Opie

DAAAAAA NEW GUY!! Hossa, one simple reason, Datsyuk. Zetterberg and Dats will be right there for points. Z will score and will also set up a lot with Franzen, Hudler, Cleary, Sammy whomever is on that line will benefit greatly from Z and Z will get a lot of points but he will get almost 50-50 (%'s not #'s) goals and assists around 85 points. Dats will have 85 or so points as well with 65 or so assists and anywhere from 20-30 goals. Hossa will have about 50 goals, Yes dats and Homer will help him that much, with Dats ability to control the puck and shield it away from defenders, Homers screen, Hossa will have a lot of good looks at the net. I think the person who's stats suffer the most in the deal is Homer, he won't get as many goals on the PP because I think Babs will undoubtedly try out Z, Dats, Hossa. I mean how can he not want to try it out. But this is all speculation, pure speculation!

http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=53032 First page man, come on just a peek down the first page list would help in the future!

I know athletes say things all of the time and it is just canon fodder for the media, but I really believe this guy wants to stay here, comments like or Make me think he would like to stay long term. I know I know but the Wings could lose Z or Mule, you know what if the Wings can fit Z and Hossa under the cap, I will remorsefully, yet with a big grin (because Hossa will be in a Winged Wheel long term), wave good bye to Mule. Hossa >>>> Mule, if it comes down to the 2 of them Hossa wins every time. And that is not intended to be a slam on Mule at all, I have mad respect for what Mule does, but he is not Marian Hossa, and to tell you the truth very few players are!

Come on, every one loves a good fart/poop joke!

I am always talkative in real life and "internet life", my posts are more often than not too long and overstate my point. I appreciate the critique of my posts I will not keep that in mind in the future, but you have yet to answer my questions, instead (like most internet debaters who spew forth opinion) you continue to try to blame me for jumping down your throat or ranting or flying off of the handle, but you cleverly avoid the questions so it looks like you won the debate. Guess what on the internet there really is no winning or losing a debate there is just walking away from it. Either you defend your position or you don't, the debate will go on or it will end, but either way there is very rarely ever a winner on the internet. (Bad, bad, bad, cheesy joke). BTW, to me, jumping down your throat would constitute me getting amped up enough by this discussion to yell, swear, etc. However in this case (even though it may appear I am) I am not worked up over this, I just pointed out that you were (IMO) wrong about saying he shoots horribly horribly wrong, my rant that followed may have been unnecessary, but what is really necessary about a discussion board other than it gives me something to do in the down time at work.

The thing is Datsyuk does look sort of like lurch, Cheli is old, Hasek playing the puck is an adventure, what you didn't say was Hasek plays the puck horribly horribly wrong. I didn't jump down your throat and I don't need to calm down and ranting is you perception so I can't argue that one. You made a post, I disagreed with it and I told you why. I am not pounding my fist off of my desk or kicking my dog around because you posted. I simply stated that his shot is not horribly horribly wrong. The difference with Sammy and the "jokes" you mentioned were that the ones you mention in your last post appeared in jest. The Sammy jokes have gone from an exaggeration of his weaknesses (like your examples) to a full on belief on this board that he sucks and can not do a damned thing. I didn't go back and read all of your posts about Sammy, no need, you made the one saying he shoots horribly, horribly wrong. I questioned how he shoots horribly horribly wrong, His grip, wrong stick, facing the wrong direction, skates on backwards. Missing the net is not shooting horribly horribly wrong. If you had said he can't hit the broad side of a barn I would have shut my fingers, as it is on the internet, and went about my way. However, it is common place on this board to dog on certain players, that have been adopted as the whipping boy, and blow their weaknesses out of proportion. Again I ask you, if he shoots so horribly horribly wrong how does he score more than so many other players in the league? How is it that the Stanley Cup Champions relied on him for scoring? This is the internet were freedom of speech is truly freedom of speech, but don't think that because you have the freedom of speech I am not going to comment on you choice of words. You want me to let it go because it was a joke, well ok, what in that post said Just kidding or a little exaggeration, or /sarcasm. Nothing, therefore I took the post at face value, and assumed I was talking to just another Sammy basher. I was wrong, easy fix just say you were kidding around and didn't mean it. Then I would say, well hard to tell but sorry. But when you post: And then in the same exact post merely a couple of sentences later you expect this : to make me say oh yeah just a joke, yeah because those post have joke written all over them. If that is your idea of joke delivery, you must not be very funny. Are you like my uncle tell old stale jokes that aren't funny and wonder why no one is laughing, he also tells really old jokes that were funny about a year or two ago. The two of you should hang out you would have each other in stitches. Nice guy, a little bit of a loud close talker when he drinks though, so you may want to keep him sober.

