Opie

I am not ignoring history I am saying the current way the award is handed out tarnishes the history of the award if you read my posts instead of posting things like: people don't know the meaning of the word, or sure ignore history you would have known that. I also said that yes in the 70's, and I will go as far as to say up until about 94, the award would have been the most prestigious, but now the best offensive player gets the award, as proven by a guy who won it this year and plays no PK's and is actually his coaches first choice to be sent in to the sin bin, where as Z or lids are the first guys chosen to be on the ice to kill penalties. AGAIN, I ask how can he be the most valuable player if when his team needs him the most, in a pk situation, he is not on the ice, and is one of his coach's (Coach of the year mind you) last choices?

Yet another eloquent rebuttal! Thanks for your insight I definitely change my opinion now!!

I have been waiting to post in this thread until I can make up my mind. To me this is Chelios part Duex!! Man I hate that guy, but not the same way I hated LeTurtle! or the way I hate Samuelsson, what he did to Cam, can't forgive. If Tucker was on the Wings, could I put his antics behind me, not sure because his antics aren't Avery-esque but they are pretty s***ty, they are not that far off from being Domi-esque. This is a tough one, if Babs and Holland see him fitting in the winged wheel, than I will support it and root for him, like I said he is not LeTurtle or Ulfie boy, but if they don't sign him I will continue to hate him. I shouldn't say hate him, I hate his play and his antics.

I think this is a credit to him and what he has done to his game, I don't think he and Dats will be happy until they are the best at every aspect of the game, which will be great because they will be driving each other for years while in the same uni more than likely. These two will be like having Stevie and Lids in their primes at the same time in terms of work ethic! This is a total credit to his work ethic and an insatiable appetite to be the best he can be, and never being satisfied with just being good!! CONGRATS ZATA!!!!!

This is what I find odd: Better Show Leno > Daly Longer Show Leno > Daly More watch show Leno > Daly Better job with the cup and Players Daly >>>>>>> Leno Cheesier show with the cup and players Leno >>>>>>> Daly

I am with you on that point, I would tweak the awards a little, turn the Hart into Forward MVP, Norris D-man MVP, Vezina Goalie MVP. Rookie of the year Team GAA Team Goals Scoring title Selke Masterson The Byng I am meh on I am of the opinion the more awards you have the cheaper some of them become. This is not the Oscars Lamp lighter award PURE BRILLIANCE!!!!! Write it down, note the date and remember it!!!!

Oh I see your point, the wanting Malone is a preference, I think he is the next Draper in the league only tougher (no shot at Drapes trust me, I just think this kid is bigger and more physical, I know Drapes scored with his chin, great heart not questioning him in the least). I absolutely fell in love with this kid 2nd half of the season and in the playoffs!!!! Broke his nose what 3 times?

Yeah I don't think you could name it after a team, especially if you named it after a still existing team, for instance it would probably be the Edmonton Oilers Award, that is just weird.

I am torn or Rolston, some days I am for him and others I am against him. There were times this year where he just look to be losing a step, could be because he was on a mediocre team, could be age. But I am torn, I would still take Malone as my top choice but Rolston is second, for now!!

BTW, I will correct myself and say that Feds won the Hart based on what he did for the team, he was a defensive beast, he was an offensive beast. I also offer this up: If the Hart was given after the playoffs and playoffs were taken into consideration, then the Hart to me would be more prestigious because it takes into consideration being the MVP of the regular season and the playoffs.

Seriously if this was the reason he was given the MVP I would be all for it, but to me it is blatantly obvious it was given to him for being the first player in how many years to break the 60 goal mark.

TSN? OK ok that was a stretch, but you don't think Duck fans are laughing at this? You don't think there are other fans out there that noticed it.

So counter prove my point that I said about the award losing prestige because it is no longer given to the best player in the game. There is no way AO is a better all around player than Lids or Z or even Dats for that matter. I will give you that Dats is probably the closest of the three to AO because he doesn't see as much PK time as the other 2. However as I said I think 3 times now, when WAS got a bench minor all year Boudrea (coach of the year) put AO in the box, he wasn't forced to that was his choice. How much ice time does AO see on the PK. If he is the most valuable player on the team why isn't he on the ice when the team would need its best and most valuable player? The award is now given to the best offensive player unless, like I already said, a goalie completely dominates the opposition. It is given to a defenseman, that in your own words, only won because it was a down offensive year. Things like that shouldn't matter, if he is the MVP he should be the MVP whether offense is up or down, if a guys scores 65 goals, plays no short handed situations and is for all intense and purposes a defensive liability he should not beat out a defenseman with 70+ points, who plays every single situation or a forward who has 100+ points who plays in every single situation. EDIT: What part of the MVP voting process takes into consideration lucky bounces, is there also an algorithm for when the goalie is completely out of position, how about own goals, are those taken into consideration too? What about break aways where a bad line change leads to a one on 0, or is just goals and point totals? oh oh what about this, A guy, for sake of argument lets use Malkin, is absolutely creamed in his offensive end, slow to get up, ******* at the ref, never makes it to the defensive zone, his player steals the puck and passes it to him as he stands at center ice, then on a 1 - 0 he blasts a laser of a slap shot 5 hole, does he get bonus points for that, or is that just a regular goal. What about the open nets he missed do those also count in your lucky bounce algorithm?

Exactly, if Steve Yzerman ever came out and said I am the best we would all faint and then check him into a hospital for a full eval!!!

I don't live in Detroit.

