nuts2u

Hossa is by far the better player. The only thing consistent in Franzens game is his inconsistency  When hes in one of his 20 game goal droughts he brings nothing else to the team with his floating around. Hossa plays hard every game and is atleast a threat the defense needs to pay attention to every shift even if hes not scoring. 

 

This. Franzen isn't even close to Hossa's level.

Hossa is by far the better player. The only thing consistent in Franzens game is his inconsistency  When hes in one of his 20 game goal droughts he brings nothing else to the team with his floating around. Hossa plays hard every game and is atleast a threat the defense needs to pay attention to every shift even if hes not scoring. 

Who cares, we have Danny Cleary.

Ryan Kesler? Him Fil and Franzen on a line could be a sick second line.

I assumed Kesler and the twins would be untouchable.  

 

I'd do Howard, Datsyuk and Nyquist for Kesler, Burrows, Edler and Luongo--- assuming Pavel doesn't re-sign

 

Would be an NBA-type trade but hey

 

Really?  I don't think I would.  I want Dats to retire a Red Wing ... couldn't handle seeing him in another uniform.  I'd try to get him to sign a short extension 2-3 years if he wants to play a little longer.  But even if we don't get a single thing back for not trading him if he decides to retire in 2014, I still wouldn't pull the trigger on him.  He is too fun to watch.     

That other angle makes me feel even more confident that his left skate was still on the ice, and that the hit was shoulder to shoulder first then to the head. Lydman being hurt is the only reason that received a penalty at all.

 

The comparisons to the Gryba hit aren't valid anyways since the only reason Gryba got suspended at all was because of the damage done to Eller and the visual of him laying out on the ice in a pool of blood.

 

Then you're blind. He clearly hits the head first in all angles, and even if he leaves his feet after initial contact, you're still not allowed to leave your feet on purpose to make a hit worse. By the way his body was during that hit, it appears that he left his feet in a controlled manor. The only way you don't see it for what it is is if you're a homer. And I am 100% if this were Perry on Datsyuk, you'd be crying for blood. 

 

And the point remains, if Abdelkader kept himself on his feet, and his shoulder down, this would have been a big CLEAN hit, no penalty, no misconduct, no possible suspension. Just another case of Abdelkader being an idiot and making the worst possible play and costing the Wings a playoff game, just like 2009, 2010, and 2011.

Wrap them all in bubble wrap.   I wish Abby had stayed on his feet, but he didn't.  So I can see Shanny having to give him something, if only because it looks like favoritism if he doesn't, as an ex-Wing.

 

Is Lyman actually injured?  Just asking...  not that it matters, but I think it factors in, right?

1. Abby hit WAS NOT a penalty, not now, not then, not in 1935. The Ref was standing two feet from the hit, watching the play with his own two eyes. The Duck had the puck, Ref's attention was not elsewhere.  He watched the guy fall to the ice. He saw it was shoulder on shoulder hit, he saw that Abby was gliding and not "charging" towards him....bulls*** call from a ref 200 feet away and it will be bulls*** if he should get suspended....

 

 

 

#1 principal point of contact was the head, he got body too, but shoulder first went into the head. Rule 48

 

#2 He left his feet on the hit, that's also against the rules, and according to rule 42 that makes it a charge

 

42.1 Charging - A minor or major penalty shall be imposed on a player who skates or jumps into, or charges an opponent in any manner.

 

 

So this is just another case of Abdelkader being a bonehead, and making a stupid play in the playoffs that costs the Wings a game.

People will say that the Abby hit and ensuing 5 minute PP was what lost the Wings the game, but take a look at the PP numbers.  Detroit was 0-for-6 on the PP, which included a 5-on-3.  Anaheim was 2-for-6, with one being on the 5 minute major. Couple that with the fact that Detroit had 9 giveaways, including a horrendous one by Brunner.  The Wings lost this game in the 1st period when they couldn't bury the Ducks as they paraded to the penalty box.