Maltby can barely find the puck when it is on his own stick!

Yes I have seen his shooting percentage, and Yes I can deny he needs a soccer net to shoot at, how else do you describe him scoring goals! Oh that is right he is dependent on his teammates, everyone else made the play happen his stick just happened to be in the way. /sarcasm I have also seen his coach (An ELITE NHL coach; with 3 consecutive 50+ wins seasons , back to back wcf's, SC champ) say that he is a great player. Now I may not praise him like Babs did, however I also will not deny his skill set. Sorry for "Going off on you" but the bashing is dumb, it is a forum wide bashing that isn't funny, it is old, just like the Crysby jokes people make. A joke is usually funny only for a certain period of time, then it gets old as hell. Once you have heard or read the joke 50 times it usually gets real ******* old. BTW how did you feel about Sammy when he was accomplishing unprecedented events in the SCF? Did he need a soccer net then? Were you on here making jokes then? No because, in humor, timing is everything. And now that a few months have passed since the cup, everyone forgets what Sammy did in the post season, and it is back to ragging on him. At least 2 goals in the Avs series alone that Mule scored were a direct result of Sammy forechecking, and on one of them his horribly, horribly wrong inaccurate shot led to an assist for him, and then in that same series there was the power play assist he got with his horribly horribly wrong shot, that was tipped in by Mule. Do you know what makes jokes even funnier, WHEN THEY ARE TRUE! I thought after the cup I would be able to stop posting the following, however it has made the board seem even more spoiled and I have to write it more often: Root for the front of the jersey, it makes things a lot more enjoyable, that way when you start to cheer for a player you don't have to worry about cheering for the guy you hate/dislike/like to make fun of. But in the end it is you who has to decide which is more fun for you, making fun of someone who you couldn't hold his jock if you tried, or rooting for the whole team. I could care less but in an internet forum I will tell you what I think of your posts, just like you will tell me what you think of mine.

Well saying he has poor shot selection is decidedly different from saying his shooting is horribly, horribly wrong. BTW the evaluation of his shot is your opinion, and others base their opinions off of their own expectations. Then again you would probably have to defend your opinion to Babs as well, which would be funny: "Excuse me, uhhh umm, MR. Babcock, um I think Mikael Samuelsson has a horrible shot and should be traded for a bag of ummm, uhhh pucks, thank you sir, uhhhhh I will go now!" Wrong denotes that some part of activity is done wrong, his aim may be off or "Wrong" but if his shooting is horribly horribly wrong how in the hell did he end up in the NHL to begin with, how does he outscore so many other NHLers? With a horribly wrong shot you would think every time he winds up he would fall on his face. His shot is not horribly wrong, he has either a) poor shot selection b) bad aim or c) is everyone's favorite whipping boy even though he did more to help this team win a cup than I would venture 6-8 other forwards did. But why is it that in every thread on here he is the only one people feel the need to bash? Oh sorry the new guy is Cheli, everyone is dogging on him too. (Which I have defended as well). I am not Sammy's biggest fan, in fact I was one of the first people saying he was trade able this year due to other players joining the team or raising their level of play. However I am usually the first to his defense. The guy is a very solid NHLer, his coach is telling him to shoot, what more do you want from the guy, oh wait what you want from him means nothing. I guess I found a little more strength to the Lilja arguments because at least people had an event to grab onto, although I defended him too, but the only thing people can hang on Sammy is that they personally expected more from him, well until you are a Wings' coach or staff member you expectations mean jack s***! And now here comes the "It is an internet forum and I can say what I want" well so can I and if I think your bashing of a player is unfounded I will let you know, and then when you prove to me (with something besides your opinion) I will admit you were right and I was wrong. I do it often because I unlike most of this board make mistakes, and own up to them. (not aimed at you GMR). What I find the funniest is that for a brief moment I thought that winning the cup would be celebrated for more than 2 days on this board. After that, it was back to Lilja sucks, Sammy is a retard, Cheli is horrible. No wonder people call Wings fans spoiled, because for the most part that is exactly how we act! With all of these atrocious players that must mean that Z-Dats-Lids must be hockey gods to carry this team with all of the slugs.