Instead of insinuating that people are dumb or piggy backing off of someone else's post with a thank you or a why don't you post something meaningful! I am fully aware of what the word prestige means, however since I have a different opinion than you I somehow don't know the meaning of a word? I gave my reasons for why the award HAS LOST PRESTIGE, take a page out of Probie for 5's book and at least prove what I said to be different than what I said.

Why not, sounds good to me!!!!

NO he said his legs were toast and he was tired!!!!!!! Edit: Regardless if you want to credit the defense than fine, but if he can be shut down by Draper's line yet Crosby who was facing two Conn Smythe trophy finalist how come he was able to perform? See just like you can counter prove my points I can do the same, hence the fact this is an opinion

Nice try, he is awarded the Trophy and then takes a replica home! The point was your post said that the Hart was the most prestigious trophy, that was retired. If you are basing anything off of the quote you should take the whole thing into consideration, because what they are talking about is something from the past not the current. And I already posted in the past yes the Hart to me would have been the most prestigious because it was given to the best player, right now it is given to the best offensive player. To me bar none the best hockey player in the world right now, regardless of potential, is Nick Lidstrom, yet where did he finish on the list of voting, 4th. Why because his offensive numbers where not good enough, that is simply it, not because he isn't the best player! I still contest you can not be the best player in the league if when your team gets a bench minor the coach puts you in the box as his first option, I believe to be the most valuable player in the league you score, kill penalties, set up other players, you should be one of the top minute getters on your team. AO does some of those things, but Z does a lot of them comparably and yet still finds his way on the ice for every single possible situation. Not just where his offensive talents see it fit! You can blame that on the coach if you want, but I don't look at AO and see anything that screams put me on the PK coach! My problem is not with the history or the award but the current status of the award which unfortunately tarnishes the prestige of the award.

In regards to the bolded part: No really, some players don't fold under the pressure, So then the Hart contender Evgeni Malkin didn't suck the bag on the most stress filled pressure packed stage, oh know that is right all the 3 points he got in the last two games make up for that! I ask that you stop being so arrogant and typing things saying that I don't know what I am talking about or that I don't think things as far through as you do! If you want to discuss our difference of opinion I am fine, but no need to start acting/typing like you know more than me. If you want proof of my stubbornness check out my posts in threads like the one about the Ducks being the favorite where I didn't know anything because I said that the ducks wouldn't score the same with the loss of Teemu and Penner. Or many others where I have a difference of opinion from others. My opinion is my opinion. Just like yours!

IT IS AN OPINION BASED THREAD, I AM STATING MY OPINION YOU DISAGREE FINE!!! I am not going to change my opinion because of something you write on a discussion board. I have watched sports and played them for the better part of my 31 years of life, I have watched awards that were once given to the best player morph into awards based on offensive out put! In the 70's the Hart would have been at the top of my list, however IN MY OPINION, the state of the award is that it is given to the best offensive player and once in a great while it is given to a goalie who absolutely owns the league. Much like Arod being the MVP on the last placed team. Didn't one of your quotes that was supposed to be an ouch and hurt me, say that the most prestigious award was retired?

What in the hell is your point Jim Carrey has a Vezina! Neidermayer also has a Norris, Pronger has a Hart which defenseman of the three would you rather have! My point in bringing up Lids is that he was not even in the final 3 of the Hart, are you trying to tell me he is not top 3 players in the league!

Excuse me, I am the one defending my opinion, not trying to change yours! If my posts are painful to read, Don't!!!!

Yeah and had he continued his play he would have had one of the best playoff seasons in the history of the game, and if that was the case, he would have deserved the Conn Smythe, and to me that would be more prestigious than winning the Hart. Big deal, you had the best regular season of all time, when compared to you had the best post season of all time!!! Hmm I still want the post season award.

I say Z is better than AO as an all around player, who is the best offensive player in the world, AO hands down. Who is on the ice on a 5-3 in the post season, when there team is assessed a bench minor whom is put in the box to serve it and who is on the ice to kill it. Whom would I rather have on my team if I have one choice between the two, I take the Conn Smythe winner, but it has nothing to do with the award it has to do with who is the better all around player. AO won the Hart, Pearson, and Ross, Z won the cup and the Smythe, fantastic I will take Z any day of the week and twice on Sunday. The Hart is based purely on offensive numbers, goals, assists, points. OR it is given to a goalie whose team had no right winning half the games they did! AO won the Hart because he put up mad numbers. Go read a book or the internet? Why because you can't find anything to back up your claim! I don't have to it is my opinion that the Conn Smythe is the more Prestigious award. Plus did you just say that in order to win the Hart you have to be exceptional for 82 games, are you sure every winner has played 82 games, oh wait that must be why Lids wasn't a final 3 candidate, because he didn't play 82 games. Lids is a better Hockey player and had a better all around season than both Z and AO, yet he was what 4th 5th in the voting and that is damn high for a defenseman. How many times in the past 15 years have the Ross and Hart trophy winners been the same person? IMO, you can win 10 hart trophies in a row and not make the playoffs once, the next year not get a whiff of the Hart and win the Conn Smythe and I would think that one Conn Smythe would mean a hell of a lot more and thus be more prestigious. You can be the best player for a season, and your team doesn't get a sniff of the championship, therefore you are automatically eliminated from the Conn Smythe Discussion, hell you can be the Hart winner and make the playoffs and not make it out of the first round and you get NO consideration, that is what makes it harder to win and what makes it more prestigious. You can't just be the sexy name, or the gaudy numbers guy and win it, you have to be a standout great player on a great team. This years Hart winner does not stop Sidney Crosby from scoring on a 5-3 next to the net, do you know why, because he is on the bench! However that play made had a huge role in deciding who the Conn Smythe winner is!