Hank

I would rather have Anaheim, LA, SJ, Atlanta, TB, Florida, Phoneix and Nashville win the Cup 800 years in a row than the Leafs ever win a Cup. If anyone thought their fans were obnoxious now, just wait until they win the cup. They'll be insuffarable. I play ball with a number of Laugh fans and they're always in my face about how Detroit sucks. I always laugh and question "What cave have you been living in? What have the Leafs done?". That never, ever fazes them. You can throw at them the fact that they haven't won the Cup since Moses was alive. You can tell them that they haven't even made the playoffs in 2 seasons or the fact that their GM is a complete skidmark and they'll still laugh at the Wings for not winning the Cup. Like Motorcitykid so intelligently pointed out, most of them aren't even close to being NHL or hockey fans. If it doesn't pertain to the Leafs they don't bother. And intelligence? Forget about it. Just try to go to the Sportsnet.ca forums. You'll see some 'trade proposals' that would make Paris Hilton look like Stephen Hawking. I actually read one where the author felt that Wade Belak and Chad Kilger for Rob Blake was a great deal for both sides. And just before you can reply with how retarded they are, you'll see 1000 more posts popping up agreeing saying that LA would be stupid NOT to make that deal. I even saw some Leaf fans chime in saying they would be giving up too much for Blake. Leaf fans are idiots and I'll tell you why; because they continue to endorse and throw money at an organization that goes out of it's way to be unsuccessful (see NOT listening to Bowman's suggestions). They're no different than the Lions fans in Detroit. But at least Lions fans follow the entire NFL and don't ask for parades if they win a preseason game. ARGH! I really can't express how much I hate the Leafs and Leaf nation! I hope they never, ever win the Cup for the rest of earths existance!

I love the NHL All Acess and Chasing the Dream programs. They're usually very entertaining. In Chasing the Dream they followed the Johnstown Cheifs around for a while. To say these players are a bit nutty is an understatment. In another season they followed the Wilkes-Barre Penguins around. It was Colby Armstrong's first year as a pro and it was funny to see some of the adaptions he needed to make for the faster, more physical hockey. Really good stuff.

If Dino Cicerrelli and Mike Gartner aren't in the hall then Adam Oates doesn't deserve to be either. He's never won a Cup and if guys that have scored over 600 and 700 goals can't make it, then Oates doesn't have enough points to make it either. Personally, I don't think Cups should matter as far as the HoF goes. Jacques Lemaire is a prime example. He scored just over 800 points but got in because he won a handful of cups. I'm not saying he wasn't a very good player but those Cups had a lot to do with that team he played on. I don't think he deserves to be in there. But since the review board that looks at this does consider Cup wins as so valuable then Oates shouldn't make it.

Yeah, I hate that too. Especially for VS broadcasts. People might complain that they aren't in any homes but they put on a great show. Their pre-game and post-game shows are awesome and way better than any ESPN broadcast I've seen.

I'll agree with that. But I still think averaging over 15,000 paid attendance would help with the perception of being a good hockey town. Cheers.

Dammit! Nobody told me I could list the same team all 5 times! Well done sir, well done.

Very valid question. And it's something only the BOG and their insane thought-process can answer. Even Seattle would have been a better choice. It has a cold environment during the winter and it's very close to the Canadian border. You'd be sure to sell out almost every night. Same with Portland, Maine, North Dakota or even Wiconson. All three locations have a rabid NCAA following. But there's nothing sexy about Portland, ND or Wisoncon. We'll see hockey in Vegas and New Mexico before a state or city with an actual hockey background gets a team.

Because is you're a Wings fan you have to hate the Leafs. Actually, unless you're a Leafs fan, you have to hate the Leafs. It's like the Yankees of baseball only the Leafs don't win anything. Also, the Leaf organization, their players and especially their fans are some of the most arrogant and self rightous fans on the planet. They will constantly tell you that they live in Hockey Universe and any change made to the league should be for the benefit of the Leafs. Look at the last lockout. The fans and even the organization was dead set against a Cap even though it helped make the league better. Why? Because they know that their only chance of winning anything comes from their deep pockets. And who can like any group of fans that in all seriousness try to organize parades for ONE playoff round victory. And that is no lie. There were serious discussions about a Leaf parade when they beat the Islanders in round 1 of the '04 playoffs.

