Opie

You do realize it is only funny because it is true! LOL

Thank you very much! That clears it all up, not being from Canada, but having a fan's interest in Stevie Y, I was curious if they did this often or not.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_ylt=AlqF...p&type=lgns Is this typical? If not why not Yzerman?

Damn you that was my post! Seriously though no slight to Huds, but he would probably be injured how Lids, Dats, and Z are still standing is beyond me at this point in time! WTF with all the injuries!

This was my take as well, seems you put it if far fewer words though!

Alright Doc for the sake of the App I am developing and the fact you are one of my fav posters here I will give. But I am not making strawman arguments, you have blatantly stated what J-ho will and will not be, and in multiple threads, yet others who do the same are dillusional. No one in this thread here was saying he was Vezina worthy, One poster said the Wings gave the Blues too many good scoring chances and Howard kept the team in the game, your retort is he did what was needed. If the team won 3-1, sure. They lost 1-0 and it easily could have been 2 or 3. You don't think so fine. He kept them in the game (along with Murray's constant line changes) if that is your idea of a goalie doing what is needed, I hate to see your idea of a really good goaltender, 15-20 SO a season, GAA under 1.2, SV% .989? I find it funny how your argument is exactly the same as the people saying he will be a Vezina candidate, but because your prognosis is not so rosy you are right! So I guess: I am convinced you are right and J-ho will be a very average goaltender for his career.

And after not denying all of those things all you can come up with is: Was I the one who said he was a Vezina Candidate, NOPE! What I have said all year is the following: I am a huge J-ho fan. Howard is playing better than Ozzie. Howard is a rookie and is getting better game in and game out. The Wings need the vet ready for Playoffs, I do not want to ride a rookie, unless hot as all hell, into the postseason. And to those that have tried to anoint him the next Roy or Richter I say the same things I have said to you. Wait to make those decisions! This team doesn't just need him to make saves, they are relying on him to keep them in games. He is not doing what is needed, he is keeping them in games, and in the case of the NYR game was the best player on the team, and again last night he was. How Z got second star from some reporters is beyond me. The offense is inept, his GAA is better than half of the starters in the league, he has shown great athleticism, and patients, horrible rebound control, and it seems like he is trying to meet the puck half way instead of letting it come to him. Not talking about position but more about the way the puck hits him. Like a reciever in football who is fighting to catch the ball. (Not sure that made any sense to anyone but me) But what got me to post in response to you and GMR, was the fact that to me your statement of : Was that it wreaks of some one who is trying to tell everyone else that he is just average. IF that was not your intention I appologize. However it looks like you are just as bad as the people trashing Bert or Dats in every thread they get a chance. Because your posts always seem to try to bring people to your understanding of Howard, Another BTW: Who in this thread said he was HOF or Vezina bound, or even Calder bound? EDIT: I wasn't trying to insinuate that you though Howard lost the game, I was giving my impression of that goal and his play. So if the wings win 3-2 and Eaves has a hat trick was he just doing what the team needed of him?

You are right he is another Raycroft in the making and you have him pegged all along, good for you. You win and internet cookie.

I am not offended but: Is not an accurate description of his play, the Blues could have easily scored more than 1 last night. But again, I am sure, you meant as a compliment! EDIT: BTW, in the other thread you were not stating: You said what he will or will not be in the future, not at his current play he is x. Your original comment was stated as a known fact, and had zero reference to his current level of play. And I never said Howard will be anything, I have stuck to commenting on his current level of play, because to state what a player will be while in the start of their rookie season would be dumb. I thought Pav Bure would be an automatic HOF bid, injuries may have changed that. And his current level of play is better than average, is better than decent. He is working his way up the stat ladder pretty quickly and after a bad bad start to the season. And in some instances is the only reason the Wings are in games, NYR game anyone remember that one, I mean it was so long ago!

So in last night's game Howard was just doing what was expected of him? Because I am pretty sure that is what Doc said, I am sorry I saw a goalie give up one goal on a play were he was trying to save the point shot (which became a pass) which he could not see due to the 2 wings and one blue standing right in front of him. He was down when the pass was received down low, wide open net, GOAL (somehow the Wings would have hit the post though). Other than that, he was very good last night, IMO, much more than decent, was he stellar, no, was he very good to great, imo yes. Even though the Blues were more intent on line matching and defense, Howard kept the Wings in that game on multiple occassions. And oddly enough the Wings have needed that badly. But that is my opinion and that is what created my thought for the first response, that and Doc so vehemently posting what Howard will and won't be in the future. Now, is he an All-star, no, he is all world, no, but he is keeping the Wings in games right now. That is much better than the start of the season, hence this thread.

GMR forgive Doc he is currently refusing to give any credit to Howard for anything.

I believe Markov wanted 4mil + a year for atleast 2 years. And seeing as he ended up in the KHL, I don't think anyone was giving him what he wanted. I think he was one of those Russians that really valued playing in his home country, he went there before it became the thing to do. They gave him an offer and I think he was either going to break the bank in the NHL or go to KHL. His stubbornness to take any kind of discount from anyone, shows his intents from the beginning.

Carman, Because you label one post serious doesn't make the others less trollish. What is your point in all of this crap? You may call it sarcasm, but you are baiting people into arguments that are obviously meant to derail the thread and turn it into a dats ***** fest. Why are some posters given such leniency and others held to such a strict code of posting? Back on topic: The whole team was meh last night. They showed signs of putting it together and right at the moment I thought they would be able to get it going, some one passes to the vacated point, or makes a dumb blind pass through the slot that has our forwards going towards the net and the puck and the other team going the other direction.

