jroach17

This topic is a joke, Osgood in the HOF is a joke, & putting his number in the rafters is a cruel joke. Take off the Red & White wheel rimmed glasses.

It wouldn't be a huge surprise, since he finished the regular season as a minus, & they usually don't give the Norris Trophy for the top D in the league to a minus player.

In this day and age of big speedy forwards, and great two way players, why in the world would the Wings resign Holmstrom? He is only good for the powerplay, he is a liability on defense, & my grandma can skate faster than him. This was our chance to get younger, faster, bigger with Free agency. We signed Lidstrom, okay fine, still think we paid too much, but I'm okay with it. I'm not okay with the human pylon being resigned. We probably should have kept Leino instead of Holmstrom seeing as how he is playing right now. I'm also starting to think we should have kept Steve Yzerman & let Holland walk too, that was a bad move for the future Holland, you blew it!

Very well said, & exactly what I was looking for when I asked Why Holmstrom? I do however think there are better options

I don't know that, you don't know that & he hasn't scored 25 goals under $2M yet. Why couldn't we use his salary & combine it with others to aquire somebody alot better but at a higher cost. Use Lilja's, Maltby's, Lebda's, or Meech's combined with Holmstroms. There is also a possibility of a trade & the Wings needing that money.

Not saying Rafalski outplayed Lidstrom, just justifying his salary & why I'm not that upset about it.

Look at the stats. I said it could be argued, & in some situations. Rafalski Year Team League GP G A PTS +/- PPG PPA SHG SHA GWG PIM Shots PCT Hits 2009-10 Detroit NHL 78 8 34 42 23 5 14 0 0 1 26 134 5.97 - 2009-10 United States Olympic 6 4 4 8 7 1 - 0 - 0 2 11 36.36 - 2008-09 Detroit NHL 78 10 49 59 17 5 23 0 0 1 20 141 7.09 - 2007-08 Detroit NHL 73 13 42 55 27 10 21 0 0 1 34 175 7.43 - Career Playoff Stats Year Team LeagueGP G A PTS +/- PPG PPA SHG SHA GWG PIM Shots PCT Hits 2009-10 Detroit NHL 12 3 8 11 4 1 4 0 0 0 2 23 13.04 10 2009-10 United States Olympic - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 2008-09 Detroit NHL 18 3 9 12 11 3 4 0 0 1 11 24 12.50 - 2007-08 Detroit NHL 22 4 10 14 6 2 3 0 0 0 12 58 6.90 - Lidstrom Year Team League GP G A PTS +/- PPG PPA SHG SHA GWG PIM Shots PCT Hits om 2009-10 Detroit NHL 82 9 40 49 22 5 15 0 3 1 24 194 4.64 - 2009-10 Sweden Olympic 4 0 0 0 -1 0 - 0 - 0 2 8 .00 - 2008-09 Detroit NHL 78 16 43 59 31 10 23 0 1 4 30 180 8.89 - 2007-08 Detroit NHL 76 10 60 70 40 5 29 0 1 4 40 188 5.32 - Career Playoff Stats Year Team League GP G A PTS +/- PPG PPA SHG SHA GWG PIM Shots PCT Hits 2009-10 Detroit NHL 12 4 6 10 7 3 2 0 0 0 2 39 10.26 13 2008-09 Detroit NHL 21 4 12 16 11 3 8 0 0 1 6 59 6.78 - 2007-08 Detroit NHL 22 3 10 13 8 1 8 1 0 1 14 41 7.32 - Now we are comparing one of the best D of all time to Rafalski. I would say Rafalski has done okay.

I could mention thing likes Jason Chimera made $1.875m last season with his 15 goals and 34 points. Is that the kind of scorer you're looking for? What about Eric Belanger's 15 goals and 41 points for $1.75m? Hey what about Radek Dvorak's 14 goals and 32 points for his $1.7m cap hit? Better option than Holmstrom? Okay, I see your point, but you have to remeber some players are a product of their environment, like Osgood, he was terrible in NY & below average in STL, but on the Wings he was better than average. This will be the same with Chimera, who is and will be much better on WAS. Also remember, if you are going to give stats from last year, you have to use salaries from last year also. Holmstrom made $2.25 last year. Radek Dvorak, really?????? He had one good season in NY on a decent team, he was horrible in EDM, and bad in FLA. In my opinion, they are over payed for him too. I think Belanger could be a decent player given a different roll, & maybe that will happen, he could be that diamond in the rough you speak of.

Quote The Wings need forwards who can score, that was evident all year. Is there something else you think Homer is doing? 25 goals, right? FYI that 25 goals came from a player making $2.25M/ per. You can't predict what he will do next year, he is however another year older & can he get any slower? We could have used that money to get younger, bigger and faster.

Never said he was a free agent, was just comparing salaries to what he made last year, I have no idea what his next contract will be & neither do you, it's all speculation at this point. Still does not debunk my point that money could be spent more wisely & better talent generated.

I started to go though each NHL team & cap money to compare salaries, but I just don't have the time to really investigate & not to mention that the $1.875 we gave Holmstrom could be combined with other money to sign a better forward. Believe me, I'm not happy with Cleary's contract at all! Rafalski has been very good since coming here & in some aguments has played better than Lidstrom at times, so that one I will let go. Not that I have investigated it fully but Jussi Jokinen for instance last year made $1.7M, he had 30 goals & 35 assists. All I'm saying is to take a step back, & take off the Red Wing hat, the Holmstrom jersey & the Red colored glasses, & look at the possiblity that we could have spent that money more wisely.

