Opie

It was the correct call, but because he was no where near where he should be, it was a bad call due to his being out of position. Had he been behind the net where he was supposed to be, this is not a problem. Still no conspiracy though! Officiating has been bad, but better than I have seen it in the past. My feeling on the Cleary goal, it was a little bit of an equalizer, because it was so bang bang it is hard to call interference, especially when all Hiller did was stand up. Had he been moving towards the save (note not the puck, just to make a save) then the contact with Cleary probably gets called. All in all, good series, bad to very bad officiating though!

?? Me? or some one in the clips?

http://redwings.nhl.tv/team/console

Having the last change means you get to see who the other coach puts out for his line and you have the last change to match it. So if you watched games 1, 2, & 5 (not sure where you live if you were able to watch or stream the games) Carlyle was making a lot of hand gestures before the drop of the puck. He was communicating to his team what he wanted the line to do based on a face off win or loss. When in ANA for games 3-4, he had the last change so he always had the match up he wanted on the ice, he saw who Babs was going with and then sent out who he thinks best matches up. In Det he has to wait for play to start and his guys to get the opportunity to change. That is why you saw a lot of face of wins for the ducks go back to their zone and reset in Det. Hope that helped not made you more confused!

Bare with the timing issue of this post and all of the uncertainties within this statement, however.... I was thinking if the Wings have to trade Flip to fit in Hossa, what a great center for the Mule Hossa line!!! Mule Helm Hossa, wow and you thought the forecheck of that line was good now!!! Now Flip can definitely create more with the puck on his stick, but Helm's speed and tenacity would go a long way!

Yeah because that was exactly what the poster was suggesting! I think Holland plays it the same way he did last year, he lined all of his ducks up in a neat little row, in order of his preference. First he got Z taken care of, then Mule, next will come Hossa and that will decide the whole thing. Hudler, Sammy, Leino are all dependent on what Hossa does and to a certain extent same with Flip. Flip is one of the peices that other teams would want that actually can be traded, Cleary, Stuart with NTCs. I would not be surprised to see the Wings lose one of Helm or Leino. Draper and Maltby are not going anywhere soon. Sammy is all but gone, Lebda is all but gone, Kopecky (IMO should be all but gone) is up in the air, Maltby I would love to see hang them up, doubt it happens and didn't he sign after 35 anyways? In order to keep Hossa the Wings would need to shed atleast Sammy, Hudler, Kopecky, Lebda, Conk, Flip moneywise. This would also make room for Helm and Leino as well as potentially Abdelkader (although I see him being the next Helm, in the A until he can't be! Either way this is a very tough decision, either Holland has to be willing to live with 0 cap space for years and the probability that it goes down, a ballsy move. OR Hossa would have to take a tremendous pay cut and put winning above all else. I mean it is not like the guy is living paycheck to pay check trying to make ends meet, but at the same time you cannot blame a guy for taking 8-9 mil a yearif some one wants to throw it at him.

I stand corrected! I have never seen anyone pull that move off and not get called though, I have seen guys try it and get called offsides!

Offsides, he cannot enter the zone before the puck regardless of control or not, the puck must enter first, seen it happen, player tries to keep a puck on his stick while making a move around the D, both of his feet enter the zone before the puck, play is blown dead.

I think depth is what is killing the ducks, not their players being PeeWee level talent. The Ducks have 2.33 (maybe .66 with Christensen in the lineup) forward lines and 2.5 D-pairings. They had a lot of guys logging a lot of ice time early in the series. With Wiz out one game the D had to log a lot of extra minutes. I think Getzlaf is dog tired, I think that first line blew their wad (so to speak) in the first game and a half. They were not only playing great O but very very good D, it appears as though the legs that usually feed the wolf are spent. Getzlaf's legs aren't all there for whatever reason, Perry ringing wristers high glove on Osgood (while successful multiple times) is the only weapon he has right now. Teemu is Teemu, he will be fast and have opportunities. The D is tired in my opinion, Neids made what looked to be mentally tired plays yesterday. All of the great neutral play the Ducks had is gone, they are not picking off Detroit's outlet passes any more and that is proving very dangerous. Ana is not going as hard into the corners and tough spots. That is not to say they are not going into those spots with all that they have left in the tank, but no team in the league rolls 4 lines at you the way Detroit does, in a 7 game series that wears on you, especially if your team is really only 2 lines deep. I think Carlyle switching up lines was him trying to get guys with some legs left in them on lines with Perry, Getzlaf, and Teemu. However I think Getzlaf (whom has been going all out all postseason) is completely spent, maybe a day or two off help him out, but his legs look burnt out. Pahlsson, imo, is the thing the ducks are desperately missing! The defense and secondary scoring that he provided would have gone a long way, and may have extended them to a third line. Duckguy if you hit this thread what are your thoughts?

