Opie

I agree, the Wings badly need to establish control of there own division. The division record is pretty scary when you look at the overall record and consider that 8 of the 10 losses have come against the central. (Including OT/SO losses in the loss category). That is crazy, the only other two losses were ANA and EDM. The wings have to start winning against the Central, and winning a lot. Other than the play against the central I really have a hard time complaining about a lot though, which is nice!!

Seeing as I gloat about picking the Ducks not to be the favorite I guess I should eat some serious Crow for saying that SJ was the favorite. 1. I didn't think the wings complementary players would be this good. 2. The Ducks lost a lot in Penner, Teemu, Neids (I know he is back) 3. The Sharks really didn't change that much in the off season. Having weighed those facts, I didn't see anything to stop SJ from running away like the Wings look to be poised to do. I thought the addition of Roenick would give them motivation and a veteran leadership that would drive them to win the cup. I am not saying they still couldn't win the cup, just saying I was wrong.

Haven't heard a word about this kid, but in the infamous words of Public Enemy Hype Man Flavor Flav:

You are right I do tend to group the Sammy haters together, but very few people post different opinions and even fewer with descriptive responses, like you just did. See I agree with you, and won't argue your post, because you are right, Ryder could possibly flourish on the second line with Flip, Huds. But so many people discredit what he is doing, people say he can't pass, come on, seriously. Do you think he made it to this level without being able to pass. Does he pass like D or Z no but he makes passes, and say what you want he is producing. The past few years he has been one of the teams top 10 in scoring. He is playing over his head I admitted that, he should be a third liner. But he plays well enough that he does not make the second line a liability like some here make it out. He is not a detriment to this team, he in no way makes the team worse. He may not make it a whole lot better, but he is not hindering this team. If he was traded, to me it would be like the J.W trade, no skin off of my teeth, but only do it if it makes this team better. To me Ryder is a slight upgrade (only 10 pts more the last two years), but not what the team needs imo, to me the team needs a sniper or a great playmaker on the second line. Ryder is neither of those. Maybe there is a reason Ryder is benched, maybe he is not a good team guy, I don't know you don't know. This team has great chemistry the lines are playing well together, and when the third line is back together, they will play with that great intensity and defensive game that helps this team so much. Sammy's ability to play on the second line does two things for you: 1. Because he can produce in that spot D-Z-H doesn't have to be split up, one of the best lines in the NHL can play together and built even more chemistry. 2.The teams best defensive line does not need to be split up. Cleary, Maltby and Draper play a great version of the grind line. It isn't quite the same without Mac to throw down when needed, but they all play hard on the forecheck and Cleary is a lot more defensively sound than Sammy. I don't particularly like him on the Point during pp, but again he is able to fill the role allowing Ralf and Lids to stay together on the first unit. Just like in the Downey (I bring him up as most of you know I was vocally against him, but I admit he brings other skills to the game.) situation, Sammy brings a lot more to the table than just g/a/pts. He is on a team where he is a weak top 6 forward, but some teams he would solidly be in the top 6, they would all be bad teams admittedly. The point is however he fills the role, and as well as Ray Whitney did, and I bet most of you would say Whitney is a better player. But you never know, maybe Sammy goes to Car and he plays the way Ray did there, and Ray plays like Sammy does here. Who knows, what I do know is that he plays a lot better than most on here give him credit for. But these are the same people who bashed Lang all last year and he just put up very good numbers, but he playing style wasn't what people wanted. The same can be said for Datsyuk, people ***** about he is too clean, always a lady bing finalist, they want him to have a mean streak I guess. So these people can not be made happy, even if Sammy were to put up 60 pts, he would still be ragged on. That, my friend, is pathetic. Appreciate what you (you general not you specific) are watching, this could be one of the best Wings teams in a long time, and even the '02 team had Boyd the Void and Mathieu Dandenault! So to say he doesn't fit with this team is absurd, seeing as it is the point to this thread. He fits quite well actually filling roles needed to make other lines and his team better. So I guess I was wrong he does things that make the team better at the same time he doesn't make them worse. But then again I am trying to get my point across to some people who think that Lilja single handedly lost the wings the cup and that Downey will be the reason they win it! I know you are not in that group redwing56, but the vast majority here is, so that is the Audience I usually aim my posts at. After all they do say know your audience! Happy Holidays to you and yours! Edit: point out to me where I said he had great stats, I said he is producing and doing a good job in his role, I never said he was great. I compared him to others by what he was making and the fact that Ryder makes over 2x his salary and only produced about 10 more points per season, that makes him a better value and more important to the wings, but not a better player or that his stats were great.

