Drake_Marcus

Quoted. For. Truth.

Yeah, but 2003 made up for it!

You're correct. Not really. Quincey was low on the depth charts. He floundered in the AHL for a season, stunk up training camp, looked terrible in his most recent call-ups, and was stuck below 3 other non-roster defensemen in terms of where he sat on the depth charts. Howard represents a long 4 year investment of development. He's a former AHL all-star and a standout in 3 of his 4 AHL seasons. He's at the top of the non-roster goalie depth chart. Goalies are the most difficult players to scout and judge the development of. It's been shown over the years that goalies can skyrocket after some NHL seasoning time as a back-up. If teams abandoned their goaltending prospects after only a dozen NHL starts many of the elite goalies in the NHL would be playing on different teams, if at all. In terms of skill-set Howard has the tools to be a starting goaltender in the NHL according to scouts. All he has to do is get more consistent and get some NHL seasoning. Moreover, while Howard looked bad in his single call-up last year in front of a decimated Wings team, he looked good in his call-ups the year before (although, again he was often playing in front of a team decimated by injuries). Bingo. And people need to chill out about Quincey- he definitely cooled off in his second half and has come back down to earth. His long-term worth has yet to be determined. Regardless- he's not better than Ericsson or Kindl, so there's no room for him here anyway.

Yeah, because sitting around while the world economy collapses is a better move. God forbid the leader of your country try to save your own economy by the means most likely to succeed (something that is not arguable- it's worked in Europe and is widely considered the most feasible solution by economists as a community). Let the republithugs whine and gnash their teeth- they caused this mess by hacking away at regulation and removing the safety net designed to prevent that s***, they deserve zero input in how to fix the mess they created.

Where do I apply for this free candy you're offering?

Agreed!

Great response. Please stick around these boards, we could use more answers like this when people start flaming other teams. As far as Lemieux goes, I loved Mario as a kid- even bought a Pens jersey when it went on sale (hey- I was an impressionable ~10 year old with some birthday money and a recently read book on Mario's life ). My loyalties were always to the Wings, but damn it if I didn't think Mario was better than Gretz. If Mario said healthy he would've eaten Gretzky's records alive (prior to unretiring, Mario had a better career ppg than Gretz). Plus, "Super Mario" vs. "The Great One"? Easiest nickname contest ever. Gretz had a nickname that sounded like a Pepsi ad executive's name for his penis.

Correct. Everyone expects the final number to be released this week sometime before the draft.

We get it- you hate Hudler because he's short and european. That doesn't make your opinions regarding him any more correct, though. We're all aware that you loathe him for being so short and not checking.

We saw Flip come into his own in 07-08 only to be our worst forward in the first 2 rounds of the playoffs. Confidence is great but in the long run it fizzles out. We've yet to see Filppula put together an 82 game season where he was among the top 6 Red Wings in scoring. I'm sure he's going to be a fantastically usefull player on this team in the future, I'm just not seeing the shot, shot selection or hands you need to be a star player in this league. Val does everything very well except when it comes to his offensive instincts. His shot is terrible, but his passing good (not fantastic, but definitely good) and his ability to hang onto and control the puck is excellent. He'll be able to put up more points this year, but I don't see him exceeding 50-55pts, sorry. Not unless he discovers a scoring touch. I'd be happy to see him break 60pts, though- don't get me wrong, he's still a Wing so I want him to succeed.

If someone offers Hudler 2.6 million for a reasonable term I'd expect the Wings to match it unless it's a team whose 2nd and 3rd rounders are expected to be absurdly high.

The 2010 has good headliners (Taylor Hall and Kirill Kabanov) but I have no clue what the depth's like. I haven't read much about it. The hockey news said that the 2011 draft is "already making scouts cringe", comparing it to the terrible, terrible 1999 draft (where Zetterberg was the only superstar taken, and he was passed over more than 200 times before we snagged him, although some might argue that the Sedins are stars, they're not superstars).

You definitely can compare them overall because Filppula gets WAY more minutes than Hudler, which makes up for the special teams differences. Moreover, in the context of what I was responding to the numbers I quoted made sense.

I'm aware fo how the RFA system works My trade comment was more relating to how the Wings would deal with him if there aren't rumblings about teams planing on throwing a large offer at him.

I'm interested what part of the articles posted led the OP to conclude Holland is "leaning toward Howard as backup"? Leaning implies there's some doubt expressed by Holland. Those articles make it pretty clear that Holland has all but settled on Howard. Conklin isn't going to be around to sign come training camp. He'll be grabbed up sometime in July.