The NHL network is a TSN run station (I believe) that only talks hockey all day long. It's great on game nights because they'll have in-studio analysts that will go through every game showing highlights and analyse them. It's really the next best thing to having the Centre Ice Package. Also, during the day, they'll show programs like NHL All Access or Chasing the Dream. Both of those programs are awesome. They'll also show documentaries on past players, show classic games, have hockey shows with deep analysis. It's awesome. Unfortunately for US fans, I don't think you'll ever get this station because of it's affiliation to TSN. Just like Canadians will never get ESPN. The Centre Ice Package is awesome too. But I have to tell you, from watching the Oilers PPV games, Oilers fans are getting ripped off. The production feels as if it's coming from someones basement and the 'announcers' sound so amateurish it's laughable.

Expect for the part of losing $15M a year. I'm going to ask you a quesiton and I want a short, blunt answer. Do you believe that Nashville is a good hockey market and do you think it can survive there long term? And if you do, can you provide proof of both? As far as I see it, this team will either be moved or folded in the next 2-5 years. It's a horrible hockey market and the weak fan and corporate support has proven it. If it wasn't the current owner, who appears to be very pationate about hockey and Preds hockey in particular, would not be trying to sell it and he certainly wouldn't have triggered that clause in the lease that would allow him to pull up shop.

I think anyone who thinks the Preds aren't on the move is kidding themselves. There are quite a few rumblings that this newest bidder wants to move the team to K.C.. And why not? It's lease free and the owner gets a chunk of all the events that take place in the building. It's a slam dunk. And I will argue your point that a team in KC doesn't do as much as a team in Hamilton for the league. While I fully agree that having the team move to Hamilton over KC is much better for the league because it will be successful and stable there, that's not how the BOG thinks. They think "How will a team moving to Hamilton expand interest in the US?". It won't. Having a team in KC will introduce new fans in that area and they're hoping it spreads. My thought is that this whole soap opera is a great example of why the NHL is a laughing stock in the eye of North American sports. They put a team in a bad hockey market and then they do everything in their power to make sure that team goes to another proven bad hockey market instead of a good one, where it's sure to be successful. What is insane in the real world, is genius in the NHL. But I think it's fair to say that in the end, the Preds are leaving town; possibly as early as the 08-09 season. If Liopold was dead set against the move he would have never activated that clause.

Retraction: I understand what Brodeur is saying in regards to protecting players running the crease, but in a lot of cases, it's the dmen that throw forwards into their goalies. P.S. Goalies are notorious for exaggerating what they feel is necessary for a safe work environment. Afterall, Giggy thinks his bloated pads are essential to protect him and not the net. That's a load of BS and everyone in and outside of hockey knows it. Goalies will push their agendas for their own benefit well before they make any decisions that are best for the game, the league or the fans. I don't know one fan out there that likes the current state of the goalie eqiupment. It's rediculous.

Just playing devils advocate but their line suffered when they were on the road and always faced a defensive line. I thought they did a lot better in the Ducks series when they split them up.

Love the guy. He's basically a younger Cleary who fights more and has better hands. Could be a 25 goal scorer if playing on top 2 lines. The Oilers are looking for a puck-moving dman though. We might be able to get away with Lebda and a top prospect or high pick. I doubt it though. They'd probably want Kronwall, which is too steep. If we're going to deal Kronwall I'd want a Horton-type player in return.

You're actually proving some of my points. This guy was given 6th defenseman time and yet all he did was put up a +40 rating and led the teams defenseman in scoring. He's gold 5-on-5. Compared to what other dmen are getting paid, this guy would be an absolute steal at $2M. If he put up these kinds of numbers while only playing 15 MPG and no special teams, what do you think he'd be able to do lined up with Lidstrom or Chelios? Being such a competant 5-on-5 blueliner this would give a lot more time to players like Cheli and Leilja on the PK or Lidstrom on the PP. You also have to look at who's ahead of him on the PK side of things: Wade Redden, Chris Phillips, Anton Volchenkov and Andrej Meszaros. Out of those 4 only Lidstrom and Markov would crack that top 4. When he was with the Sharks in 05-06, he was in the top 4 for both PP and PK and led the team in points for a dman. I know what you're saying about his stature in the Sens heirarchy, but I think he would fit in perfectly with the Wings and at a very reasonable price (and he's only 29). EDIT: Sorry, I just read what GordieSid&Ted wrote. He summed it up perfectly.

Duh. I'm complaining about the fact that everyone keeps talking about how we need a #2 centre when we already have one. Where in my post did I complain that we need a #2 centre? Sundin was a natural RW. He was interviewed on the CBC last season and he spoke about how he always played RW until he was drafted by Quebec. And after they moved him to centre he loved it and felt it was a perfect fit for him.