I have had a concussion, and I knew what was going on, it was blurry and fuzzy, I wasn't sure where I was, but I was able to keep playing physically. But I knew what I was doing. It was all really fuzzy and blurry. So I don't buy the he was concussed so he had no idea what he was doing. If he was able to get to his feet he was not out cold, he had enough of his barring to skate, find the player who hit him and smash him in the face. And from my concussion, physical motor control was were I struggled, so for him to be able to do what he did physically he was not that far out of it. Plus this is his 8th suspension, 2nd of at least 25 games in less than a calendar year. This man needs to leave the game for his own good, and if he can get mentally well then he can come back. But I am not the comish, just a guy who loves hockey, unlike the comish apparently, seeing as he is trying to turn hockey into B-ball on ice!

I am done asking for the refs to make the right calls, it is just not going to happen, however they really really need to start calling the games consistently, right, wrong, indifferent I don't care just make them consistently!!!!!!!!

Cut it out, it is the holidays and you are giving me nightmares, I will take the coal instead thank you!

Later GS&T have a great holiday season!

The team's record is what, their overall ranking in the NHL, Western Conference, Central Division is what. Sammy is not a top 6 forward, but due to the make of up this team he is a necessary piece at a top 6 spot. I would really like to see him play 3rd line, but the biggest worry there is ruining the chemistry that your 3rd line has right now. Babcock is one of the quickest coach to show some one the door to the dog house. Apparently Sammy does something, and provides something that Babs believes this team needs on the second line. And I will take his opinion over yours, ahh thank you very much! He has played 32 games this year. He has a limited offensive upside and plays decent defense. He is on pace for 9g 30a 39pts +14, and if he hits a hot streak he could actually hit 15g, unlikely but could happen. This guy provides more tangibles than Downey, yet most of you cream your shorts when Downey is in the line up and burn a Babcock doll in effigy when he isn't. He is going to play important minutes, he will eat up some power play minutes in a key spot. And did some one say Lebda should be on the pp. At the beginning of the year half of this board wanted him elsewhere and Kindl starting. Some of you want Kovalev, are you serious this guy takes more plays off than Randy Moss. He single handedly cost them playoff games by trying to embellish a call. Ryder, what makes you think that his 3g 7a 10pts -5 is going to be any more than what Sammy does. You people just aren't happy unless you are complaining about some one being lazy and sucking. At least pick a player to trade for that is doing something more than Sammy. s*** I am not a Sammy slappy but seriously, you want to trade him for a guy who is producing less. I am so glad you guys are not running this team. You guys ***** that he shoots too much, when was the last game he took more than 4 shots? You do realize that Z is leading the league is shots taken right? So by your logic that Sammy shoots too much, what does Zetterberg do? Oh but that is right, he can shoot as much as he likes because he scores, but oh wait how is anyone supposed to score without shooting? Williams was bitched about relentlessly, Lang (who btw played damn well here), Sammy, Lilja, etc. Guess what there will inevitably be a player on this team that you do not like there style, but if that player is producing at least ***** about his play and not say "He can't pass". Please like anyone of you could go out there on a sheet of ice with Sammy and do any of the s*** he could. I am so tired of these bench, trade, hang from the gallow's pole, threads about Sammy. I know I will start a bench Aaron Downey thread and that way all of you will be too busy freaking out in that thread to start any more bench Sammy, Lilja sucks, Bring back ___ (insert former wing past his prime), who's better Ozzie or Hasek, etc. etc. threads. This team is playing great hockey as a unit, there is no need to make a trade, especially if it means breaking up chemistry just to say you made a trade. Again Sammy makes 1.2 a year Ryder is making 2.95 and IS PRODUCING LESS, this team has 5.45 mil (according to NHL Numbers) and they may or may not use that, but it should be for a sure fire top 6 forward, not a player like Sammy who makes twice as much. And I know the reply already, oh but as soon as Ryder, Kovalev, whomever else you want gets to the D they will be the reincarnation of Brendan Shanahan. You people amaze(or amuse) me, Have a good Holiday thought!!

