WingedWheel91

Here's 2 moves I would make: (I am trying to be reasonably unreasonable as I know these are far-fetched moves but they aren't impossible) -Trade Nyquist, Tatar, Dekeyser and a 1st Round Pick for Shea Weber. (I know its a lot, but we have a handful of small skilled players and it seemed to kill us in the playoffs against a much bigger, more physical team. Plus after getting fleeced for Legwand, we aren't getting Weber for anything less) -Sign Vanek ZETTERBERG - DATSYUK - MANTHA FRANZEN - HELM - VANEK PULKKINEN - SHEAHAN - JURCO ABDELKADER - GLEN/WEISS -MILLER WEBER - KRONWALL ERICSSON - SMITH SPROUL - KINDL/LASHOFF HOWARD MRAZEK Before everyone freaks out by explaining how much were giving up here, understand that Shea Weber is a top 2/3 Defenseman in the NHL - He shoots Right, is almost impossible to beat 1 on 1 and represents a physical presence we haven't seen since Brad Stuart departed. He would instantly QB both our powerplay and penalty kill and most importantly allow Ericsson to drop down the second unit. His cap hit is reasonable (considering Dion makes 7 Million annually) and brings tons of leadership to our younger players. - Vanek represents a Big + RH handed (very skilled) winger. - Promoting Mantha (a very big, pure scoring RW) to the 1ST line with D AND Z is an upgrade over Cleary, Abdelkader, Alfreddson, or Holmstrom (all players who have recently played in this spot) - Promoting Pulkkinen (a very skilled, very quick LW, with an unbelievable RH shot) to Tatars old spot on a line with Jurco and Sheahan is also an upgrade in my opinion. What do you guys think? I know both of these moves probably don't happen - but isn't that what this thread is for considering the date?

Well its a +0.25 PPG upgrade over what Jurco has produced this postseason. Sometimes a team as good as Boston will force you to play their game - a game that Bertuzzi is better suited for than Jurco.

So how does everyone feel about Todd Bertuzzi tonight? WOW - are you guys kidding me? Have you not watched or understood our offensive struggles this entire series? Between our constant turnovers, abysmal forecheck, and lack of any sort of net front presence (see our PP%) our team - for the first time in a long time - has looked VERY young. Quite simply, our roster in games 2/3 (w/o Alfreddson who does make a difference) cannot compete with the Bruins. I understand Jurco is a very quick and talented player, but quickness and talent wont translate into offensive success when your chasing the cycle around each shift. Bertuzzi immediately helps the forecheck, immediately helps the PP and most importantly provides a veteran presence to this line of youngsters. I know he is not the saviour (I think we already know who that is) but I'm wondering why people who have watched this team play all series, are upset about this change. You can't remove any of the penalty killers and you aren't taking Legwand out... I hope Bert destroys Marchand tonight and finally earns us some respect (just count the cheapshots),

AWESOME NEWS ZETTERBERG - DATSYUK - ALFIE/ABBY NYQUIST - HELM - FRANZEN TATAR - SHEAHAN - JURCO LEGWAND - GLENNY - MILLER/ABBY KRONWALL - SMITH DEKEYSER - QUINCEY OULETTE - LASHOFF

Here's what we need -> HEALTH. But also acquiring Kesler and Yandle would be good, ZETTERBERG - DATSYUK - ALFREDSSON NYQUIST - KESLER - FRANZEN TATAR - SHEAHAN - JURCO ABDELKADER - HELM - MILLER KRONWALL - ERICSSON YANDLE - DEKEYSER SMITH - LASHOFF HOWARD MRAZEK SEE YA Bertuzzi, Cleary, Legwand, Samuelsson, Quincey, Gustavsson, TRADE - Kindl, Weiss, Frk, Marchenko, Ferraro and draft picks to acquire Kesler and Yandle even though it will take more than that...

