up2here

Are you seriously blaming Bettman for the size of goalie equipment? Wow. I guess global warming and 9-11 were his fault too. Ive said it on here many times. I dont like the guy but the lockout isnt all his fault and neither is the size of the goalie equipment.

I like the "out of the box" thinking but the owners wouldnt go for it. They would still be paying the full contract and would end up paying even more up front. Think about the deals that Minnesota just signed and imagine the amount of the buyout. If I'm understanding you correctly.

Here's my proposal: YOURE BOTH F$%CKING FILTHY RICH SO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DIVIDE YOUR BILLION DOLLAR PIE BEFORE THE PEOPLE MAKING MERE FRACTIONS OF WHAT YOU MAKE AND WHO GIVE YOU ALL YOUR MONEY DECIDE THEY'RE BETTER OFF WITHOUT YOUR SPOILED A$$ES!!!

I understand your points but theres a big difference between "Hockey" and the "NHL". I will continue to support "Hockey" but if this season is lost I will not support the NHL and contrary to your opinion I beleive if more fans did this than the NHL (Or another pro league entirely) will be better for fans.

I think its different this time. I like to consider myself an "Average Guy", meaning that if I feel a certain way, or am mad about something that there will be millions and millions of other guys who feel the same. After working my a$$ off for the last 25 years making mere fractions of what these NHL Players and Owners make I have some perspective and I'm f%$king pissed off. If this season is lost, hell even if half of the season is lost I'm done. I will continue to support junior as well as college and university hockey but the as far as I'm concerned the NHL can shove it where the sun doesnt shine.

I admit its difficult to beleive but when I watch games from the 60's and 70's I'm amazed by how slow the game was. I dont mean to take anything away from Gordie he's basically a god but i beleive the current NHL era is FAR superior. I watched a game between the Wings and Montreal from 1975 and I literally saw defenseman (Mostly on the Wings) who could barely skate backwards and whos transition from skating backward to forward was just awful. What was REALLy noticebale was the size of the goalie equipment.

Now that Boyd Devereaux has moved on and opened up the competition for best goal scorer. I'm going with Franzen.

I maintain that Lidstrom is the greatest Red Wing of all-time and and at the very least the greatest Red Wing that I got to see play. Stevie was awesome and certainly played in Gretzky and Lemieux's shadow but if you compare Lidstrom and Yzerman by position the choice is clearly in Lidstrom's favor. Another thing to keep in mind about Lids is that he was unappreciated early in his career and probably should have won a couple more Norris trophies.

You said "They're wrong because the solution to a problem they created shouldn't be to force someone else to solve it for them. They sure as hell shouldn't be looking to that solution for the second time in eight years.." I'm saying its not wrong because the cba expired so everything is back on the table.They have every right to try to get a better deal especially if they have teams losing money. Its their own fault theyre in the mess but that doesnt make it wrong that they want to negotiate a new deal. If the players felt slighted you can be sure they would have wanted a new deal whether it was their fault or not.

The CBA expired, so both sides have every right to do a different deal. The players obviously want the current deal extended, the owners dont. I dont agree with what they are doing but i understand why. I fail to see hows thats wrong of them. If the league loses franchises everyone loses. There will be no big TV deal in the US without Southern teams and California teams.

Why are the owners wrong for not wanting 18 of their franchises to lose money? We can blame the owners of those teams for handing out huge stupid contracts (And I really do) but in the end it has to be fixed or the league will lose franchises which in turn equals less revenue, less jobs for players and no big TV conract. This is why this lock-out makes me so mad. The owners were stupid and the players are greedy and have lost touch with reality.

What I'm saying is that its in both sides best interest to say nothing because every time they do say something it ends up making their side look bad. They should both shut-up, get together and figure something out.

Youre right its very difficult to compare and I'm not saying its fair for the players to get 50% but Im betting thats where they end up. We will likely have have 2 or three months of no hockey followed by the players caving and the split ending up close to 50/50.