Do you watch NHL hockey, at all, or just the highlights that are on NHL.com. Stanley cups have been won based on the trap, NJ Devils. Ever hear of them, no! This discussion is useless if you are going to pretend to be ignorant about things. Or if you are truly ignorant about the facts then please don't state things as the absolute truth if you are posting things that are obviously not the truth. BTW: definition of ignorance is lack of knowledge so please don't take that as an insult. Edit: Also if you have ever had the chance to watch the Wings on national television, do you know why the announcers make such a big deal about how much puck possession hockey the wings play? Because they are probably the only team in the league that from D to Forward plays puck possession. Most teams cannot or simply chose not to play that style. If you also will notice, playing that style has the wings as one of the teams that gets the most blocked shots. Look at last years WCF, how many shots did the ducks block.

imisssergei, I see you point about being stupid, Boulerice cross checking a guy in the face is far and a way worse than what Simon did, and for Boulerice this was his second such stick to the face incident and I was calling for a lifetime ban for him. Simon I see this as being a season ending suspension, again not so much because of the act itself, that was potentially career ending. If Ruutuu slips or moves without Simon knowing it, he may be looking to stomp on a boot, and end up slicing a guys tendon up for dinner. But this was a culmination suspension, if he hadn't been suspended 7 times prior, first time act, I think 15-20 games would be legit. The biggest problem is that Simon has been on the ice for 26 games after a 25 game suspension. Using past history to make an inference that means this time he will be back 31-33 games before he does it again. (I know he may never do this again) If you were suspended from you job, school, where ever whatever you do, for 25 days without pay, if you did a similar act a second, not 8th time, what do you think would happen to you. (Not you specifically you imisssergei this is more of a general statement)

Thanks for having my back in the logic department. I thought it was a pretty easy conclusion to make, bigger pads means the goalie covers more area, meaning he has to do less work to make saves. I don't think either of us said it would be easy, or that the goalies these days are less talented. MY argument was if they are more talented why give them bigger pads. If they have learned better and more effective style, keep the pads the same, why enlarge them? But apparently to some that statement means that any one could play goal with larger equipment. Not only is the O-zone in Euro hockey smaller, but larger Ice surfaces are More conducive to the trap system. If you have more ice to cover (in Euro this would be the whole sheet not one zone) the easiest way to protect your net is collapse, play a zone, trap, whatever you want to call it. Give up the deep perimeter shot, which gives the goalie with bigger pads the ability to step out of the crease a little and (by using physics we come up with this part) take away almost all of the net, because by playing the angle and with bigger pads the goalie can take away more of the net. But it is like trying to tell people that a 38 year old Feds is not going help this team out, or bringing back D-mac will not help this team out, or that trading Sammy, a first rounder, and Kindl will not get this team Lecavelier. Some times it is easier to beat my head off of my keyboard!!

I will try to make this quick as my work day is unwinding and it is time to go drinking: Your argument can be destroyed in 4 easy points, but thanks for playing our game! 1. There is no denying that the pads are a lot bigger. Having said that it is a simple matter of physics. If the pads are wider they cover more area. If they cover more area, there is less area to shoot at. There is no arguing that it is a simple matter of science. 2. I agree that defense and goaltender style of play has changed dramatically, that doesn't change the fact that if you have bigger pads you are covering more area. In fact it is an argument to support smaller pads. If the goalies and Defenses are playing a style that creates less opportunities, when an opportunity does present itself smaller goalie pads would also allow for the player to see more net. Example, how many players score in a shootout with a shot on the ice that doesn't go 5-hole, Z comes to mind with his copy cat move of Forsberg's stamp. Think of it this way, little leaguers use aluminum bats because they aren't as good as older players, as they get older the equipment they use does less of the work for them. In the NHL if goalies had less pads, they would have to play even better. So if they are playing better than the goalies in the old days, why give them bigger pads, which logically gives them an advantage. 3. Making the rink bigger would not allow for Ovechkin and those guys to blow by anyone, because there would be more surface area, the skater would actually have to cover more ground than the defender, while the skater is 30-40 wide of the net, the defenseman would be able to skate down the middle of the ice and take up the slot. And seeing as the player with the puck would have to go wider, thus skating a greater distance, they would be at a disadvantage. Where as if the rink were smaller it would force the defenseman to skate better, or try to body up a guy in the neutral zone. Thus allowing a guy like Ovechkin to skate around or in his case through most defenders. I might add with less work because he is covering less ground. This is not a matter of physics this my friend is a matter of geometry. 5. As to your last point I have always thought it should be like the quarterback rule in football, once he steps across the line of scrimmage (out of the crease in this case) he would become fair game! Remember the 7:30 show is never they same as the 9:30 show, don't forget to tip your wait staff.

I think that is the biggest issue right there wingslogo! The league should also force players who do this type of crap multiple times to take anger management or under go some sort of evaluation to help the player. While I think he needs a severe suspension, I think what should be more important is his overall mental health.