You and all the rest of us who understand how minor league options work and who watch the way the Wings deal with their prospects.

It's pretty rare for a player to walk into arbitration and get triple his old salary or more in situations like this. I don't see this Hudler situation being a big deal right now as it looks like Hossa's a long shot to sign here. If Hossa goes we keep Hudler. Worst case the Wings trade him for a similar high end scoring prospect. Hudler's already almost hit the 60pt plateau in his third season, it's reasonable to say he could hit 70 next season. To say he's plateaued as a 3rd year player (not that you did, another poster said it) is ludicrous when he's consistently increased his point totals and now his goal totals from one year to the next all without seeing increased ice time.

So you think he's going to make a 50% increase in his points output because he's added to the PP? A 50% increase in production from one season to another is a HUGE jump. Huge.

Not so. Filppula gets 3-5 minutes more ice time each night and consistently plays with superior linemates. That makes up for the difference in PP time vs PK time.

Huh? Filppula: 06-07___07-08___08-09 10 G____19 G____12 G 17 pts___36 pts__40 pts Hudler: 06-07___07-08___08-09 15 G____13 G____23 G 25 pts___42 pts__57 pts Interesting interpretation of dropping stocks. One player managed to increase his points total by less than 10% and the other by more than 30%. Which one's stock stayed the same? Hudler? Oh really? I guess since his playoff scoring totals on the 3rd line weren't stellar (although they were among the top 6 forwards) and Val had a surprising outburst, the more consistent, higher scoring of the two is suddenly a lame horse? Don't go shooting Datsyuk then.

What a stacked class this year. The voters never had it so easy! Congrats to Stevie- you deserve this and more.

Boomer's Arguement after Probie's Rebuttal

Interesting theory on the chain of command Hudler's presence on this team is dependent on Hossa's.

This year. (although your comment about 4th line is true in terms of where his minutes were spent, Hudler was still among the top 6 forwards in playoff scoring this year) Last year Filppula disappeared in the playoffs and Hudler shined. As far as the OP goes, yeah Hudler is definitely worth $3 million. 08-09 Season: Hudler- 23G, 57pts, 5th in forward scoring Filppula- 12G, 40pts, 8th in forward scoring 07-08 Season: Hudler- 13, 42pts, 4th in forward scoring Filppula- 19, 36pts, 8th in forward scoring If Filppula's worth 3 million long term then so is Hudler. One is an all around forward, one is a scoring forward and PP specialist. Cool. They're the same age and both are trending upwards. We need them both 10 years from now when Z and Dats have faded.

Interesting. He does everything your big two does (aside from faceoffs) but he does it better. He is one of the best hitters of all the forwards in the league. He provides boundless energy. He's an elite skater. He's one of only a handful of players in NHL history to win back to back Harts. He's scored an average of 60 goals over the last two seasons. The only strike against him is no cup. Big deal- he's 22. Crosby wouldn't have won a cup without Malkin. Period. Crosby was literally as effective as Hossa this year in the finals- both had 3 pts in 7 games. Well that's not fair, Hossa played on the PK and contributed quite a bit defensively. Who is Ovechkin's Malkin? Semin? Possibly- Semin put up elite numbers this season (>1.3 points per game, led the league in points up until his injury) but was injured for a long period. Semin wasn't his old self when he came back, who knows why. Put it this way- Ovechkin fought and forced your team to 7 games even though his team was inferior on every single level other than goaltending. The Capitals depth is so shallow a f***in' baby could swim in it without drowning. The Capitals defense makes Hall Gill look like an all-star defensemen. (noting that Green is a joke in his own end, as he showed in your series when he was embarrassed by Crosby and Malkin over and over again) He's out scored both since his entry into the NHL, he's out trophied both and he's got cooler hair AND a sweet Segway (oh you're totally jealous of his mailman ride, don't lie). I can understand a Detroit fan arguing that Datsyuk is better- Datsyuk puts up ~100pts a year, is a league leader in face-off percentage AND was voted the leagues best defensive forward two years running. Datsyuk is the most complete player in the game. The argument for him lays in the fact that all three of the guys who outscored him this year are poor defensively (or average depending on the day, noting that Malkin's defensive play in game 7 was impressive- if Malkin works hard, studies and is willing to sacrificing some of his offensive numbers he could become a much more complete player). In the end I think you're a bit blinded by your team's bitter rivalry with the Caps. That's fine- no matter how good Forsberg was in his prime, he played for the Avalanche, so I thought he was a piece of steaming s***