Well why is Yzerman GM for the Olympic games but not worlds??

What is Kraft Dinner? Nevermind Google rocks!

That May line was straight out of the movies. Say with a bit of an Arnold accent!

Jump off a bridge. No, no seriously. The Wings will either make the playoffs as a 5-8 seed (5 being moderately high hopes, 3 being ideal and really high hopes, 1st in the west meaning I have changed from Weed to Herion), or they will just miss and have craptastic picks. I just don't see them managing to get a good pick. Not that they would use it, they would probably trade it for 2 lower picks.

WHOA!! SORRY I just re-read your original post and I mistook your post for another when I went on that diatribe!!!!!!! SORRY! Original Post Below, so as to show the asshat I really am! My reaction was to your point about the threads bashing players were a better idea to you, that to me made me think you would rather bash them then root for them. Therefore my response was to that train of thought. If you meant something else by your statement then I stand corrected. I exaggerated, sure but what is the internet for if not exaggeration.

This is where you lost me, they don't have a s*** ton of wiggle room, at the deadline Fil, Williams, Mule, Kronwall could all be back. Then their salary is back on the cap and no more LTIR cap space. Unless I am missing some fundamental part of the LTIR that means the cap space goes forward?

Like I said in the post you quoted, no more lunatic fringe, only logical posters are around right now. I agree with everything you just said, I just think maybe it is a character builder, we won't know. The returning players could make them more skilled and therefore a better team, or when the players return the work ethic will be contagious. Neither of us will ever know. Like you said the D is the savior right now, the offensive players returning, Fil and Williams (I personally have low expectations of what Mule will be bringing to the table, after coming back so quickly), could fill a void, if anything the second PP will get lots better, especially with a healthy Kronwall. And I don't expect a cup either, I don't expect one every year, I just expect the Wings to be top 6 in the league (at the start of the year, injuries and other factors temper my expectations), right now I am hoping for a playoff spot and after that anything is possible! Last year with Hossa I expected WCF, this year I expect playoff birth. Next year my expectations go up like the Wings cap space though!

I believe if you look back to last year the slot scoring was coming from Hossa and Mule. Other than Z right now, I do not believe the Wings have a player with the shot for a slot player right now. Hudler had a sneaky wrister and that might have been helpful, but he didn't have the body to get in the slot. Also if you look at a lot of the D played against the Wings, the slot is usually a pig pile of Homer and 3 opposing team players. Another reason why a lot of Ralf's tip-able shots are not making it to guys in front of the net. To me it appears that the last couple of years instead of beating the Wings up some teams have gone to clogging the slot on them instead, especially during the PP!

Warning I am not a "Wings win the cup or they suck fan", as long as the Wings are still competitive and don't strive to hit the cap floor, I will not *****. I expect my teams in all sports to make the post season, anything less is a failure, if they are the top seed and lose to the 8 I am ok, would I be happier with a cup, sure but I understand that with the cap in place Islander/Oiler dominance will not happen again, and the Wings are the closest we will ever see to that in the cap era. You are right being 6 points out of first place in the division and 3rd overall in thedivision before the all star break with 5 key injuries is a horrble spot to be, we should all go around trashing the players and give up on the season! But lets say I am stubborn and don't want to, here are somethings I take solace in! Right now points wise (which is all that matters btw) the wings are 10 points out of first in the West and 6 from the worst spot. Sure they are closer to the bottom, but they are still in the thick of it. With a win, flat out win no splits, the Wings could move from 9th to 7th in the division, another win (while those in front lose) and they are tied for 6th and 2 points away from 3rd in the conference. So while you go around saying the Wings suck and bash players, I am going to look at it like this. They are in the hunt for the playoffs, with 5 key injuries and the lose of a lot of goals from last year, they have a rookie in net, The D is being pasted together, Datsyuk is colder than ice right now, Bert is struggling, they have a top line and 3 lines made up of mostly bottom 6 guys. I say hell it could be a lot worse, but I am an optimist so to me, I always think my team will pull it out until the end when they cannot! OH and BTW where did ANA start the playoffs last year? And who was a tougher WC foe than the Ducks? And besides one s***ty year in 20 does not mean the team sucks and is pathetic, the Dead Wings sucked and were pathetic.

I agree with you to an extent and then I agree with Jake Ryan. A win is a win, a loss is a loss except when it happens in ot or in a shootout. Then thanks to the crappy split point rule it is either a win or it is a point. The NHL has changed the loss being a loss. To you or I as a fan a loss may be a loss, because our team didn't win. But in the eyes of the NHL standings a loss in OT or shootout is no longer a loss, as a loss gets you 0 points. Therefore if the Wings are actually getting points and not winning, I don't know what to call it a Wiss, a lon? Either way it is more points than a loss. So like Jake said, 33 points out of 58 total is better than .500 hockey. The problem with this theory is .500 has less to due with the standings than GF or GA. Win % is a measure of nothing in the new NHL. Points are all that matter anymore so therefore earning more than 50% of the points has now become the equivalent of being over .500. Confused? I am! Can we get back to 2 for a W and 0 for a loss, any loss, OT or Shoot out or Regulation, loss is a loss is 0 points! How many years did we as Wings fans complain about teams like Dallas that made the playoffs due to the split point rule? It happens every year, why not the Wings this year.

Ahhh Shanny!!!! Gotta love it! Revenge, Shanahan Style!

Seriously? That would be good news! Where did you hear this? I haven't seen much on Fil, more info on Mule is available than flip, not that I am questioning you, I hope you are right!