Opie

I didn't think of your statement as another wing could do the job Flip did, I took it as Richards took Malkin out, and to be honest I thought more than just you and NN thought that when I first posted! So I guess to that point I just was blind to the fact that was a possibility. I think Hossa will want to stay, will his wallet want to stay, I am not sure. The guy is on a tear, if he keeps this up he COULD be in line for some hardware at the end of the season. I am not saying he wins the Hart, but he is a beast this year and COULD end up in contention for the Rocket Richard. I don't think Hossa has ever been on a team that is this good all around, sure the team goes through mental lapses, but it is a parallel universe to the one I am watching with the Celtic's. One night they destroy a contender like Detroit, only to barely eek out a win against Charlotte or Philly (Injured Philly not healthy at that). I see the same things with the Wings, one difference the C's do not have a Marian Hossa type guy going out night in and night out. One night it is Pierce, Allen, Or KG then another the next. With the Wings it is Hossa and one or two others almost every night (Lilja has been in that category a lot). That is why I have more confidence in the Wings through their struggles. They are not that far behind SJ, and a little ways behind Boston for best records, living in the Boston area, they are bound to tank a week or so worth of games, trust me it is coming. IF not, then this is not my father's Bruins!!!

Check this s*** out: from the horses mouth, take your speculated injuries and the words from Malkin's mouth and decide which you believe. Puck Daddy: Malkin:

Just thought it was funny, I do believe though that the stories on Yahoo and SI were published after your thread!!!!

A> I never quoted you, nor did I single anyone out in my post. The only names referred to or mentioned were Flip, Malkin, Richards, not NN, not you. You assumed it was directed at you. Just because my post went below yours does not me I was directly referring to you, it means I was the first to post after you. B> You may not be familiar with the Jon Lovitz joke at the end of that post, I attribute that to you thinking I was serious with the pylon statement. It should have signaled over exaggeration as that character was known on the show(SNL) as the Liar, he ended all of his exaggerated lies with the statement "Yeah, that's the ticket!" any who, my statement was not that you believed a pylon could do it, it is called sarcasm, some might even say I was being facetious. C> Whether Malkin was 100% or not is meaningless, no one was 100% at that point in the season, Flip shut him down, if he was a mere shadow of himself health wise A) Why would he be on the roster, B)I never heard any reports about Malkin having any confirmed injuries. You are devaluing what Flip did because Malkin had a boo boo or had a serious injury, neither you nor I know the extent of his injuries or can even confirm he was injured at all, what if he was 92% is that an accomplishment for Flip, 85%, 65% where do we draw the line, because if we want to speculate, I speculate he was at about 98.6% physically in that series. BEWARE THAT WAS SARCASM! Mentally, I think, after game 2 he was at about 40%. I didn't say (as you stated I didn't give my opinion, should have) he could shut down a 100% Malkin, we don't know that because we have never seen him try. What we do know is that as a team the Red Wings (Which was my point not that Flip could do it) shut down most of the Pens that series, with some of the best team D the league has seen in the new era. I don't think Z shut down Crosby, I think the team did. Hockey above all sports can not be taken over by one player. One player can take you to heights unattainable with your old roster, but will not get you to the cup. Even the Pens with the "Next One" needed Malkin and Crosby two top 20 players in the game to get him there. I agree 100% with your statement it wasn't Fil, but you disregard him like he had nothing to do with it, switch him and Bobby Lang and see if Malkin still struggles or has to wait until game 6 to score. If the hit was so bad and he was so hurt where was the press release like Big Ben had, where was the "I played with Broken ribs and couldn't be myself." This guy was under a lot of fire for under producing in the series, yet he never says I was 80%, or I had a serious injury (RIBS) that prevented me from being at my best! Call me an eternal optimist or Homer which ever you see fit, but I tend to believe that in that series Malkin was shutdown, as opposed to being so injured he was rendered incompetent which is countered by the fact he scored within 15 seconds of the hit, and not a slick little wrister that wouldn't involve much rib movement, but instead wound up and unleashed a slap shot (lots of mid body movement) from the low slot. Ever injure your ribs, I have, breathing hurts like a bastard (I know you argument is adrenaline)! I agree the best thing for the Wings (If you are in the keep Hossa frame of mind) is if Hudler is offered a sheet. That way the Wings don't have to go the Quincey route. My only hesitation would be does Hudler warrant an offer sheet, in regards to do other teams think he has the assets to give him an inflated offer? Before this season I would say NO! After his very very good year I think Yes. I think a lot of GM's see him as a great piece to add. Not that he will be Joe Thornton, but if he were on the Wing of a guy like Thornton (I don't think he will end up in SJ, just an example.) or put him along side a guy like Nash he would produce. The only question like you said is, would he then be worth the 4-5 million dollar risk. (I put money not you). As much as others are over valuing Flip in your opinion it is my opinion that you underrate his defense and just attribute it to an injured opponent.