Hi Guys, I just wanted to start a thread (apologies if this topic is being talked about in a different one) to discuss line combinations for Round 1 against the Bruins. From everything I have heard, Zetterberg is hopeful for a Game 4/5 return, while Ericsson is looking at the start of Round 2. Based on the past few games, I have found it toughest to gauge where Babcock is going to put Helm. It seems logical to think that a lot of that will depend on matchups (home/away) but it seems as though him and Legwand are Interchangeable. Here is my best guess for Games 1-4. Abdelkader - Datsyuk - Alfredsson Nyquist - Legwand - Franzen Tatar - Sheahan - Jurco Miller - Helm - Glendenning Kronwall - Smith Dekesyer - Quincey Kindl - Lashoff Howard. Let me know what you guys think and how we stack up against Boston

I don't know why everyone is up in arms over this report. At the time of the trade, April 1st 2013 - the Blue traded a 1st round draft pick, 22 year old Defense prospect Mark Cundari, and 26 year old Swiss league goalie Reto Berra for Bouwmeester. In hindsight, I agree we certainly offered a better package with players who are contributing at a much higher level today - but understand that at the time of the trade, Gustav Nyquist and Tomas Tatar had combined for less than 10 points to that point in the season, on a team that was not in a playoff position. From a Calgary perspective, they probably questioned how much these undersized forwards would help them battle within their very tough division. Did Feaster take the right deal? In hindsight, obviously not. But I'm sure at the time of the trade, with the market for Defenseman as bad as it was/is, there would have been more than a handful of members on this site who would have been on board. Funny how it works.

I understand the concern but I would look at it like this - Zetterberg, Datsyuk and Alfredsson did not play last night... Based on the teams current chemistry, those 3 will become our first line when all are healthy (fingers crossed) during the playoffs. Nyquist - Legwand - Franzen who will be our second line and no longer playing against the toughest pairings/forwards on the opposing team (see Nyquist vs Chara every shift against Boston) which I cannot wait to finally see. Tatar - Sheahan - Jurco will become our third line instead of our second line and wont be counted on to score as much as they currently are - typically this type of exposure are where I believe younger players can really contribute. And finally, the best 4th line in hockey: Abdelkader - Helm - Glendenning/Miller/Andy provides unbelievable speed and 3/4 of our penalty killers. This line can be used on the road as our shutdown line or at home against the other teams 4th (however Babcock sees fit) All in all, you are not disrupting any lines, instead your basically acquiring a 1st line that consists of world class talent, who have made a career out of playing together. Add Alfredsson as a complimentary right handed shot and I honestly don't see how anyone is worrying about compromising the teams current chemistry.

I couldn't agree any more - considering its looking like we will be playing a Pittsburgh team without a healthy Malkin for the 1st round of the playoffs, a shaky goaltender and a mediocre (at best) group of defenceman. Look at these lines when Zetterberg comes back, hopefully by the end of the 1st round... ZETTERBERG - DATSYUK - ALFREDSSON NYQUIST - LEGWAND - FRANZEN TATAR - SHEAHAN - JURCO ABDELKADER - HELM - GLENDENNING/ANDERSSON KRONWALL - ERICSSON DEKEYESER - SMITH QUINCEY - KINDL HOWARD Of course this is based on having completely healthy roster (with the exception of Weiss who should rest until training camp) - but seriously who in the eastern conference can match our depth at forward? I don't like to exaggerate or get ahead of myself, but it seams only the Red Wings can go from out of the playoffs to contender in a couple of weeks. You want proof of that, take a look at last year... up 3-1 to the eventual cup champ, still stings but that could have been us (again as a 7 seed).

I apologize I didn't really clarify what expectations I based my interpretation of Kronwall as a second pairing guy were, which was a championship winning team. Yes, Kronwall would be a suitable #1 on more than half of the teams in the NHL - and maybe more, but I believe for us to truly be considered a cup favourite he's better suited with Ericsson on the second pairing. His best years I noted - were the two years we played in the Stanley Cup Final, played on the second pairing... Now this isn't to compare Yandle or whoever we could find and Dekeyser to Lidstrom and Rafalski, but I believe Kronwalls defensive inefficientcies don't match up to the best forwards in the world.

Depends on who his partner would be - but yes, based on what ive seen and what most educated analysts believe, if he played with someone like a Keith Yandle I certainly think that's a #1 pairing. If not this year, next year for sure... He has an all around game that fits with a lot of different players though.