Yes, I know, but it is just less money we have to spend for free agents that could help our team in all situations, not just on the PP.

Okay, maybe the Holland think was written out of emotion, & I have always liked Holland & thought he did an outstanding job. My point is, the Wings were in a great position to really make a splash in free agency. And if you don't think we can't get anybody to replace Holmstrom "Specialty" then you all are sadly mistaken. I would much rather have a player that can carry the puck, make plays, & score 5 on 5, then someone who sits in front of the net tips pucks or bangs in rebounds. The Wings need forwards who can score, that was evident all year. I'm just saying, don't you think there will be better options this summer, than to handcuff ourselves with cap money?

Ugh, it's because he played at U of M, somehow that makes him a great player in the NHL.........NOT! He is big Height: 6-1 Weight: 225lbs, if you call that big, & young, but that is about all he has going for him. There are much better D out there to be had than Jack Johnson.

Shawn Horcoff from Edmonton, he needs to get out of Edmonton & get back to playing like he can, what better place than Detroit, besides he is a former Sparty & I think would enjoy coming home sort to speak. I know he did not grow up in Michigan.

Why would Babcock sit Abdelkader when the Wings were having sucess hitting & grinding in the corners?????? He keeps Leino (while talented) in, but has done little to nothing. Hudler has disappeared, & well, Samuelsson is just horrible, & they all have one thing in common, none of them hit. The Wings need to sit Leino & Samuelsson, play Drapes & Datsyuk for game 5, bring Abdelkader back in. Oh yea, if Kronwall takes another bad penalty or gives the puck away one more time, I'd sit him too. He has Sucked this series with a capital "S".

I trust Babcock, not blaming him, just thought everybody could shed some light on some of the reasons why he would make the decision to sit Abby.

Why is it retarded? Do you have any reasons? In my previous posts, I have recognized its not my call to say who plays & who doesn't. The bottom line is Kronwall has taken bad penalties in multiple games that led to PP goals, & keeps giving the puck away.

Only thought as to why they keep Hudler in the lineup would be because he does have 10 points in the playoffs so far, & his past success in the playoffs. You are correct, he has not been good either, almost like he has been scratched even though we know he has played.

While sitting Kronwall might have been a little bit of an emotional call on my part, I would however give him must less ice time. Pair Lidstrom/Rafalski, Ericsson/Stuart, Lebda/Kronwall, and much less PP time. Sammy would be done as a Red Wing if it were up to me, which it's not........

The goals Hasek gave up were not all his fault either, one banked off Kronwalls a$$, another was just a great setup on a PP. I still think Hasek can steal you a win, Osgood can't. Hell, you could speculate that Hasek could have already ended this series. Here is the issue though, it's too late in the playoffs to be swithing goalies again. I think the Wings are pretty much going to stick with Osgood now. Nobody has ever won the Stanley cup switching goalies back and forth.

Everybody is saying "let Babcock whip him into shape" This guy has proven that he can score 30 goals a season, not too shabby by my book. Bottom line is we need goals(30+ possibly), someone that is strong on their skates(which he is) & he has Detroit connections (MSU) sounds like a pretty good fit to me. I'm not saying overpay for him....but we lost Shanny, which I'm not too bumbed about, but he did put in 40 goals & we need to try to somewhat fill that void. Carter could definately help that.

How do you not assume otherwise. Legace has been in the league for 12 years & has NEVER been the starter. So you tell me why it is not right to assume.

I think it makes perfect sense. Why in the world would you pay your backup more than your starter? Cujo knows he can't get the money he used to command. He would come quite a bit cheaper. The Wings can trade Legace, & Osgood can back up Cujo.

There is no more waiver draft. Only way we can lose Macdonald is by normal waivers, which he would have to clear to go to the minors. However, Detroit has been trying to sign Howard to play in the minors. If Detroit signs Howard, Macdonald is probably done with Detroit. Legace is going to be in Red and White at leats for a couple more months, and Howard would have the job in Grand Rapids. Unless Holland sits Macdonald at the NHL level, which would only fuel trade speculation. Macdonald should be traded if they are hanging on to Legace....better than losing him for nothing. You are correct, there is no more waiver draft, I was not thinking clearly. I just meant he would have to clear waivers. I however would rather have a goalie in the system that actually has a chance to be the starter. Manny will never be the starter & I can't imagine paying your backup more than your starter. What makes you think Macdonald has a shot? He had a good year last year in the minors, he's young still. Unlike Manny he has not had 12 seasons in the NHL as a backup. I'm not saying he is going to start this season, but if he is in the Wings future it would be nice for him to learn as the backup at the NHL level. Osgood will start this year...possibly next year as well. Macdonald would be going against Howard and Liv for the job if both Ozzie and Legace were gone. Even with potentially 20 NHL games under his career, he would still not have nearly the length of experience as a starter that Liv and Howard have. The Wings were very disappointed in the progression of Liv, & have said MacDaonald had passed him on the depth chart. So now you have Howard who wants to play his senior season at Main & Macdonald.