Is GS&T big Wysh!! Yahoo linky! OR is he Sarah Kwak??? SI Linky OR James Mirtle?? The Rink Linky We may never know!!

So, even though he scored directly after that hit, that hit is the only reason he was not successful against the Wings? REALLY? The team he was playing against that shut down his whole team except one player (Marian Hossa, maybe Crosby wasn't shut down but he wasn't himself). Right, that one hit, in which he scored what 12 seconds later, is the reason he was invisible in the SCF and had the Wings put a pylon on the ice he still couldn't have scored, Yeah that's the ticket! (In my best Jon Lovitz)

Re: bolded: Why?

NOT ARGUING WITH YOU JUST SAYING! Got that out of the way early: They agreed to a deal with Lids that he would be the highest paid Red Wing which easily could have cost them Z and Dats, had they decided they wanted money. You are right, I have no clue if this was said, done, or even brought up, it is just a hunch/sneaking suspicion I have!

A) Have you seen some of the rosters around the league????? B) Having two people who are without a doubt a step behind the game, is not going to help him. Even if he were the best grinder the game has ever seen what can he do when his line mates are out of position? This is not basketball, one player can not win the game (or even a shift) on his own. I am not saying he is the best ever or even that he is the best option, but with no cap room and a month left until the TD the Wings have to evaluate what they have for this year's push and for the upcoming years. If Kopecky is sent down he in all likelihood will be lost to waivers. You may not think so but the Wings think he is worth more than being lost to waivers. When Stuart comes back, the team will have no leverage against the cap to do anything and will need to know where they stand and what they have. They may see that Leino, Abdelkader, Helm, Hartigan or whomever has more value to them and then let Kopecky go to Waivers if no one wants him in trade and then bring up one of the others to take his place. They may trade flip and waive Kopecky and then bring up Leino and Abdelkader. Who knows. Unfortunately with the signing of Hossa, Stuart, and Flip this offseason the team has no cap space, which also means no way to evaluate talent that is in the AHL other than to let them play in the AHL. C) I never compared Boyd and Kopecky. The fact that Meech has been getting time for Maltby and Kopecky is a sign of the value and long term goals the team has for these two players. The problem is that if they bring up Leino for Kopecky and 2 weeks later realize it was a grave mistake, too late, he is gone from waivers. The freedom to experiment with the lines on this team is very limited this season. They pretty much have the 22 players and that is it! BTW: Before I take you assessment of players as the word of Hockey can I see your Player development/Scouting resume! (You state your opinion like it is fact, I don't really know you from other posters who post their opinion as fact or others who post their opinion as opinion. But since you didn't say it was your opinion it comes off as though it is a fact.)

Good point! That combo yielded two Selke candidates. I just think that some how part of the agreement to get Hossa here was he would always have one of the two on his line. Maybe not, but I also think he is a wasted talent without one of the two on his line. Flip is not going to give him passes that no one sees coming, the other guys are (imo) just not going to give him the opportunity offensively that either Dats or Z would. And Dats and Z have already proven they can create for guys like Franzen, Hudler, and Sammy. Edit: I know I went back to offense, but I don't think Hossa's D is the first thing that people think of when they think Marian Hossa, not to take anything away from his D play.

There is also the theory of not putting all of one's eggs in one basket. IF you put those three on one line,now you have one power house line, that will be played by the best defensive line of the other team. IF you separate them the other team is forced to defend the 2nd line like it is another 1st line. Where as the all in one basket theory gives the team one 1st line to stop and a decent second line. Spreading out your offense like this is what makes having this many superstars worth wild, it allows you to spread your offense, unlike OTT, who has on paper one of the fiercest lines in the NHL (When healthy) how is that line doing now?

I think it depends on the game situation, it looked like during the 5 min major that Babs used 4-5 if not more combos on the PK. I think it would also depend on what line just got off of the ice and who is in the box. But I thought Hossa was out there with Dats after the face off and zone being cleared. For instance (hypothetical based not on real line ups) if Franzen sits in the bin for 2 and his pk partner is usually Hossa, for chemistry sake you may not want to throw Hossa out with Draper. Speaking of the 5 min major, did anyone else notice how Draper took all (Most is probably a better term) of the own zone face offs, and then once the PK cleared the zone he hopped over the boards? Babs is thinking during these games, he is not going through the motions. Which makes me wonder even more why people 2nd guess his line combos and roster moves.

He is not paid to score, he is not being paid to make the 4th line work. He is a young player, who is on a line with guys who have lost a step. People want to blame Kopecky (not you Echolia obviously), but all he is doing is going out and grinding, it is not like Dats and Z or Hossa are on his line and he is not producing. But there always has to be a whipping boy on this team, even on the all-star 02 team Boyd the Void got ragged on incessantly. Him or Dandy either one. The team is in 3rd place in the entire league, can you imagine what this team would be doing if they lived up to every posters hopes, dreams, desires, wants, or whatever other term you want. They would go 98-0 each year!!!