I disagree and think that you are overlooking how severe his actions were, swinging a stick into some one's face and getting suspended for 25 games only to attempt to stomp some one's Achilles out with a razor sharp skate blade less than a year later shows that he learned nothing from his first suspension and 5 more games will do nothing. Thirty games is a lot of time, so wasn't 25. But what good is a suspension if the player doesn't learn from it. BTW half of his salary is $237,500, that means he is still owed $237,500 for the rest of the year. Yeah I feel bad for him, he only gets to make almost 5 times what I make in a year, ohhh poor soul. We should start a fund for him! He has shown that he can no longer play hockey with aggression, rather should no longer play with aggression, because as he plays that way he can not control himself. On the other hand this is Chris Simon, if he doesn't play that way no one would sign him.

Like I said in my post, I didn't know the measurements, the point to my post was not the actual dimensions it was the theory that a smaller rink as opposed to a largerr rink would help scoring. Edit: was a little cranky when I wrote the first reply!

And at the same time their D has gotten weaker and thinner!!

Damn you and your infinite wisdom EVA where were you when I was making this s*** up!!!

I don't think that was a long enough suspension and if he appeals it they should make it 60 games!!! He is starting to show signs that bad things are going on in his head and he apparently learned nothing from a 25 game suspension, what in the hell are 5 more games going to teach him. Suspend him for the season with no pay!!! If you walked up to a co worker and punched him in the face do you think your boss would listen to your side of the story, especially if the act was caught on camera. Granted punching is allowed in hockey but trying to decapitate some one and trying to perform an achillies -ectomy on another player are horrible acts and need to be treated as such. The more I have thought about it the more I think he has lost the PRIVILEGE of playing professional hockey!

The only "new" Rules that I like are going back to touch up offsides and the two line pass. Other than that it has all been Bulls***!!

I heard an interesting comment made on a local sports station. I think it was Bob Ryan (from Around the Horn fame for most of you) mentioned that the lack of scoring may be because the rinks have become so big that it has limited the goal scoring. For instance the old garden was something like 100' by 60' can't remember the exact measurements, and now the rinks are 200 by forever. His argument was that in the smaller rinks if a player turned the puck over, the other team could turn around and be in the Offensive zone well before the D got set up. I think they need to stop tinkering with the rinks and the lines and rules and jerseys and skates. What they need to do is worry about pads. Goalie and skater pads. Shrink goalie pads and soften up players pads, get rid of that hard shelled gear the players are wearing that makes them nearly invincible and when a hit is delivered the results are far more severe. No matter what they do with the rink, how they change the lines, any of that crap, some coach will come up with a way to play a zone, trap, or some other type of D to stop the flow of the game. What is next a 3 second key in front of the net like in basket ball that no one O or D can stand in for more than 3 seconds. Stop ******* with the game, you are making it harder for casual fans to follow the game, those are the fans that the league/sport need!!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=3160690 Apparently Bertuzzi testified it was Crawford ordered hit!! In a related story the Corleone family has hired Marc Crawford to coach the Corleone Family youth Hockey Team!

I got to say I was one of the most vocal posters for separating the ZDH line, I honestly didn't think the secondary scoring would be there. However, Huds, flip, cleary, and others have really stepped up and allowed Babs to leave that line intact. Oh and BTW I like my crow BBQ style!

Well according to urban legend... A man from Mexico was on a trip to Sweden when he stopped in to see a game called Pee Wee hockey, being from Mexico he had no idea what hockey was and was a little confused by the word Pee Wee. So he decided that inside a building would be warmer than the cold temps outside and went into the arena to watch what was happening. He was so impressed by this youngster wearing the #5 that when he got back to Mexico he started telling Don Quixote type fables about this amazing kid running around on the ice with metal attached to his Zapatos (spanish for shoe). As his stories grew and became more Grandiose. His family and friends began to spread the word of El Cinco de Hielo or 5 of the ice. Well it just so happened that this gentleman and his family started taking the 5th of every month off to celebrate. Well his jefe, boss, got pissed and in May of one year he said listen, you can only celebrate this once a year,no more monthly celebrations. So the man decided, since it was only May 2nd, to choose May as the month, and that was how Cinco De Mayo was born!!! Edit: spelling!

The look on Robert's face after that fight was priceless, like he saying, "Son, Please, If you're going to come with that weak s*** you might as well go home." then he ***** slapped him and called him Suzie. Whoops I made that last part up!