GMRwings1983

You overreacted. The only Hall of Famer on that team who was in his prime was Lidstrom. All the other greats were slightly or way past their prime. As far as who was the best in history, I'd take the 77 Montreal team, but that's a different debate for a different topic. My point was that the 2001 Avs team was also immensely talented and there are a few arguments one could make for picking them ahead of the 2002 Wings, although I ultimately think the Wings team was better. Oh, also Zetterberg wasn't on that team and neither was Schneider

This league has had so many embarassments recently, that it's hard to feel sorry for it or to make excuses. I love hockey, and the NHL is the most talented league in the world, which is why I watch (assuming I will watch next year if this deal doesn't go through). However, they've done a lot of things to alienate its own fanbase, the biggest one being the lockout and going on some network nobody has ever heard of. It's just one mistake after another, and as long as that clown Bettman is around, many fans are going to point fingers at the NHL's incompetence.

Sakic won the Hart, but most people back then believed Forsberg to be the best player in the world all-around. In either case, they won the Cup without a very important player, which is hard to do and isn't something you see often.

Robitaille sucked in Pittsburgh, even though he scored the game tying goal in game 7 of the SCF against the Blackhawks in the movie "Sudden Death". At the buzzer I may add. Robitaille's numbers benefitted tremendously from playing on the same line with Gretzky and Kurri in LA. Hell, Tomas Kopecky could score 80 points playing on that line.

Will anyone dare put Colorado ahead of Detroit? I mean they gave us a tough series in 2002, and their 2001 team had Ray Bourque and was a hungrier team. Not to mention the won the Cup WITHOUT their best player Forsberg.

What money? The league is fortunate anyone watched their games, whether it was online or not. First they leave espn, then they pull online streaming sites, and now versus may leave DirecTV. Pretty soon the league will force all hockey games to be played in the dark, so that fans can't see the games at all, even if they're in the arena.

The Devils are by far the hardest team to judge, because they benefitted from a trapping style of hockey that wouldn't be allowed nowadays. So the question would be "what rules would they be playing by?" Even so, I think many of you underrated how hard that team was to play against. If they scored first, the game was basically over.

That Carolina team only won the Cup because Roloson, who was Edmonton's best player that year, was injured in the Finals. They barely won a few game 7's and were down 2-0 in the first round. That team was fortunate to have won the Cup at all.

Yeah, but you're forgetting that the 2009 Pens would have the officiating on their side, especially against a team that takes lots of penalties. Hell, there'd be all kinds of records broken in that series for all time PP opportunities in a series.

Yeah, what could be more thrilling than flopping and diving all over the rink and pretending like you're hurt in order to draw penalties. Like Doggy said, screw Forsberg. Only he didn't say screw.

The dumb ass NHL took down atdhe last year, which was by far the best free streaming website. I'm fully convinced that this league doesn't want its fans to watch its games.

I was thinking today of what is the best roster ever assembled in terms of talent. I was considering either NHL or international rosters, but I think that an international roster is stronger, since it basically comprises of all-stars. Anyway, I personally think the 1976 Canada team was the best I've ever seen on paper. Here is their roster: Forwards: Phil Esposito, Bobby Hull, Guy Lafleur, Marcel Dionne, Gilbert Perreault, Bobby Clarke, Darryl Sittler, Steve Shutt, Reggie Leach, Bill Barber, Danny Gare, Lanny McDonald, Pete Mahovlich, Rick Martin Defense: Bobby Orr, Dennis Potvin, Larry Robinson, Guy Lapointe, Serge Savard, Carol Vadnais, Jim Watson Goaltender: Gerry Cheevers, Rogie Vachon Coach: Scotty Bowman, Don Cherry That's the best blueline I've ever seen on paper and the forwards are loaded with Hall of Fame names. I would take this roster over pretty much any other Canada roster, including the '72, '87, or '02 Canadian teams. The Soviet teams were also great, so I'll give them honorable mention too.