46 GP 12 g 20a 32pts 32 pim Say good bye to those stats while you bring in an unproven rookie who is having a hard time back checking!

Worst Case scenario they play Stuart on the 2nd pp point which messes up the righty/lefty, or if Cheli is still around he used to be a very solid PP point.

The NFL cap is proven to be the best in the major sports, following it is a good idea for any league thinking of using a cap. The goal of a cap is to create parity, so you can have a Superbowl (championship) like this past one. Where regardless of record (because in the NFL, on any given Sunday, anyone but the Lions can win) the game will be closely contested and create high interest, not just in the one game but the league. The problem lies with ownership not the league on this one. If Nashville wanted to be successful they would live a little higher off of the floor than currently, it is their fault they are not more competitive. Same with the Lions, it is not the cap or parity's fault they went 0-fer, that is the orgs fault for not evaluating talent better. A team like the Wings, proven astute eye for talent (deeper in the draft and FA) will always be near the top, same for the Steelers, Colts, and Patriots. The ORG values winning (or at least sees winning as a better way to create revenue) more than they do the money currently in pocket. In any league/industry you are going to have people that use the system to THEIR advantage. With no cap the Wings used the system to put together an all star roster and win a cup. In the new NHL Nashville is taking advantage of the situation by getting money from other teams to help them pay for their team. I do however agree with, and really like, the idea of being able to keep you drafted players at a lower % cap hit!!!

This! Versus' angle only showed the last half second of that hit, where is the center ice or opposite ice feed? I thought AO deserved at least a game for his hit earlier in the year, but I could make that judgment because I could see the whole 5-8 seconds before contact. This is a bang bang replay and you don't see Lilja until Backes starts sliding down boards. Insufficient evidence!

Somewhere in these three quotes you will find your answer. Not all of us want to spend $150 because the lettering and numbering is exact. Some of us would rather spend $150 on 5 Jersey (including Shipping and handling) and have the lettering and numbering be a little off. For me I just want to be able to walk around NH in a Wings Jersey and the $150 my folks shelled out for my Dats X-mas gift Jersey was a hell of a lot more than I would have spent, but then again I bought myself 5 jerseys (Zetterberg, KG, Lawrence Maroney, Ronaldo, Dice K) from LITB for less than the $150 they spent. The Jersey look different up close, from 10-15 feet away to me they look the same, like a Red Wings Jersey.

Didn't get to watch last night's game, how did Downey look? Any fisticuffs?

Your reading comprehension could use some help. The first part you bolded and enlarged is true, in my opinion, the Wings need a Drake not Downey, having said that again, how does that equate to me saying Downey would never get called up. The second part you forgot to read the sentence before which states: However things have changed, what has changed is cap space, created by LTIR of Stuart. WHAT IS SO HARD TO COMPREHEND!?????!?!?!?!? Therefore more than Meech in or out can now happen, due to MORE CAP SPACE!! You ask Heaton not to post towards you like a novice, yet you post like one. If you understand the cap space issue why even post about Holland being a sleep by not calling him up. YOU think he has more value than Kopecky and Maltby (I agree somewhat, not as wholeheartedly as you) but Holland and Co do not. SO therefore, until cap space became free (Stuart LTIR) the only change you would see is Meech in or Meech Out. My statement still stands, but because change has been made the point is no longer moot.

Go ahead dig away, find a thread or a post where I said he would never get called up, and where my explanation for it wasn't cap based. Have fun digging, I was the biggest anti-Downey on this board for a while, that has changed. My opinion of his value had nothing to do with why he wasn't being called up. IT WAS CAP BASED. So please do find where I said Downey would never make the roster, because I was anti Downey!

YOU PROVED NOTHING!!! Stuart went on LTIR which for the time he is on frees up his cap space, which allowed Holland to call up Downey. IF Stuart does not go on LTIR, Holland is still unable to call anyone up. How was I proven wrong?????? I never said Downey was a waste of space (well maybe his first pre season in Det, but I have since changed my stance) what I always stated was that Holland could not call up you, me or even GS&T (known to throw knuckles) if he wanted to, he had no room!!! Again how were you proven right and I wrong, maybe some one else you were arguing with, but not me. Blaming Holland or calling him a sleep for not calling up Downey when he in fact does not have the ability to do so, and then continuing to post crap like that when people tell you otherwise is trolling, you are refusing the facts and making up your own s*** as you go!!

It will be funny to see a full bench tonight!! LOL I am excited to see Leino, and I think Downey has lingered in the A long enough he definitely deserves some time up (He paid his dues last year) if anyone is going to get called up. It would be nice to see some others this season as well, but with the recent history, Downey could be real handy tonight.

You're right Holland Dropped the ball, the salary cap and Stuart's LTIR have nothing to due with it!! How is it you are allowed to post on this board and not get banned for trolling?

Worst case scenario, Draft pick compensation!