Light in the box is out of everything non Soccer, not sure if some sort of license thing came up or what but they are out of everything, but soccer!

Wiz being back would change things dramatically but I agree with the Depth which was my point from the start, although I called 5 games, I think 6 will do, especially if Wiz is out long. Their D depth is roughly 5 with healthy wiz. I think the new lines will help D and Z as well as Hossa. D and Z will go back to what they did last post season, familiar and like your favorite house shoes. They know you, they can pick your day up, they always fit just right. Look at last night, D and Z both had many opportunities, I don't think the Ducks want to live by D and Z hitting posts and Hiller making great saves on them all night. I think they would much rather face a struggling D on one line and a defensive minded Z on another. Now also the ducks can't camp Marchant on D and Hossa, Z and D can easily defend the Getzlaf line to the same result Z, Cleary, and Mule were. And that second line is too much for any line the Ducks have. Mule and Hossa can and will use their bodies to get great postion, and the results we saw last night will be seen again. Hossa and Mule are a way better combo than Homer and Hossa, Mule can do so much that him with Hossa, and a play maker like fil, is just awesome to watch. Remember last year when Fil Sammy Mule was one of the best lines, Fil and Mule are great together and add Hossa instead of Sammy, well do I really need to eloborate on how much better Hossa is! Their forecheck is MEAN, and that is what made that second line so great last post season! But most important, Z and D have what seems to be unbreakable chemistry and I think can put both of them in a groove. Wiz being out and Babs line changes made for what seemed like a very mismatched game. Carlyle is great at adjustments, look how he handles last line change when in Det. I would expect to see changes again, but with Wiz out he is playing 4 d-men all night, and if Kop wants to get smashed in the face to take out one of those 4, the PK for the Ducks will tire out the other 3, which will wear them thin after that, mad props to kop!. I am not saying the Wings win the next 2 (3 in a row) for sure, but what kind of fan would I be if I were predicting my team to lose!

No one can resist when White Goodman puts on his shiny shoes.

I think had this been the winning goal instead of tying I think there would be less backlash, same to be said if the Wings are down 2 and net this one, I think because it was the last gasp effort and it tied the game the importance and backlash are both magnified. I think at too many levels Refs are allowed to referee too long. Like the athletes in the NHL the refs should also be in their prime, all sports for that matter. For the reasons you mentioned the game is too fast for most 40 year olds let alone guys reffing into their 50-60. I don't want to hear about ageism unless you are saying Yzerman, Hullie, and every other player besides Cheli and Howe is ageism as well. The players have a short career length, why should the refs have an unlimited one. Age will slow reaction time and thus lead to being out of position thus leading to bad or mistaken calls. Now as for this goal age had nothing to do with it, he was just flat out in the wrong position and made the correct (albeit horrible) call! Had he been behind the net, or on top of it like many officials do, he would not have blown it dead, he couldn't have. As far as the Stuart hit, I blame that on the "The Ducks are so dirty we can't call all of them, and we need to make the game look even call some on the other team" theory. BTW insert whatever name in the place of Ducks you want, Flyers, Shaq, etc...

LOL best and most effective comeback on this board in a while! And hilarity did ensue. Hey if cheli can play at 47 who is to say Vlad the impaler wouldn't still be playing!

Umm sir you need to familiarize yourself with something called Flawed logic. If the Wings win (and your a wings fan) it was the Wings, however there is no way in hell the Wings would ever lose without the other team cheating or the refs screwing over the Wings. Otherwise the Wings would go 98-0 and win 10-0 each game. Why only 10 you ask, the league would have to implement a 10 goal mercy rule!! [/sarcasm]

OOPS, what an asshat!!