I'm a big Preissing fan. I thought he didn't get nearly enough publicity for what he did for the Senators. Noway they make it to the cup without him. He's great in all 3 zones. And some are speculating that he could be had for $2-3M. If the Wings let Schneider and Markov go, I'd love for them to pick up Smyth and Priessing. And hopefully they had enough money left over for Bert. Our top 4 dmen: Lidstrom, Kronwall, Lebda/Chelios, Preissing. Not too bad. I'd also like to see them take a look at Andy Sutton like another LWG'er suggested.

I agree. And if you watch how Babcock ran things the first month you can tell that he really, really likes Zetts at centre. It was only when the Wings were slumping horribly to start the year with little to no offense that he begrudgingly moved Z up to Datsyuk's line. I'd rather go get a hardnosed winger like Smyth than another soft centre. I think Filp is going to do a great job as our sometimes 3rd line centre and top 4 winger. He showed some great chemistry with Datsyuk in the playoffs. Let Schneids and Markov walk, and then sign Bert and Smyth: Smyth-Datsyuk-Sammy Cleary-Zetts-Bert Homer-Filp-Hudler/Grigs Franzen-Draps-Maltby Lidstrom-Krownwall Lebda-Chelios Leijla-Quincy So were Messier and Gretzky. But then they split them up and they became, arguably, the best 1-2 punch down the middle the NHL has ever seen. Sundin and Sakic are another pair. Sundin was actually a natural right-winger when he came to Quebec but they decided to move him to centre and they were better for it. Besides, with both those guys down the middle, it'll give some other guys a shot at becoming an elite winger. It might help players like Grigorenko, Hudler, Franzen, Homer and maybe even Filppula.

That right there tells you why Bowman would be horrible for the Leafs. It sounds like he has too much intellligence. The Leafs are only interested in hiring yes men and morons. They know that they'll sell out every night even if they went 0-82 and didn't win a Cup for another 40 years. Bringing in Bowman makes too much sense. And the fact that Peddie wants to keep JFJ around tells you that everything I said above is warrented. The ghost of Harold Ballard lives on!

YES!

I think the power skating and beginners skills classes for newbies are excellent. I've never taken one myself but I knew a guy that didn't get into hockey until he was in his late 20's, like yourself. When he started he could barely stand on the ice. That first summer he took a powerskating class and a skills class as well. He did that for at least 2 summers while playing in as many games as he could during the winter (at least 2 nights). He now plays in the same mens league that I do, which is pretty competitive. (The average skill level is probably between midget A to Junior C. We've even had some NHLers and AHLers in the league). I would say that he's probably one of the best skaters in the league now. He's still not that great with the puck or shooting, but he's coming along. And with his skating being so strong, it makes up for a lot of his other deficincies. So if you can find a class for adult beginners, I'd definately look into it. It would be worth it.

What makes me laugh about the Lewis firing is that some in the organization disliked his defensive style and felt it didn't suit the teams makup. So what do they do? They hire a defensive specialist from the DEVILS organization. Brilliant.

Great thread! 1. Chicago 2. Boston 3. Toronto 4. Washington 5. Phoenix I would have put Philly and the Islanders in there but since both of those teams cut out their cancers (Clarke and Milbury) they've actually improved a lot. The top 3 are easy though. Chicago and Boston have two of the worst owners in sports history. Toronto is run so piss poor it's not even funny. Tomas Kaberle is the only allstar they've drafted and produced since Wendel Clarke. That's pathetic. Money is what got them in the playoffs before the lockout. Is it any coincidence that they've playing golf in April since the Cap was introduced? I don't think so. Now that I think about it, this bums me out. 3 of the 6 original teams are the worst run organiztions in the NHL. For shame. And the Rangers haven't exactly been great lately either. Horrible drafts and free agent pickups. Although, this past season their hired guns actually produced and there appears to be some light at the end of the tunnel with their prospects.

And Sutton likes to toss 'em once in a while too, just like Markov would at times. Nothing pumped me up more than watching Markov jump on a pile of Flames in game 1(?). I think it was at that moment that I realised this was a different team than previous years. The Wings weren't going to take crap from anybody!

Seriously! I still can't comprehend someone scoring 600+ goals and yet can't do something my 4 year old learned how to do this spring. There might be hope for guys like us yet!