therock48880

Welcome to lgw.com. I agree with what you said, however, I'd just to like to warn you that many on here don't see the need for a tough guy on the team. They feel that the skill of the team will make other teams pay when the Wings get power plays. For me, it seems pretty obvious. They've played two big, tough, physical teams and lost them both, albeit one on a disputed goal in ot and the other on the back end of a back to back. Simple fact is, the Wings are getting roughed up out west and no one can do anything about it.

Clear win by May. Not sure how anyone could say differently.

I agree. It irritates me when people say the officiating cost someone a game. We still have people on this site that insist the reason the Wings lost to the Ducks two years ago was due to poor officiating and I think that's ridiculous. Having said that, last night's game was very poorly officiated. Even Babcock, who rarely says anything negative about officiating, is quoted in mlive saying that he wished the calls would have gone both ways. That's rare for him.

I think we're lucky to be able to have an argument like the one taking place in this thread. Both Dats and Z are phenomenal all around players and which one is slightly better than the other seems irrelevant to me. (although I'd give Dats a VERY slight edge). Then, you throw Hossa, Draper, Franzen, Cleary, etc... into the argument and it becomes clear how lucky we, as Wings fans, are. Here's my list: 1a. Dats 1b. Z 3. Hossa 4. Draper 5. Everyone else except Hudler and Homer who are battling for the bottom.

I disagree. Game three was the only game that the Pens outplayed the Wings. One game out of six. Without Fleury's heroics, that series was over in 5 because the Wings dominated that game.

If being "shoved out the door" means having a 5 year 50 million dollar contract on the table for FOUR MONTHS then I certainly hope I get shoved out the door. It became quite clear during those 4 months that Federov probably wasn't staying regardless of how much he was offered. As it is, the Wings final offer to Federov was higher annually and for the same term than the contract he signed with the Ducks.

This thread reminds me of a comment I heard on NFL radio a couple weeks ago by Randy Cross. A Steeler fan called in and went off because Cross had said the Steelers offensive line basically sucked. When the caller hung up, Cross lauged and said, "No one throws a hissy-fit like fans from Pittsburg". I know he was referring to football, but it seemed funny to me after reading all the whining the Pens fans (and players and coach) did during the finals last year.

Lidstrom was also quoted last year in a swedish newspaper stating he'd play for a ridiculously low salary (seems like he said 35k per year but I may be off on that one). I'm wondering if he wouldn't be willing to sign for 5-6 million per year, which would allow Kenny to re-sign Franzen and Hossa. I could see him doing that. Yzerman did it at the end of his career so the precedence has been set. I can't believe I found that quote from him: http://www.topix.com/forum/hockey-players/...DMQ20ODUQ763HN4

I'm to the point of giving up on Hudler. Stupid penalties in the finals, very slow skater, defensive liability, and has gotten demoted from Z's line to the third line. There's no way he should be taking a roster spot from Helm, imo.

It's a groin strain. http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/20..._finish_pr.html

This I like. I'd still like to see Lilja traded and one of the kids brought up. I fail to see why when you have something magical (ZDH) why you'd break it up. I hope they prove me wrong because Babcock seems hell bent on breaking them up this season, but so far it certainly isn't working. Curious to see what the third period brings.

I agree. I hate "what ifs". It's quite simple really, THE WINGS LOST. Could they have won? Sure. But they didn't. He's been spouting this anti-fighter nonsense for years, even when faced with quotes from some great Wings saying how important it is to have a tough guy on the team. Guys like Yzerman and Lidstrom don't know enough about the game of hockey to be making comments in support of having a tough guy on the team. He'll also tell you that Fedorov was better than Yzerman, Kovalev is the second coming, etc.... Just take it with a grain of salt.

The list of players supporting tough guys is much longer than the names you have listed. Yzerman, Schneider, Lidstrom, Chelios, Z, Dats, Draper are names that come to mind. Schneider went as far as to call them "nuclear bombs" and said that if the opponent had one it would be ideal for the Wings to have at least one also. When saying that, he wasn't necessarily referring to anyone in particular so he wasn't defending a teammate. Yzerman, after an early round loss, said the Wings needed more "McCarty-type" players. However, many LGW members seem to know more about hockey than those players. Helm and Leino (especially Helm) are great talents but it's like making a cake. All of the ingredients must be there. So, I go back to a question I asked earlier, how many teams in the past 20 years won a cup without having a tough guy on the team? Carolina. That's it. Maybe it's a coincidence.

I find it amusing that some still scoff at the importance of a tough guy (or two or three) on a team. How many Stanley Cup winning teams in the past twenty years made it through the year without having a tough guy on the team? Personally, I can only think of one team and that's Carolina. Having said that, Downey cleared waivers twice last year and will most likely clear them again. This isn't a year-long move, he'll be back up with the Wings at some point this season.

The Penguins are higher than they should be, imo. They lost a lot of the heart from last year's team. Guys like Roberts, Malone, Ruutu, and Hall aren't easily replaced. Plus, now Gonchar is out. Not to mention the loss of Conklin. Without him who knows where the Pens would have ended up last year. They are still a very talented team but they have a lot of question marks, imo. I think Montreal has passed them in the east.

Yeah, I'm sure his intent was to injure a teammate. This is HOCKEY. Even during scrimmages and practices, it gets physical.

I agree, but like someone said earlier it's hard to compare d-men and forwards. The list could have been divided in two and had a forward and a d-man category. Lidstrom is so far superior to any other d-man in the league it's not even funny.

Someone should post this article on letsgopens.com. Then we could hear some SERIOUS whining.

You're right.

lol. You beat me to it.

If he were to re-sign for 7.2 million right now, wouldn't his average salary count against this year's cap? If so, the chances of him signing a new contract before the end of the season are reduced. Hypothetically speaking of course.

This makes no sense since Moore wasn't injured in a fight. He was injured by a cheapshot that would have happened whether fighting was "banned" or not.

That's a great quote from Nill. Maybe that'll help silence the anti-downey people around here. A number of posts mention the salary cap and the fact that the Wings are getting close to it. Kenny had said that they will probably go to camp over the cap, which is allowed, and let training camp sort everything out. My impression was that there would probably be a trade or two toward the end of the camp. I was assuming it'd be a d-man or two since that's where they have the most young depth. So, guys like Lebda, Meech, Quincey, etc... may literally be training for their future as a Red Wing. I hope McCarty will now sign the exact same contract that Downey did.

I wouldn't go quite that far. They've still got some very young, talented players, but I think can't see them being as good as last year. In all honesty, I think Dallas would have beaten them last year and possible Anaheim and SJ too.

Let's look at the Pens moves this offseason: Lost Hossa, gained Satan. Advantage Hossa Lost Laraque, gained Goddard. Advantage Laraque Lost Ruutu, gained Cooke. Advantage Ruutu Lost Roberts gained Fedotenko. Advantage Fedotenko Lost Hall Lost Malone Lost Conklin I can't imagine how they'll be as good as last year. It helps them that the East is not a terribly strong conference.