That is world Champion Sammy! How does some one go about shooting wrong, does he have a lefty stick? Does he back hand when he should forehand? does he have his hands in opposite order (Lefty grip righty shot). People really need to grow up and move beyond the whipping boy thing, seriously, the guy was a pivotal part of winning the cup, yet some how he shoots horribly wrong. If you hate the guy, hate him, but don't make s*** up.

Three Words Brett Hull's Mouth! Can you imagine being Gretzky, at that point in time he was the greatest player to ever touch the ice, and there he has Brett Hull yapping in his ear telling him how and when and where he wants the puck. How many times do you think Gretz had to say, "HULL, shut the f*** up, do you know who I am, and for Christ's sake are you building a dam out there stop tapping the beaver tail, I will find you, I am the great one!"

My comment had nothing to do with anyone's level of play, his comment was about paying someone 850k who was invisible or abysmal (said by a pro hockey scout, oh wait) yet, he had no complaint about paying almost Lilja 2x as much even though Cheli had to be invisible or abysmal in order for Lilja to play. I can see it already this years whipping boys are shaping up to be Huds, Flip, Cheli (in his 40 or so games) and Lebda. Cheli didn't get paid because of what he is going to do this year, he is getting paid for what he did for the wings in years past, it is called respect, the wings show a lot of it to their older players, like Maltby, Draper, Cheli they may over pay for their services now, but that is because for so long they were underpaying for their services. This team as a whole including Cheli, Lebda, Sammy, Downey, D-mac, Hank, Dats, all of the team, just won the cup. Yet people on this board aren't just happy with winning, no, oh no no no, their "GUY" has to be on the ice for a certain amount of time or a guy they hate should be traded away for a bag of pucks. People really should start rooting for the name/logo on the front not the name on the back of the jersey it really makes the whole experience more enjoyable! EDIT: Sorry swiss fan that rant was not aimed at you, although when reading it, it sounds like I am telling you what to do or saying you root against certain guys, that was not my intention!

What about Lilja, he just got about 2x that and the only reason he played in the post season was Stuart seeing his child born and Chelios being injured?

The only problem with that move is that leaves line 3 with no real bona fide center. So maybe the switch code send Huds back to line 4 and put Draper on line 3. I am sure at some point in time that situation would happen. These lines could be different every game and still dominate.

Wasn't it Babs who said, during the SCF, one of the reasons the Wings lost was because he had Dats and Z out there too much and that the guys were trying to hard. The next game he managed their minutes better, they played more within their game, instead of trying so hard, and then the wings won. The top 2 lines will see almost identical TOI, with the 3rd seeing not quite 2nd line minutes and the 4th line playing a little more than a fourth line would. Lines 1 and 2 will see less than a real 1st would see but more than 2nd line minutes. This team will be very similar to the 03 team in that the top 2 lines are really 2 number 1s and that the 3rd line is really a number 2 (Weren't Dats, z, and Hull on third line).

