GMRwings1983

Thanks for the tip.

I never said Holland did everything right. We won the Cup because we were the hungriest team. Stop putting words in my mouth. Holland is good, but he's not the God he's made out to be. I've always held true to that position. And I didn't complain about fighting in the playoffs because I realized that it wouldn't be necessary based on who we played. Also, there were more important things to worry about then. This is all regular season banter.

Everyone's argument has holes. At least I made one. And McCarty did play in the playoffs. Yes, he's not a great enforcer compared to some, but fighting is still one of the reasons why he's on the roster.

We didn't need Downey in the playoffs because we didn't play any dirty, physical teams. If we played Anaheim or Calgary, then Downey and McCarty would have been absolutely necessary, or the other team would take runs at our players all night without any retribution. I just think it's funny how a few posters on LGW who have been taking Holland's pill for years are unwilling to realize that most of the league for decades has carried enforcers. The Wings success in the last 15 years isn't tied to enforcers one way or another. We didn't have an enforcer in 2006 or 2007. How did those season turn out? As soon as we win the Cup, people now want to ban enforcers from hockey. Typical.

I don't understand how a team finishing last every year in fighting majors is not soft. The way you make it sound, no team is soft. If every team has an enforcer and we don't, then I view that as making us a little softer than the opposition. Also, the rest of the league looks at the Wings as being somewhat of a soft team when it comes to the rough stuff. That doesn't mean the Wings don't work hard and aren't a pain in the ass to play against, but when it comes down to fisticuffs, yes I think we're soft. I guess you have a different definition of toughness than I have. Maybe you're talkiing about "team toughness", while I'm looking at it the way other teams do. Enforcers are fun to have and they don't hurt the team. Some posters like myself think we should have one, while many people don't. I guess it's kind of like a pissing contest.

The fact that enforcers have been a long part of hockey history means to me that they are necessary. You for some reason believe that all that history means s***, and that your opinion on the matter supersedes what teams have done for decades. I can't agree with you on that point. McCarty played in the playoffs last year. The Ducks dressed a bunch of enforcers 2 years ago. Yeah, those guys don't get many minutes, but having them as a fail safe doesn't hurt. Based on your analogy of what's expendable, all 4th liners can be deemed expendable just because they might often be scratched or don't get many minutes. I'll wake up when we sign an enforcer. Until that time, I'll just sleepwalk waiting for the playoffs to begin. This team will be a lot softer without either Downey or McCarty in the lineup. Just look at this team in past years as proof of that. Last year was an improvement mostly because we had Downey, but if we go back to how it was before, that's a major step back in my mind. Also, does anybody find it ironic that most players on the team enjoy having an enforcer in the lineup as backup. Or are those players stupid also like us fighting proponents?

Apparently, Kenny Holland has not only succeeded in spoiling us with winning, but has also succeeded in spoling us into being content with a soft team that struggles to get over 15 fights in any season. In other words, he's pussified many fans on this forum. I differ from most posters in not being content with that and also in understanding that we can win and fight at the same time. Also, as far I see it, we still have expendable players in our lineup that can be replaced by enforcers.

Phaneuf is more of a goal scorer than Lidstrom, and as many have already said, that combined with the voters getting tired of Lidstrom could end his streak.

Absolutely, yes.

They should petition to get Lang's name on the Cup. After all, if not for his clutch goals last year, this team wouldn't have gotten past Calgary or San Jose, thus the young guys wouldn't have gotten enough experience to go all the way this time around.

Because we're men and our aggressive nature draws us towards fighting and enforcers. Also, any time we're in a scuffle I want to feel like the Wings can hold their own, instead of wondering whether Cleary or Franzen are going to get beat down by somebody.

And in your infinite wisdom you believe that not dressing enforcers is the reason they've won, which BTW would be a stupid argument since we had Kocur and McCarty for 2 of those Cup Finals.

Then why does every team have one and why have enforecers existed for decades? Oh, that's right, I forgot it's because everyone is stupid except for the modern day Wings.

Actually the Downey think worked, so I wouldn't bring that up if I were you since it defeats your lousy argument. Downey played in the regular season and did his job, and in the playoffs he wasn't needed because of the opposition that we faced. That's perfectly fine with me. I think when most people scream for an enforcer, they want a guy who can play in the regular season rather than the playoffs. Of course, then the crazy anti-fighting posts like the one you just made come out and destroy the whole point of arguing. Our winning a championship had nothing to do with an enforcer being or not being in the lineup. When will some posters here get that through their thick heads. You act like Downey wasn't even part of the team this season. We just want toughness on the team because it's funner to watch and every other team has an enforcer. If you don't like fighting in sports, go watch basketball or baseball.

The only reason I'm glad he won a Cup is because he was wearing a Wings jersey when he did it. All in all, he'll go down in my mind as a player I despised, and in any other situation I would have hoped that he'd retire without winning a Cup.

These same teammates he's apologizing to are the same assholes who stood by while he was jumped by Andrew Peters after he had already gotten into one fight with Buffalo's goalie. Yeah, I know Emery can take care of himself, but when your goalie gets attacked by the other team's enforcer after he has just fought, those teammates don't deserve any better treatment than what he gave them last year. Screw Ottawa.

It would be kinda cool if he came back and had his career ended with a vicious bodycheck. Since he can't make up his own mind, then maybe someone should do it for him. How's that for your devil's advocate attitude?

Why is Kopecky so overrated here? He's never done anything aside from beating up Patrick Sharp and skating in circles every game. He looks like a bird which has trapped itself inside a dwelling when he's out on the ice. Either Helm or any enforcer worth his salt should get a roster spot over him. Then there's also Sammy, but that's a story for another day.

I'll never forget hearing those stupid divealanche fans cheering each time this retard touched the puck in that game 3. They actually thought he'd make a difference.

The great Robert Lang. Also, that Yzerman dude was on that line from what I remember.

It's hard for Lilja to find takers anymore after what he did to Sharp and Phaneuf. Thus, I doubt he'll get up around 5 fights. Neither Mac nor Downey will play that much, if at all, so that's up in the air. The same can be said for Quincey who I have never actually seen fight. Thus, that leaves us with the great Thomas Kopecky as the only remaning fighter. Hell, based on that I should change my prediction to around 10 fights, unless Franzen or Cleary want to get pummeled again 2 or 3 times.

They haven't won anything for a long time, thus their supremacy has wore off in other fans' minds. Also, they don't play in the U.S. so we don't hear that much about them here.

I guess I was thinking of the playoffs and not the regular season. As far as the fights go, I'd be surprised if we get around 20 this year.

As far as I'm concerned, Lilja should have gotten that locker instead of Hank.

Wasn't that Maltby, Franzen, and Cleary? That would be a great line now, but back then Cleary and Franzen weren't all that good.