Kronwall is not a number 1. Nor is he a number 2 - because there is no such thing as a "# 2 Defenceman". The question or thread should have asked whether is Nick a "top pairing Defenceman" which is debatable. In my opinion, the answer is no... And I say this primarily because he doesn't have the defensive instincts needed to play against the other teams top offensive line (reference his career plus minus to verify this statement). He is however, an elite second paring defenseman - as shown in his career stats, his best years were in 2007-08 and in 2008-09, where he played on the second pairing behind Lidstrom and Rafalski. Outside of 2007 where put up a plus 25 rating, he has only been better than +5 once and in the past 5 seasons COMBINED he is only managed a +5 rating. What's even more trivial to me however, is the fact the the Red Wings have had a goal differential of +137 since that time and he has had only two different defence partners in Stuart and Ericsson, who play a similar sound defensive game. Overall, I believe we are in need of an elite puck moving defenseman to play on a top line with Dekeyser so we can better utilize Kronwall and Ericcson from the second pairing. (This does not mean I think Dekeyser is a better player than Kronwall, but certainly better suited for a top pairing role with a very good puck mover - something we are in drastic need of) Yandle-Dekeyser Kronwall-Ericcson That's what I call a top 4.

I thought I would start a thread tonight for those fans who take the time to look at the big picture - rather than broadcast any anger towards one of the best GM's in the NHL just because it didn't go our way today. So before you elect Paul Holmgren as our next GM, consider that since 2007 he has signed 6 contracts to a combined 61 years and $374.5 Millon to players who are NOT currently playing for Philadelphia. (Shea Weber, Mike Richards, Jeff Carter, Danny Briere, Ilya Bryzalov, and Chris Pronger) you can also add James Van Riemsdyk to that list. Here are 5 overreaction's I have been exposed to since 10 AM this morning. 1. Vincent Lecavalier - I"ll admit I was intrigued by the possibility of him centering our second line next year...but that's about it. He is 33 years old, is already too slow, and now playing with house money for the duration of this ridiculous 5 year contract. My question is: How motivated is this Stanley Cup champ, who hasn't played more than 65 games or scored more than 25 goals since 09-10, and hasn't been a + player since 06-07 going to be for the next 5 years? Sadly enough, at the same age, Johan Franzen has actually put up better all around numbers since then and who on this site hasn't posted in a "trade Franzen" thread. 2. David Clarkson - Thank God. Why does anyone want this guy signed to a long term contract at 6+ Million per season. Those figures are entering Datsyuk range, and are already in Zetterberg range. Congratulatons on your one 30 goal season Dave, but considering that Hakan Loob, Stephane Richer, Jonathon Cheechoo, Wayne Babych and Dino Cicarelli all scored 50 once... No Thanks. 3. Buyouts - There are like 1 or 2 good centres left in this years free agent crop that 29 other teams have interest in, meaning we probably aren't going to get who we want (Stephen Weiss) because someone will overspend when it's the wrong thing to do (Philadelphia). Collatarally, this means that with 10+ million in the bank and very few targets to spend it on right now, why would we burn our last compliance buyout on either Sammy or Bert who both have 1 year remaining on their contracts, when we still have 4 players signed until at least 2019. The point is, we aren't spending 10 Mill this summer on free agents meaning there is no point in getting rid of any assets simply for cap relief. 4. Lack of Team Talent? - We played Chicago harder than anyone they met en route to winning the cup, and had 3 chances to eliminate them. As of right now, the team will be adding Helm, Bertuzzi, Dekeyser, and Tatar to next years full time roster and losing Filpulla and White for sure. Brunner and Cleary remain to be seen, but can someone tell me how next years team isn't better than last years based on injuries alone, and before you take into account the development of all of our rookies? 5. The Time Is Now - Has anyone seen next years free agent class? Before you erase Vincent Lecavalier from your CapGeek thread team, and visit nhltraderumours.com to pencil someone else into our top 6 while maintaining about $14,000 in Cap Space, consider the future.