This post would make a lot more sense if Zetterberg or Dats didn't carry themselves as the ultimate Stevie Y/Lids clones, in the fact that the most important thing to them is hoisting the cup at the end of the day. The athletes who put team accomplishments ahead of personal rewards are becoming rarer and rarer. Look at the Olympics, Misty May refuses to vote on any individual awards in regular VB play, only votes for team awards and refuses to accept individual awards. Hank was so happy to win the cup, that he appear unimpressed by the Conn Smythe. Dats' shyness may lead to his lack of wanting individual awards but he too seems awkward around individual awards, look how often he defers credit to Hank. Whether it be a sweet set up or his ability to speak a little better English or even be more comfortable in press conferences. The last person I expect to be upset on this team about a player coming in and "taking his spot" (Which Hossa isn't doing) would be Hank, followed closely (Probably a tie) by Dats, Lids, Draper! This is what makes the Wings the WINGS! Players sacrifice something to be on this TEAM, whether it be money, stats, ice time, recognition, etc. What ever it may be they are here for the end goal, team wins. If along the way they pick up some individual reward (Bonuses, endorsements, Conn Smythe, Lady Bing, Selke) then so be it. But that is just one man's opinion!

That was my point the poster before me said something about your post not being logical, and I pointed out that logic is a tricky word. Nothing personal man, I too was just having a little fun in yet another line combo thread.

Logic is a tricky word, if it makes logical sense to him, his argument is therefore logical. However, is it realistic in this organization (don't confuse that with all of the NHL), one thing to keep in mind is why did Hudler drop that far down in the draft. Size, I would start Hudler over D-mac but that doesn't mean I am right just sane! I kid GMR with the sane part, he and I have gone around the toughness merry-go-round so many times!

You haven't spent much time in conversation with GMR, the answer to your question is quite simply toughness, size, and grit. GMR, did I leave anything out?

OUCH!

Yawn! Can someone get a new joke, the only thing you left off was that Sid would whine about it until Bettman made it happen.

Milan Lucic, mark my words this kid was just coming into his own as the playoffs hit, he may struggle the first couple of weeks, but if he plays with Savard this kid could legitimately have 30g 50+ pts and about 10 fights! If he plays with Kessel he could get 20g 40 pts and about 15 fights (Kessel will get rocked around and Lucic will have his back). Next year will be his career year, the year he really makes people say WOW!!! He just turned 20, I expect big things from this kid, eventually he will be the premier power forward in the league!

Plus the PA would s*** bricks!

How could you forget the best part, man I guess I can let it go this time, at least you didn't say the best thing about them was Chara!

Why is it when WAS gets a bench minor AO is the first person in the box to serve it? Now that may just be bad coaching, but he can hit, he can score, he can create offense, but he cannot play D and one of my criteria for best player would be an all around game. Now having said that, there is no way I put an all around guy like Cleary ahead of AO, because AO's offense is so freakishly good that in a comparison in order to overtake him as #1 the player would also have to have a freakishly good skill and also be more well rounded. Careful this is laden with my opinion, and I am not calling anyone else's opinion wrong 1. Lids - D, PP, PK, 5-5, 5-3, 3-5 this guy does it all at the highest level. 2. Z - D, PP, PK, 5-5, 5-3, 3-5, face offs, set up man, shooter, creater, stickhandling 3. Dats - D, PP, 5-5, Face offs, Stickhandling, set up man, shooter, creater PK (not used a lot but in the post season showed he is great there) *Call me a homer, I am fine with that, but looking at my criteria who in the league has a better all around game than those 3, maybe Iginla, maybe Thornton.* 4. Iginla - D, PP, Hits, shooter, creater, tough sob, does the things it takes to carry a team on his back, If some one wanted him in my top 3 over the others (except Lids) I can see that easily! Does everything for his team 5. Ovechkin - PP (#1 PP weapon in the league in my book), 5-5, great shoot, great creativity, underrated set up man, Like I said his freakish abilities on offense make up for his lack of D, don't get me wrong the kid plays D, he is not a cherry picker, but he is not a shutdown forward like the three above him. 6. Thornton - D, PP, shooter, creater, tough sob, Similar to Iginla there are nights when this is the only guy who shows up on his team, he makes All-Stars out of Cheechoo and Michalek, NUFF SAID! What separates him from Iginla is Iginla hits more and will throw down if needed. 7. Crosby, PP, PK(solid not great, but solid), 5-5, 5-3, great playmaker, decent shot, underrated one timer, When (not if) this kid gets his defensive legs under him he will vault to #1 no doubt in my mind, the only question would be if AO brings his D game along then their would be a tie for 1 in my book.