GMRwings1983

Getzlaf probably will be next year.

Kopecky wound up with 2 more points than Asham in a similar amount of games. That is something considering the difference in talent that the Red Wings have compared to the Islanders. Also, Asham is obviously a more physical player and a much better fighter than Kopecky. When I put that together, I'd rather have Asham. Yes Kopecky is younger, but it's not like he has some amazing future potential or something. I don't ever see him being more than a 3rd line hack.

I hope this team will be more motivated than the 2003 Red Wings were. Everyone remembers how that embarassment turned out.

I'm sure he won't stand out walking on a crowded street in Moscow.

SOme people here think that Kopecky had a meaningful impact last year. If that's the way to define meaningful, then Asham is a lot more meaningful than Kopecky.

I've always liked him also. He was born on the same day and year as me.

The guy plays there for about 30 games, and they're acting like he turned his back on his whole family. Pens fans are all a bunch of jackasses. Who cares what they think? We heard enough from them as it was during the finals when they trolled here, so there's no reason to talk about them now that they're absent.

The Aurie thing is definitely bizzarre. Someone needs to get Ilitch drunk and force the confession out of him as to why he did what he did to unretire the number.

Unfortunately, concussions are an injury that is too easy to reaggravate. Lindros said he felt O.K. on many occasions also. Just ask the Rangers how that turned out.

Clark Gillies is a HOF'er. No one in the league expects their enforcer to be Clark Gillies, who BTW was not a guy who fought often to be a bona-fide enforcer. Once again, like many others, you have unrealistic expectations of what an enforcer should be.

I don't think we can either. They've got a lot of Canadians who can fight, and they've beaten us the last 2 times we played them in the playoffs.

Damn! I thought this thread was going to be about the movie.

Maybe they're thinking about trading all these forwards they've signed to Toronto for Jeff Finger?

Either Pearl Jam or STP now that they're back together. Yeah, they're not writing many new songs that are great, but they still have way more good songs than Oasis to play at live shows.

When I said that Harvey didn't do anything that no one has done since, but instead changed the game. And I've stayed with that same mindset throughout this thread. I don't know why my position on this is so hard for you to understand. I've been as clear as day so far.

The same could be said for any great defenseman who ever lived, including Lidstrom. They all played with HOF'ers. That doesn't take anything away from what he did.

Oh, I agree with him there. I never said Harvey was dominant, in fact I said the exact opposite when this argument began. Harvey changed the "mindset" around, but Orr was the first who turned that into offensive "dominance". Although it's hard to argue that a guy who won 7 straight Norris trophies wasn't dominant. However, back then it was a 6 team league, so Harvey's dominance must be questioned somewhat. However, his being the first defenseman with an "offensive" mindset can't be questioned in my opinion, which is what I've been arguing all along.

None of them did as much for the offensive aspects of defense as he did. He was the guy that brought that strategy into the mindset of NHL defensemen.

All those guys were important to the evolution of the game, but none of them are as important as Doug Harvey. You're generalizing way too much with your limited knowledge of the game's history.

Statistically that might not seem too impressive compared to today, but back then players didn't play as many games a season. Also, he was still scoring more than the other defensemen were at that time. So yes, Harvey was the first defenseman to add an offensive mindset to his game.

Good one, but we already have plenty of anti-fighting threads going, so you can post your opinions there.

Actually, Doug Harvey redefined the position more than any other defenseman. I don't know if Orr necessarily redefined the position as much as setting a bar that no one has been able to match. The things Orr did no one has been able to do since. Harvey didn't really do anything no one else has done since, but he was the first defenseman to add an offensive mindset to his game, so in my opinion he was the one who redefined the position. It's only lately that I've begun to consider Lidstrom as 2nd best as opposed to 3rd best.

Longevity wise, many people are ahead of Orr already. The reason he's the best are the aforementioned reasons in my previous post, which I won't restate again. Also, there was no lack of talent back in those days anymore than there is now. In fact, I remember there being a thread several weeks ago about how the competition in the 80's amongst defensemen was better than what it is now in Lidstrom's era. You could make a similar argument for the 70's. Personally, I don't think this era is that far above others. Furthermore, believe it or not sports is a popularity contest, and Orr's contribution and status in the game will never be 2nd to any defenseman.

They didn't have to say anything. All they have to do is go out there and impose themselves physically.

Phaneuf, Sharp, Begin and Neil would disagree with you.