Just because there hasn't been anything happening the past few days, I decided to come up with a ridiculous series of moves that will never happen but aren't as far fetched as other things that have happened since July 1st. 1. Trade Samuelsson to NYI for a 7th round pick. (With $22 Million in Cap Space, a once 30 goal scorer with one year left at $3 million isn't the worst gamble) 2. Trade Kyle Quincey, Brendan Smith, Teemo Pulkinen and a 1st round pick for Keith Yandle. (I can hear the groans already, but hear me out - Kyle Quincey is useless and makes $3.7 million, Brendan Smith is certainly going to make ATLEAST $1.5 Mllion next season, which already covers Yandle's cap hit. Teemu Pulkinen is another undersized winger, which we now have an abundance of as an Eastern conference team. The first round pick is going to be 25+ and we have a solid group of prospects already. So the real trade comes down to Brendan Smith vs Keith Yandle... We know who the better player is, and Yandle is only 2.5 years older with a reasonable cap hit. I have always felt our problem last season was offence from our defence, and now we solve that. Imagine what this group of forwards can do when they don't have to spend 25 seconds of each shift in there own zone. 3. Sign RFA'S 4. Sign Ron Hainsey as our 6th D Man. 5. Trade TooToo for whatever you can. Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Abdelkader Franzen - Weiss - Alfredsson Nyquist - Helm - Tatar Miller - Andersson - Eaves (Emmerton, Bertuzzi) Yandle. - Dekeyser Kronwall - Ericsson Kindl - Hainsey (Lashoff) Howard Gustavsson And There's your 23 man roster.

Losing Brunner will amount to almost nothing when this season gets underway - because what exactly are we losing? With the depth at forward this year, Brunner would be in the same position he ended last season, playing RW on our 3rd line. If you remember, Brunner scored his first 10 goals playing with Zetterberg in the first 19 games of the season getting close to first line minutes. When the rest of the league started to get their legs back and the quality of play increased, he scored only 2 goals in the remaining 25 games from the third line. The playoffs showed a better GPG rate, but 5 goals in 14 games isn't worth gambling on a 3 year contract when he hasn't played an 82 game season yet. So, back to the original question which was what are we losing? Considering that Tomas Tatar will be taking his spot, an equally fast but better two-way winger, the answer is almost nothing. I understand depth, but there is no room in the top 6 for Brunner and certainly nowhere on the checking line. You could argue that with Tatars cheaper contract, the fact he is 5 years younger and plays with Grit, this is probably an upgrade. Oh, and not to mention Tatar also proved to be a pretty good playoff scorer last year in the Calder Cup.

Bobby Ryan -> Daniel Alfredsson Daniel Alfredsson + Gustav Nyquist + Tomas Tatar/Calle Jarnkrok -> Bobby Ryan So Yes I'm happy today

Stephen Weiss is a VERY good second line centre. I live in Toronto, and believe me there is no comparison between him and Grabovski. In Detroit, Weiss could easily put up 60+ points playing with the likes of Zetterberg, Franzen or Alfredsson. I would rather have him over anyone left on the market. And Dave Hodge from TSN the reporters just said Weiss is a Red Wing...

I see why this is called the overreaction thread. We're barely into July and the Wings are already out of it. LOL Just wait until we don't get Vanek...

All the buy out Sameulsson talk is coming from people who aren't paying attention. The fact is the Red Wings COULD NOT buy him out before the compliance deadline earlier today... Otherwise they most certainly would have. The same could probably be said of Bertuzzi as well, as players unfit to play are ineligable for a buyout. Unfortunatley, Sammy's injury is probably close to being healed and at the very least he knows he will be ready for the start of training camp... His selfish behaviour (see 2010, when he told the Swedish Olympic team to f*** themselves after cutting him) will catch up to him when he's sitting in the press box to start the year. But after all of that, it still DOESN'T matter because we have almost $11 Million in cap space available with 14 forwards (Gus and Andy are RFA'S) 7 Defensemen and 2 Goalies under contract, meaning there is no possible scenario we can reach this years cap when we really have room for one more forward. Adding one of Weiss, Cullen, or Ribeiro will still leave us under, while next season Bertuzzi, Samuelsson, Eaves, Quincey and Gustavsson will be clearing another $11.5 Million off the books. Consider our cap space assuming we only add another $5 Million contract, plus the Cap going up another $4 Millon or so based on averages pre-lockout and we could have anywhere from $20-25 Million of Cap Space next summer + A compliance buyout to use if needed.