That would be awesome games 3-4-6 45 minutes from my house!!! No 10:30 starts!

Bolded = Abdelkader imo!

I have to assume that a Ana/Van vs Carolina/Was/Pit would garner about the same ratings as ANA v. OTT got. And the SC parade would probably be about 10,000 again! The only thing saving the league with these matchups would be Pit or Was due to the faces of AO, Crosby, Malkin. But those series will bore me to death, I watch games 1 & 2 of ANA and OTT, then turned the series off, it held very little interest for me, and I am an avid fan!

Oddly enough for me he is a tie with Stuart for being the #2 defenseman, as far as what I have seen them bring, Kronwall being 4th then Lebda and Cheli being tied for playing like 7th d-men. Lids has been Lids, Ralf is being missed, Stuart is playing better than last year IMO, and Ericsson is a beast. Kronwall looks tired to me, don't know why he just looks bogged down. Lebda looks worse than I have seen him in a while, that third pairing seems to be out of place a lot, and if you go back to last year Cheli and Lebda don't exactly seem to communicate very well. I really look forward to Big Rig and Lids being side by side for the rest of Lids' career, then Ralf and Kronwall or Stuart, but I doubt that will happen that way!

When talking Thornton's return value to the B's how do you equate the cap space that made room for Savard/Chara? *Note The B's thought Thornton was going to ask for the Moon and stars when he was a UFA. I wouldn't say the B's got nothing for him, but they got about as close to nothing as you could get. They turned Thornton into: W. Primeau B. Stuart M. Sturm Turned B. Stuart into A. Ference C. Kobasew Leaving room for Savard. Having said that in the year Thornton got traded he was playing Hart Caliber hockey, and in return you get the three listed above. IF... The B's were in 9th place again would we be saying the same things? IF the Sharks make it to the second round (like last year) and the B's are on the outside looking in (like last year) are we saying the same things.

Not to be the posting police in this thread, but he said after Lids retires, so therefore Lids would no longer factor into his equation!

I would go like this, however I am not a hockey coach let alone one of Babs' standing: Hossa, Dats, Zetterberg, Kronwall, Stuart make Ana Match up against this line Then Mule, Cleary, Flip, Lids, Ericsson very responsible defensive line to match up with Ana line 1. Hudler, Helm, Holmer/Leino line 3 Maltby, Kopecky, Sammy/Holmer line 4 D-pairing 3 Lebda Cheli My reasons. 1. Holmstrom is actually (IMO) helping the ducks, all they want is bodies in front of Hiller and then let Hiller take up as much net as he can and then clear the net. What the Wings need now is driving to the net not standing in front of it, quick flashes through Hiller's vision, and the team needs to pass across the crease find an open guy on the opposite side of the net, wait for Hiller to over commit (as is his tendency, hence rebound control issues) and look for the open net or guy. 2. Detroit needs an offensive line that Ana is afraid of, right now Marchant's line is handling Dats line because Holmer is out of place, I have never seen him look so nervous with puck. I have seen him multiple times with the puck on his stick, forehand, backhand, forehand, backhand all within 3 seconds, all while standing still in the corner and no one near him. The top line right now needs to be a bigger threat. 3. I put Stuart and Kronwall with the first pairing because Lids and Ericsson will be matched up with Getzlaf's line. 4. ANA is short D-men, even if Wis is healthy they only really play 5 guys. Make them play D, tire them out in their zone. Easier said than done. 5.As much of a Sammy supporter as I have been, both He and Holmer are at a loss against a team like Ana, well maybe loss is the wrong word. Ana wants Sammy to shoot all the time, they want everyone to shoot all of the time,e specially once they are set up in their little nest around the net, he is feeding into their plan, same with Holmer he is creating another blocker in front of Hiller not a screen. Hiller doesn't care if he sees the puck 100 % clean, if he knows where the shot is coming from he will make himself big at that angle. Holmer is acting as another ANA D man, why do you think they decided to leave him alone at the net last game! EDIT: I would switch Sammy or Holmer for Leino for this series only, the skill set the two provide is counter productive for this series. Just my $0.02

I do believe you left Ericsson off of your list, which may have been intentional I am not sure! But I am 99.4% sure Ericsson will be on the roster.