Who said I was pro owner? If you look back at previous post it clearly says I'm fed -up with both sides. Also I hate the concussion/injury argument. Barring a catestrophic event whats stopping an injured player from getting a real job like the rest of us? Sure they have a high risk but theyre all well paid to play for a living. This has nothing to do with free speech. The players can say anything they want (And some of them have) but its always something that ends up making them look bad. There's an old saying : "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt".

No way Ovechkin or Malkin or Kovalchuck stay. Even if the money is even (which it likey wont be) they know the NHL is still the best league in the world and they know the marketing opportunities are better. Ovechkin is a very talented player but hes full of crap. REALLY full of crap.

Boyle should have kept his mouth shut. Even if he was privy to some inside information (Which he probably isnt) does he honestly beleive there arent players out there who just want to play and arent in favor of asking for the moon? I am willing to bet my life savings (Granted it isnt much) that there is a MUCH higher percentage of players who just want to play then there are owners who do. This is why the players will cave first and revenue will probably end up being split some where close to 50 -50. Like every other sports league. The best thing the owners have done is not say anything. Every single time a player opens his mouth in the press it ends up sounding selfish, immature and just plain stupid.

Blaming Bettman is easy. He's annoying to look at (Very weasel-like), annoying to listen to and hes been around for 3 lock-outs/strikes. The problem is that its not really accurate. He is employed by the owners and does as they want him to do. I'm sure Gary has a lot of influence on some owners but its certianly at least a shared blame. I am frankly very fed-up with both sides and I am seriously considering abandoning watching NHL hockey all together. The owners signed all these players to all these ridiculous contracts and are now crying about the very contracts they signed. Meanwhile the players seem to have lost touch with reality. They say they wont take less money but then sign contracts to play in Europe for mere fractions of what they were making in the NHL. The dollars they are splitting up would be like me and Esteef choosing who gets the Ferrari and who gets the Lamborghini. Both sides need to grow the f%^k up, stop being so astronomically f%^king stupid and figure this out before they start losing REAL hockey fans.

I think its almost a lock that it will be Hank. From Rotoworld: -Henrik Zetterberg is a prime candidate to be the next captain of the Detroit Red Wings now that Nicklas Lidstrom has retired. Zetterberg drew praise for his play and leadership this past season and in the playoffs from Lidstrom at the defenseman's retirement news conference. The talented forward also has the support of his existing teammates. "He's like Nick but a little more vocal," said Daniel Cleary on Thursday. "He's the ultimate team player. He cares about winning and has a great work ethic. He loves his teammates and the guys love him and respect him a lot. He's my 1A, B and C."-

Glad to see him survive the first cut but I honestly havent heard what his chances of making the team. Anyone have any insight?

This will now be two consecutive down years for Ovechkin but its hard to say hes past his prime at 26 yeard old. I will say this though. His style of play does not normally lend itself to a long career.

First of all congrats to Nick on his 1550 game as a Red Wing, passing Alex Delvecchio. Is Nick the greatest Red Wing of all time? I think I would have to say yes but I'm sure there will be much debate.

Its very difficult to compare eras that are so far apart like Howe's and Nick's. Gordie almost never had to travel to the West Coast or play against European players but him playing against only 5 other teams certainly would have been very tough. I never saw Gordie play until the late 70's/early80's when he was essentially the shell of himself so its hard for me judge but I wouldnt discredit anyone for saying # 9 was the best.

I beleive this is the year Pav can win the Hart Trophy. As long as he stays healthy he will be right there for the Scoring Lead and if you combine that with his Faceoff and takeaway stats along with being the best defensive forward in the game I think he can be MVP.

Now if the Habs can convince another GM to take that suckbag Scot Gomez and his 7.5 mil contract then they would be on to something.

I dont discredit toughness being a factor in winning Cups but to say that the reason the Red Wings havent won the Cup in the past few years because they dont have a guy in the line-up who plays less than 5 minutes per night is just simply ridiculous. Don is a great Canadian but his time has come and gone.