Scott Stevens

Everytime I watch him, he seems to do pretty well. And he seems to display a pretty good skill level. Why is this guy getting scratched all the time? He must be a lockerroom problem / not work hard enough or something. Anybody have any dirt on this guy? There must be something about him off the ice that's causing him to not be a regular on the ice.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id=8460743#&navid=nhl-keymatch 14 games, 1 goal and 4 assists for Tomas Holmstrom. http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id=8460743#&navid=nhl-keymatch 11 games, 1 goal and 2 assists for Todd Bertuzzi. I can't believe people will post "What's wrong with Datsyuk" and "What's up with Zetterberg" threads all day long and leave these two WASTES OF SPACE alone. Bertuzzi and Holmstrom are the biggest problem cases on the Red Wings right now, and imo, are keeping the team from developing the players they will need to make a run in this year's playoff. They are both 5-7 years past their primes, and 2-3 years past their effectiveness limit. Why is it that these two guys, who can't open up a square inch of ice, consistently see time with our big guns and drag them down, but a guy like Helm who can open up the whole rink can't sniff a shift with Hank? To me, this is the biggest problem with the Red Wings. The GM has invested in two guys who skate like they're on one leg, and the coach isn't willing to put them in the stands. "But Homer can't be effective without a top line center." HE ISN'T EFFECTIVE PERIOD. The Red Wings need to stop pretending it's 2002. Pavel and Hank need SPEED. They aren't 21 and 23 anymore. Get them some guys who can skate and open up the ice, already.

Woh woh woh woh woh. There is WAY TOO MUCH going on here. This kind of General Management would be HIDEOUS. Let's start with the first obvious MISTAKE = Letting Lidstrom Go. Not gonna happen. This dude is nails still. Why are they going to let him retire. One more year, 5.5 million. Done. Next thing = Moss and Moen? No way. No value in those two. Wings are better off letting their younger guys fill those spots. Next thing = Why get rid of Kindl? He's good. Lastly, Suter aint going anywhere. Don't get your hopes up on him. Wings have a chance at Parise if they really want him. I don't think they need to give up Kindl, though. Tatar and Picks should work.

He's been a "Healthy Scratch" A LOT over the last 2 seasons. There's got to be something more to him not getting the playing time that other guys get. His approach to the game must be inconsistent to the approach of other Red Wings that work their ass off (Lidstrom, Helm, Datsyuk, etc.). I was just wondering if anyone knew the scoop.

It's got to be more than this.

This IS IT!!! I'm not a Holmstrom hater by any means. I just think it's time for him to step down. He's not the player he once was. He doesn't fit in the line-up ANYWHERE 5 on 5, and is not that useful on the PP. I mean, he's on pace for 5-10 goals this year. ANYONE playing 4-5 minutes of power play time with Lidstrom, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and White should be able to score 5-10 goals and 30 points. That's not good. 30-40 goals and 70-80 points is what we should have out of our 1st/2nd line wingers. Franzen is close to that. Holmstrom, Bertuzzi, and Cleary are not. I would like to see the Wings bring in Selanne and Parise, ship out Stuart, and sit Holmstrom and Bertuzzi. Mursak/Miller on rotation on the 4th line. Parise-Datsyuk-Franzen Filppula-Zetterberg-Selanne Cleary-Helm-Hudler Mursak-Abdelkader-Eaves Miller/Emmerton Lidstrom-White Kronwall-Smith Ericsson-Kindl Janik Howard Conklin The Red Wings would KILL with that line-up.

This is a good point. Fischer comes to mind. He never skated quite as well in the brief amount of time he was back after the Hartnell incident. Yzerman and Hatcher are also cases of skating ability not ever returning to what it once was after knee surgery. Yzerman compensated and learned how to play the game differently, but SILK used to be a pretty slick skater before he hurt his knee.

Crosby doens't carry the CHARISMA Wayne Gretzky had. That's why he doesn't cross over as an athlete who's well liked by Sports Fans in general. Hell, most NHL Fans don't seem to like him, except for those in Pittsburgh. Therefore, I don't really care about his return. Hockey has been the same for me with or without Sidney Crosby.

Take a good look at Selanne tonight. Smith's development is what's going to ultimately land us a right handed sniper. Stuart is expendable now with Smith showing he can hold his own. Stuart and a 1st rounder to Anaheim for Selanne.

Would anyone be UNhappy if the Red Wings replaced Holmstrom and Bertuzzi with Selanne and Parise?

