sports, what other trophy do the players get to take home with them and share with family, friends, and the community they call home!!!

Are you trying to say that The Giants championship is more recent than the C's?

I love how no matter what happens or is said, or not said, about the Wings some how this place finds a way to post 3-4 threads daily about how the league, Bettman, the BOG, Burke, Lowe, Captain America, Stewie from the Family guy, Maury Povich, Mike Wallace, The Kid from those stupid Gieco Go-cart racing commercials, The Gieco Caveman, my Aunt, Bea Arthur, and Marvin the Martian are hating on the Wings and no one respects the Detroit Red Wings!!!!

You need to read more articles man, he has said many many times he wants to be a Red Wing, Holland has said so, Winter has said so, Hossa has said so even in reference to before the Trade Deadline. He does want to win the cup and the fact that Detroit, with or with out him, is a favorite helps, but he has also stated many times that he wants to be a Red Wing, that he wants to be a part of this Org. Those of you mulling around Z and possibly Hossa's contract next year need to remember one thing: NO ONE MAKES MORE MONEY THAN THE 'C"!!!! Holland has made it apparent to the players that if the best player in the world takes a pay cut to be on the best team, so will everyone else. Sure he threw the let me check with Nick thing out there to Hossa, but look at the respect an outsider (of the Red Wing team) had, he said "Don't worry, I'll have what he is having!" Could it bite Holland in the ass, maybe, but it appears to be a promise he made to Nick that he will stand behind!

RE Bolded part: Considering how this team was dismantled after the first Dynasty I think it is really important to note the Illitches ability to build a winner and a team that players want to be a part of. Big big part of players feeling comfortable in Detroit!

I am just guessing because there is no context here, but I think the "Who wants to live in Detroit" part was being said sarcastically, because the rest of what he said was complimentary of the team.

I would wager that it is also not a coincidence that the Sell out record fell at the same time as the economy which also happened the same time Stevie and Shanny walked away. I think there are a lot more factors to the empty seats than just what nationality the players are. The league is almost a 50 -50 split, plus the wings still have players like Cleary, Draper, Stuart, Chelios, Maltby there are almost as many NA's as Euro's it just happens to be that Detroit has more Euro's than other teams and was really the first to bring in numerous Euro's that people focus on. It is not like the team is 100% European. I tend to believe (thus making it my opinion not fact) that the economy, loss of jobs, and loss of companies to fill in the lower bowl has cost them more in attendance than the fact that they have a European captain or a mass of Europeans. Look at the parade, it was a free event, did they have a hard time bringing people in to cheer for those Euro's then, or were people screaming just as hard for a Euro 'C' and Euro Conn Smythe as they had when it was Yzerman. Well Yzerman may have been a bad example because he is, for all intense and purposes, a son of Detroit, he is as big as Gordie Howe, and some day we could be saying that about Lids, Dats, Z, hell even Hossa if he stays long term on the cheap and wins in Detroit he will be a Detroit legend because he walked away from millions upon millions to be a part of what has become the best Org in pro sports! ( I love the way my Sox are being run, and the Pats, but they don't come close!) EDIT: Just read your second post, the only thing I can see that separates the Wings from the Pistons and other pro sports teams (you can't include college, their fans have completely different sets of loyalties and a good chunk are students) is that the NHL just had a lock out, coincidently just before the economy collapse and the departure of Yzerman and Shanny, that cost the league thousands, if not millions of fans across the country, that is a major difference. I think you are not giving enough credit to the other factors, and it appears (no insult meant here) that you are subscribing to the out of date, Don Cherry type of thinking. There was a point in time where people of Color were not seen as athletes that "Americans" can relate to, but what people forget is the only people who are native to this country got forced off of their lands many many years ago, we are all decedents of Europe and more and more people move to this country from Europe every year (well they were until the Dollar began to plummet). This is not the 80's and these players are not coming from Soviet Russia. Times my friend they are a changing, I will give you that fighting would draw a crowd, it is entertainment for sure, but I don't buy that a Euro heavy team that is winning Championships isn't selling out its venue soley because there are not enough NA'S!!!

OK so here is the NHL 07 reference, I always make the first trade for Hossa, just how I roll, usually trade for him than Nabby and Thornton (I usually only have to offer Lang, Hasek, and a draft choice, tee hee I love video games they are so realistic). MY top line is usually Z Joe T and Hossa, and Hossa usually wins the scoring title with Joe T as the MVP!! Back to the topic, the shootout line up I use is is exactly what you posted then followed by Thornton and Whitney (I so wished Razor Ray Whitney had been a bigger piece of the Wings). Unless I screwed up on the controls I was almost guaranteed 3 goals out of the top 4 shooters!!!!

I disagree only to this extend, people don't give a s*** what nationality you are if you are a winner, things like nationality, style of play, height, all of that s*** goes out the window if you find a way to win. Winning supersedes everything else, I think Lids is more revered in Detroit than Shanny. It is all about what have you done for me (general statement not me specifically), if you win for me, I love you, you lose and you are a soft Euro!