Free_Candy

Thanks Det. #1 fan. A lot of that's my fault because I had a "WTF" moment earlier in the thread but should have just left it alone. I really don't blame Heatley for wanting a trade at all. Look at Jarkko, the place made him lose his marbles for good and he started biting people.

Regarding another thread where someone asked if the Pens could be like the Oilers: That is my opinion on the matter.

Are you sure you don't have me mixed up with someone else? Because I don't hold the opinion that the pens are new Oilers or necessarily a dynasty at all.

Or maybe you just read a bit too much into things and have a biased viewpoint because you obviously really hate the Penguins. I'm not going to discuss it further with you.

Never, ever have I said the Pens are the new dynasty of hockey. I have heard they were in talks with Guerin and Feds, haven't heard anything about Scuds.

You are exactly right about New York. They need offense, and Sather always seems to put out big contracts like that and could see them doing it for Heatley.

I'm going to take that with a grain of salt as not many Wings fans really gave the Pens much of a chance this year and people told us they were all garbage at playing hockey besides Crosby and Malkin to begin with, but you still have a right to your opinion and I'll respect it. I'm not going to let this get hijacked into a Wings/Pens debate and I think it's still too early to tell right now anyway. So um, how about that Heatley. I still say Rangers.

Um, wow, I'm not sure what that has to do with what I said. But I'll leave it at that.

Well it was nice of you to put us in the playoffs at least.

Fair enough. Sorry. Anyway...we can't afford him. I could see the Rangers putting out a big wad for him.

Oh wow, yeah I'm sure the Penguins are just choking up about it. I know I sure am. I guess if it makes you feel better.

Hey it's cool -- some Pens fans feel Malkin is a better player as well. I haven't really decided yet, myself. They both bring different things to the team and I am fine with either doing well. I don't really argue with Ovechkin being the league MVP though, because he carries the Caps moreso than Crosby or Malkin does the Penguins. I actually agree that while there is more animosity between Wings/Pens, it isn't nearly the same level of rivalry that you guys have with the Ducks, or we have with the Flyers and Capitals. I think the Cup finals are also a pretty special thing to just be a part of so the competition just feels different than at a conference or division level. Anyway yeah I think the protectiveness has a lot to do with the fact that he gets so much attention, both good and bad. A lot of pressure has been put on Crosby from Pittsburgh's standpoint as far as what he's been expected to do for the club in a way that Malkin hasn't, so I guess that makes fans want to be protective of him from the outside. But I also think there's an automatic response programmed into our Penguin minds when someone brings up whether or not Malkin or Ovechkin is better because quite often, it's prefaced with the phrase "I hate Crosby!" or "Crosby sucks!" (I mean, I guess a player that is potentially better makes another one "suck"? ) So that's possibly another reason why we get jumpy about it. If someone like yourself is just offering an objective opinion and just talking strictly hockey rather than trash talking, I suppose people should just learn that they aren't out to "get Crosby" should not take it so personally. I would like to see Malkin get more recognition for his game, but he actually doesn't care much for the spotlight and prefers being under the radar. The only problem is he's doing an awful lot in his game to make that less likely. :-)

93 Penguins!

With regards to LGP, I don't think the Penguins are exactly all that popular with some posters on here, either. Penguins fans hate of Detroit is only fairly recent, and it isn't just about how Crosby performs (or is shut down) against them, there's a lot more to it than that. Directly vying for the Cup two years in a row has changed a lot of things. (I knew a lot of Pens fans in the 90s that loved Detroit, especially when they swept Washington in 1998.) :-) But we definitely are very protective of Crosby in general. There's a lot of backlash that goes our way about Crosby for whatever reasons, but I think it probably bothers the fans more than it does Crosby himself. I think a lot of the complaints about whatever individual recognition Crosby doesn't get (all star, etc) has a lot to do with the "who is the league's best" pissing contest that goes on, which only means so much when hockey is a team sport. And you're right, I don't think Crosby is losing sleep over it.

The 4th seed for Pittsburgh is pretty misleading and they were better than what that indicates. A lot of teams in the east "barely" made the playoffs because the race was so tight. We had lost Gonchar for much of the season due to shoulder injury. He quarterbacks our power play and is one of the most valuble players on our team. I don't think a lot of people outside of Pittsburgh realize how much losing him hurt us. We also had one of our worst franchise years ever for number of man games lost to injury this season. It's all pretty strange because they did have one of their best starts in franchise history that fall. Therrien wasn't a bad coach for them when they were younger a couple of years ago. He was good at fundamentals and whipping them into shape but they just tuned him out after a while. A lot of players hated his trap system and Bylsma's system suits them much better. So no, the Penguins didn't just plow through the year like Washington and Boston but by no means are they an inferior team. I don't know who will be back for the finals. Too early to say at this point. It's not something I'd bet money on myself, but Detroit and Pittsburgh back again within the next couple of years wouldn't shock me in the slightest.