I am guessing by your whining and bitching that you were born 11 years ago ? Any guy that is a true fan that questions the roster 2 periods into game one of a 7 game series is lost. Settle in. Have some faith. Be a fan and not a knee jerk reaction negative nancy like some of your friends on here. We need to be better that is obvious This is our lineup. They all know how to get it done. RELAX

 

LOL - I've been questioning this roster for 3 damned years now - it was clear Holland wasn't planning for the post-Lidstrom era and was and still is infatuated with guys like Sammy and Bert.  Not to mention he gives up 1st round picks for Quincey ( )

 

And from what we've seen all year long, they clearly do have depth issues and will continue to have them as long as we rely on older players who are more fragile (or who have a lot of miles on the tires) and players who have ZERO grit (Ericcson/Flip especially).

 

What other than the last week of the season, has this group done this year to inspire any faith?  This isn't 1997.  And it sure as hell isn't 2002.  Wake up.  The Wings barely got into the playoffs in a shortened season, are playing with basically 1/2 of a d-pair and about 4 legit players in the top 6.  There are some nice parts, but they lack shooting, physicality and any type of legitimate secondary scoring.

 

The better team won tonight.  End of story.  This may be a very quick series unless a completely different Wings team shows up.  Open your eyes already.

 

Do you really think that inserting Samuelsson, who has been addled with a plethora of ailments that have limited him to four games in the past calendar year, is going to make a positive difference?

 

Yeah I don't get the infatuation with Bert playing either.  The guy hasn't played basically at all this year.  Same with Helm.  Inserting them now will only disrupt things and likely lead to further injury.

Franzen could lead the team in points and he'd still get s*** on. He's become the perennial whipping boy around here.

You must not have been on the board when Feds played. That name alone still creates fiery debate and many a suspension on this board!

 

These were the same arguments had then, except Feds had the whole defense thing on his side of the argument (and was immensely more talented even when loafing!).

 

When guys like Yzerman come to be the face of your organization, it becomes hard to accept players who don't give it their all because they are disinterested, not because they are hurt or have things going on in life.

 

Just simply due to interest.

 

I will admit it Yzerman spoiled me, like being the best team in the league for the past 15+ years (not each year, overall most successful org in recent history)  has spoiled some Wings' fans. 

 

I do not like part time players/ guys that only play for big games, but some have no problem with it and even admit that  he has the talent to be a $7M + a year guy, but it is ok because he is only being paid to be half the player he could be!

 

I understand that everyone picks it up a level for big games, I played enough sports at a collegiate level(very bad and very small college) to know that everyone turns it up a notch come post season, even the very bad.

 

But Mule doesn't turn it up a notch, he simply turns it on. 

Whats most frustrating is that if we just would have gotten  15 more games this year of 'present day mule' we are sitting in 3rd or 4th right now.

I asked this before in a Franzen thread:

 

Those of you who think playing like a 4 mil a year player is ok now because it is his cap hit, while he is actually getting paid 5.25 mil this year,  will you still expect him to play like a 4 mil player at age 40?

 

If not, then please stop saying he is a bargain at 4 mil a year.

 

That is his cap hit, not what he is being paid nor what we should expect from him.

 

He has said it, his coach has said, he lacks motivation a lot of times.

 

I am not surprised he is playing very well right now, the Wings have been in playoff mode for weeks, roughly the length of his streak.

 

And the Franzen apologists will come out and say if we put the last few weeks of this season, and the last month or so of season X you will see he is a monster.

WRONG!

 

i will see that he is a floater and plays when and where he wants because you had to pick and choose segments of his seasons.

 

His defensive play as of late is all I need to see to know that he spent the better part of this season disinterested, he is now playing D up and down the ice, 3 weeks ago he wasn't defending anything.

 

When Franzen puts an effort in for a full season, not a couple of months here and a couple of months there, I will back off of him.

 

But he only plays in Mule mode when he thinks it best, I like that about as much as I like diving!

 

He scores around 28 goals a season, however most of that is done in about 2 months worth of effort and work, if he worked as hard the rest of the season as he is working right now he would be in talks for the Art Ross.

 

Instead he is Floater of the Year!