Thanks for the explanation. I guess that's one way of doing it. Tomorrow, I'll plug Shanny into your formula to see where he ranks.

In who's mind was he competing with Gordie Howe? I've never seen Bathgate on anyone's top 10 all time players list. Like I said, I look at it points per game, and I don't see how Bathgate was better. Also, like I said, it's too difficult to compare cross-eras and assume that a certain player would or wouldn't be as good if he played in that different era.

How exactly do you adjust points per game per era? That's what I mean in my post above when I said that it's hard to compare players from different eras, because there's two ways of doing it. I look at it points per game, while you have your method. For instance, Howe and Richard's points per game in their prime is way better than Shanny's , so the era has nothing to do with that. With other players, though, I'm not going to immediately put them ahead of Shanny just because it was a different era. Also, you have to compare skill levels. How many guys back then had Shanny's shot power and one-timer, where he scored so many goals. Do I just assume that he wouldn't be as good at it if he played back then?

This is the problem with comparing players from different eras. You're going to look at how good a guy was for his era, while I'm going to judge them cross-era. As I've already pointed out, Shanny has a higher goals per game average than Bathgate. The fact that Shanny didn't make the first or second team a certain amount of times doesn't mean much, when you consider that he along with Robitaille is the best left winger of his era by far. A guy like Leclair or Tkachuk isn't as good as Shanny career wise, which makes their all-star selections look meaningless. Shanny has had way better consistency than Naslund, Leclair, Tkachuk or pretty much anyone from his era. Those guys had a few good years and fizzled out.

This is making it more and more likely that Sammy won't be on the point for their PP. That'll make them less exciting to watch.

Shanny's points per game is slightly better than Lindsay, Abel or Delvecchio. Yeah, those guys were league leaders in stats, but it was a 6 team league. Shanny could never lead the league in all those stats, since he played in the same era as Gretzky and Lemieux. Points per game is more telling than whether they led the league in stats. Other than Gordie Howe, Shanny is the best all-around power forward in league history over a career span. Also, Bathgate was known a great goal scorer, but Shanny's goals per game is higher than his. Larionov is the hardest to judge, since he played overseas in his prime, so I'll hold off on that.

What could Robitaille do as a player that Shanny couldn't do? Yeah, Robitaille was good in front of the net, but Shanny could do that too, except he had a better shot, and could also fight and be a physical force. Also, Robitaille's numbers ballooned from playing with Gretzky in LA. Furthermore, how is Shanny not better than Lindsay, Delvecchio, Larionov, Bathgate and Abel?

That ****** Federko always talks about how unpleasant it was living in Detroit and playing for the Wings. The reject got to play with Yzerman, Probert and Kocur, and yet he's complaining. Ungrateful bastard if you ask me.

I'd put him ahead of anyone, except for Yzerman, Howe, Dionne and maybe Fedorov as far as forwards who played for the Wings. Not many players have 600 goals and well over 2,000 PIM's. His 1300 plus points aren't too shabby either. Don't know how you can say he wasn't better than anyone on eva's list other than Bucyk and Robitaille.

I see, but it still has one major flaw which I didn't expect from you. The omission of Brendan Shanahan, a guy with over 600 goals and 1,300 points.

Wow, you guys are good. Bykov carried Lidstrom to a Norris in 2003, so I didn't mention him. Also, I completely forgot about Myrvold and Boileau. Likewise, I've never heard of anyone on eva's top line nor of Darryl Laplante. Who are those guys?

Most the guys on your list were past their prime when they played for the Wings. I'd take Datsyuk over anyone on your list during their Wings tenure, except for Yzerman, Fedorov, Howe and Delvecchio.

You can do better than that. If you're going to go that route, you have to list Yuri Butsayev, Ladislav Kohn, Maxim Kuznetsov and Yan Golubovsky. Beat that.