Let's not paint all Penguin fans with one brush stroke. I could care less if there are Red Wings fans that are not mad. I'd rather discuss hockey with a fan that's not upset than a fan that's still blind with anger and howling about losing. I think as far as what you might come across on the internet, we tend to notice negativity or sentiments that we don't like a little more. It's a lot easier to remember a post that gets you riled up and angry. As for any of the crap that Wings fans might be getting from Penguins fans, a lot of it is backlash. Let's not forget that Penguins fans were also on the receiving end of a lot of crap from Red Wings fans all last year. We got laughed at and jobbed for losing in the finals, and laughed at over Hossa bailing. Wings fans also invaded some of the Penguins boards last year and caused problems. Now, I'm not saying "it's your fault!" ...because every fanbase has fans that do this. But generally, hockey fans aren't ones to turn the other cheek. Trash talk really isn't my thing unless it's with really good friends because we know each other well enough to both know that it's not mean spirited and all in good fun. I think making fun of cities is stupid. Penguins and Flyers fans do it all the time, but it just seems dumb because it has nothing to do with hockey or other sports. (I do laugh at jokes about Rocky being Philadelphia's only winner in the last quarter century up until the Phillies, though.) Making fun of an economic situation should be off limits. As I mentioned elsewhere, I am self-employed and this recession really hit my business very hard and now I'm trying to look for a job working for someone else, with no success yet. It's just been a very scary year. I tend to think people that laugh about things like that somewhere down the road end up getting laid off. (Makes me think of a depressing song by the Smiths, "That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore") As for next year, I think Boston is built a little better than the Capitals at this point, but there's still two deadlines for teams to get structured before the next playoffs. I'd laugh if it was some random Cinderella team out of the East in the finals next year that nobody's really talking about all that much right now.

I'm not going to get into debates about any players in specific. I think perceptions of players can change depending on whether or not they are on your team, which is part of being a hockey fan -- and I'm not going to come on here and try to expound the virtues of whatever Penguin players people don't like when the finals have just ended. I just took issue with comments like that, especially considering guys like Gonchar. Anyway, I'm the last person who would make fun of Detroit's economic problems. I'm self-employed, this recession has really hurt my business and I've decided to close up shop and am trying to look for a job. This year has been truly awful.

Double post

Say whatever you people want about Penguin fans, I'm sorry if some aren't winning with class, but our players are not gutless cowards. They played their hearts out. Sergei Gonchar played the rest of the playoffs with a torn MCL from the knee on knee hit he had with Ovechkin. This was his third appearance in the finals in his career, he is a veteran warrior and I was glad to finally see him raise a Cup. He is anything but the definition of a gutless coward.

It's only been a week and that's only what's been made public. You don't want to know what Max Talbot will do but it will presumably involve copious amounts of women and God knows what else.

I'm a Pens fan but I'll go on the record and say the Red Wings were always my favorite out west. Which has kind of made the last couple of years (and possibly the next few) a bit awkward. I'm also partial to some of the Canadian teams, their fans just live and breathe hockey so much and I would like to see Winnipeg get a team back.

The SI Cover doesn't help, and you have to start wondering about what happens to the team that wins the Winter Classic. There's just some really bizarre things that seem to go on with Classic and Cup finals when the Conklin Effect is in play.

No. I have a theory that it really takes the s*** to hit the fan for a team to muster up the emotional drive to even go back-to-back in this day and age. Last time this happened, we lost Badger and the Wings had Konstantinov's accident. The Pens franchise has really turned things around into something very positive that players buy into, and we have a good farm team -- so we probably won't fall apart and I have optimism for our future but by no means will there be a dynasty. Sorry to be another Pens fan invading your board, I do follow what goes on with Detroit, have lurked here a long time and really mean no ill will and wanted to jump in on some relevant discussions at hand so thanks for listening.

I have no problem with the league giving the spotlight to some of the other players. As much as I have hated the Islanders for years and always will, I hope Tavares does very well for them and gets some of his own media attention. I would love to see the Rangers/Islanders rivalry alive and well again as well. That doesn't mean he's not a homer. This is the same guy who thought Trottier was better than Gretzky. You are free to nod your head in agreement with this old timer if it makes you feel better, he's entertaining in a Don Cherry sort of way but I don't think his assessment on the matter is exactly objective.

Good point. I think the perspective can change things quite a bit. It's all good.