 

 

That is the sickening part, he could be a top flight player in this league. Instead he plays when he wants, at least the last guy that played like this in the Winged Wheel was quite possibly the best defensive forward to ever play the game.

With the large caveat that when Franzen plays with intensity he's one of the best forwards in the game - but the man floated for 35 or more games this year and played like a 9 year old girl at times.

 

A hot streak doesn't mean he's a bargain all of a sudden.  It means he needs to bring that same intensity over the full season instead of just when the Wings backs' are up against the wall.

I don't know about your comparisons. I understand you were making size comparisons, but you just compared Brunner to some of the best small guys to ever suit up. As for the .65 points per game...That's only applicable to the first half of this short season. The guy has been non existent for about a month or two. Once the league got in shape and up to speed, he's vanished. He doesn't even get many scoring chances. I mean, as for the Red Wings sake, they love small skilled forwards that can skate their hearts out on the perimeter, and take really hard shots from the boards..But that's not gonna cut it in this league. I'm also kind of tired of hearing "if he was on a line with a better scorer, or a team with better scoring" No, bad excuse. Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Filpulla, those guys are the scorers, they shouldn't need a top 3 top 6 guy to make them produce more. It should be the other way around, they should be the ones making other guys produce. Aside from Datsyuk, If I was the coach, I wouldn't be please with any of these guys. A guy like Zetterberg, when his scoring falls off (which it does ever year, until the playoffs), he's got great defensive play to keep him on top of the ranks. As for Brunner, Franzen, if they arent scoring they are almost absolutely useless. We have guys like Cleary, Abdelkader, Bertuzzi, Sammuelsson to reap the benefits of our top guys hard work...A guy like Brunner should be replaced with someone that will alone create some space in the middle of the ice instead of rocketeering along the outside and getting benefited from his line mates harder work on the inside.  Thats just my opionion, I respect and understand that others wont see it this way. 

He didn't compare Brunner to St. Louis, Fleury, etc. He was just giving examples of undersized hockey players showing that size isn't everything.

 He's under 30 years old and is about a .65 ppg player in his 1st (partial) NHL season playing on a smaller ice surface, against bigger more physical guys and on a Wings team that unlike in the past CAN'T SCORE WORTH A DAMN!  If Brunner was on a team with better scoring top 6 guys, he'd be a point per game.  Side note, Martin St. Louis is 5'8, and Theo Fleury was 5'6.  Size is the worst argument in hockey for scorers.  Sure I'd love a power forward, but you can be small and successful.  Crosby is under 6'0, Z, Dats, Duchene and so on.  Those guys find ways to compete with the larger guys and given a couple seasons and lots of practice and a summer in an NHL weight room, Brunner will too.  Next year I say he gets 35 goals and 70 points.

 

 

I don't know about your comparisons. I understand you were making size comparisons, but you just compared Brunner to some of the best small guys to ever suit up. As for the .65 points per game...That's only applicable to the first half of this short season. The guy has been non existent for about a month or two. Once the league got in shape and up to speed, he's vanished. He doesn't even get many scoring chances. I mean, as for the Red Wings sake, they love small skilled forwards that can skate their hearts out on the perimeter, and take really hard shots from the boards..But that's not gonna cut it in this league. I'm also kind of tired of hearing "if he was on a line with a better scorer, or a team with better scoring" No, bad excuse. Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Filpulla, those guys are the scorers, they shouldn't need a top 3 top 6 guy to make them produce more. It should be the other way around, they should be the ones making other guys produce. Aside from Datsyuk, If I was the coach, I wouldn't be please with any of these guys. A guy like Zetterberg, when his scoring falls off (which it does ever year, until the playoffs), he's got great defensive play to keep him on top of the ranks. As for Brunner, Franzen, if they arent scoring they are almost absolutely useless. We have guys like Cleary, Abdelkader, Bertuzzi, Sammuelsson to reap the benefits of our top guys hard work...A guy like Brunner should be replaced with someone that will alone create some space in the middle of the ice instead of rocketeering along the outside and getting benefited from his line mates harder work on the inside.  Thats just my opionion, I respect and understand that others wont see it this way.