I would think they'd be after our youth more than Hudler and Franzen. I think the Hemsky/Selanne/Parise/Semin bids are going to cost the Wings a Smith/Mursak/Tatar/Kindl type guy plus a couple picks.

I was going to make a thread about the trade I think is most likely to happen next, but I'll post here instead. Teemu Selanne will be a Red Wing soon, imo. This team is SCREAMING for a right handed sniper or two who can bury the puck and have decent speed. I would look for the Wings to trade Brad Stuart and a pick to Anaheim for Selanne before the beginning of the 2012. That will fill one hole. A trade deadline move could be made to get Parise or Hemsky later on, as well. Franzen-Zetterberg-Parise Filppula-Datsyuk-Selanne Hudler-Helm-Cleary Mursak-Abdelkader-Emmerton Lidstrom-White Kronwall-Smith Ericsson-Kindl Howard Conklin YES PLEASE.

Z don't care.

This is a good point. And I'm glad you recognize that it is SOMEONE ELSE'S fault that the stars on our team are struggling instead of the players. I don't blame Holmstrom and Bertuzzi for being old and slow, and I don't blame Hank and Dats for not scoring with old and slow line-mates. I blame the management of the organization. Holland and Babcock need to learn when to sit people in the stands and chew up a sunk cost. Holmstrom and Bertuzzi are playing this year when they should be sitting or playing somewhere else.

Good Call! Hopefully Ericsson too. I don't think he's quite as bad as everyone seems to think he is. Big D guys with Skates and Skillz.

Holmstrom and Bertuzzi are the best. That's why they get to play every game and Eaves gets scratched. Holmstrom and Bertuzzi are the future of the Wings. They are the best. Don't question it. If we even detect you THINKING about questioning the best-ness of Holmstrom and Bertuzzi, you will be casted out of Red Wings fandom. Just be happy we have Holmstrom and Bertuzzi and the overall awesomeness they bring to the team.

Smith is going to put Commodore out of commission.

This guy is one of the future cornerstones. Will be cool to see his first game and remember it 5 years from now when he's the anchor instead of Lidstrom.

I keep telling everyone that getting HELM up with DATSYUK would be the best thing Babcock has ever done. But for some reason, you can't break the dynamic Holmstrom/Datsyuk wonder duo up. Holmstrom is FINISHED. Why can't anyone in the Wings organization see this?

Outside of a few stretches while playing with Lidstrom, Stuart has been extremely average imo. I think this is an excellent opportunity and perfect time to unload him and not look for anything in return except the cap room. The Red Wings have a good group of young defensemen and a top 3 that are probably one of the best top 3's in the league. I really like the look of: Lidstrom/White, Kronwall/Commodore, Kindl/Ericsson, Smith next year. And if they dump Holmstrom, Hudler, Bertuzzi, and Stuart, then they gain about 9 million of cap room. I guarantee they can pull in a good defenseman like Matt Carle for 5-6 million a sesason if they want to. Brad Stuart has been consistent. That's the best attribute he's brought to this team. But it's time for him to move back home.

Finally, some logic. The only thing Cleary is a little weak at is carrying the puck. He's an excellent corner guy, has a good amount of speed, and can score 20+ goals on a second line. The OVERLY CLEAR problem is TOMAS FREAKING HOLMSTROM. It cannot be any more obvious. This guy is 5 years past his usefulness, and the only purpose he serves is to stand in front of the goalie on the power play. During 5 on 5 play, he drags down the center he plays with. He's not fast, he's not a good stick handler, and he's not a good passer. Datsyuk and Cleary are basically on the pk all game with Holmstrom on their line. For some reason though, Babcock thinks he's Mike Bossy.

When Bertuzzi and Holmstrom are gone, the top 2 lines should look a lot better. Much more pressure on the other teams than what we've seen the last 2 years.

As long as Datsyuk is paired with Holmstrom 5 on 5, he will not have a breakout unless he gets power play points. Holmstrom is an anchor 5 on 5. If the coach gets another guy on his line that can open up space for Pavs, then he will excel. Right now, he's hamstrung by a 36 year old, non-threat, slow winger. It's the next thing up from playing on the pk out there for Datsyuk.

The guy is a third line player. I don't know why everyone wants Hudler to "Blossom" or "Find his stride". The guy is a thrid liner. End of story. And a good third liner. There's nothing wrong with being a third liner on the Red Wings. That more than likely means you're a top 6 guy on 15 of the 30 teams in the league.