Big misconception for me. Game 5 - we were outplayed in Chicagos building. Game 6 - we outplayed them big time, had a lead after 2 and got screwed on a penalty shot call among others. (Don't get me started) Game 7 - we lost in overtime in Chicago on a deflected shot. So how exactly did we win 3/4 games before this stretch, make it close in two of the next 3 without Helm, Dekeyser, and Bertuzzi and still not be considered on there level? Don't forget that we also played a tough stretch of hockey for 2 weeks to end the season, went 7 against Anaheim (a lot of travel) and then another 7 to the best team all season.

The idea of the thread was also to look at the bigger picture. Living in Toronto, I can understand the frustration from fans who haven't seen there team in the playoffs in 9 years, or who sign Mike Komisarek, Jeff Finger, and Mikhail Grabovski to long term big money contracts. Or trade Tukka Rask for Andrew Raycroft, or how about Tyler Seguin and Dougie Hamilton for Phil Kessel. These are moves that make it legitimate for a fan base to rally for a new GM. In Detroit, we have been to the playoffs 22 years in a row. Won Cups and Presidents Trophies in both the non cap and salary cap eras and adapted from being a very good high spending team, to a very good cap strickened team. This year, in a "transition year" after losing Lidstrom, Stuart, Hudler and not cashing in last summer - we weren't supposed to make the playoffs. What happened? We took the Cup Champs to the brink and ran out of gas after two seven game series. Oh, and our farm team won the Calder Cup. Not bad for a rebuild, I'm sure the Leafs fans would take that season after 9 of missing the playoffs and stockpiling draft picks every year. Which is another thing, how on earth have we been to the playoffs every year... Usually finishing with home ice advantage, while trading most of our 1st round picks, and somehow manage to draft a Calder Cup champion in the process? Probably our terrible GM....

I appreciate the response, but I think the star players are the problem and not as much the city. Lecavalier himself said he loved Detroit and would definitely consider coming here, so he met with our GM and was informed that we were not interested in signing a 33 year old, big, slow, centre who has certainly seen a decrease in production to a 5 year contract. It was the right move. Although Dats and Hank aren't getting any younger, the rest of our team is. In 2014-15 we will roster one of the younger teams in the NHL, which also means your are going to be one of the lower payroll teams and have the ability to overspend where you see fit.

3. The point is simply that its better to pay Samuelsson to sit in the press box if we aren't going to spend the $10+ Million on THIS free agent class. Much like last year, we started and finished the season with a ton of cap space, so why waste our last buyout on a guy with one year left on his contract when Johan Franzen still has 7 left on his. Foolish to not see how he plays for one more season. 4. Cleary should not get a 3 year contract, but unfortunately I can see why he might. He was our third best player in the playoffs. He finished second in points, and played like a warrior most games. Moving to the eastern conference, he remains one of our ONLY players that plays the style of game you need to to get from most of your roster to battle in the east. Still more polished then ABBY and his point totals reflect that... 5. Next summer, while i know players will still be resigned the free agent class is still going to be MUCH better than this years, but the biggest wildcard will be the compliance buyouts. Next year, the window closes on any chance of cap relief for the remainder of this CBA. Names like Kovalchuk, Parise, Richards, Hossa, are already being talked about.

Good Signing: Dan Dekeyser Good Trade: The 18th pick in the 2013 NHL draft for Anthony Mantha and Tyler Bertuzzi.

My point is that it it seems as soon as a players name becomes available, we expect Kenny to deliver. That's fine, but don't call for his head every time he doesn't sign or trade for that piece - especially since he has a 1/29 chance to do it, and it usually requires an overpayment either financially or from our farm. The UFA class next year is better because there is much better talent, the cap will be back up, and Sammy, Bert, Gustavvson, Eaves, and Quincey will be off the books. In terms of Holmgren, look at the big picture. He has 0 cap space, Giroux,, Schenn, Coutorier, all RFA'S to sign next year and one, bad goalie. Then compare Philadelphias succes since 07 to ours, and its easy to see why these moves aren't always beneficial.