Datsyerberger

I've numbered your points to debate them, not necessarily. 4: No, not really, only from a rather silly perspective (Which I shall demonstrate using your other points) 1. Is whacking a chunk of rubber 30 times towards a net an athletic pursuit or an endurance pursuit? How is skill and endurance balanced? Clearly, that particular comment can be made to look rather ridiculous if you don't credit or discuss the factors involved and attempt to oversimplify it. 2. /How much of a factor should mechanical workings really be in a true sport? As much as is needed to facilitate the means to compete in the sport./ /A good NASCAR driver is only as good as his pitcrew and the guys who build/maintain his car. Pit crew... tech crew... read, TEAM. They're all part of a team, utilizing different physical and mental abilities to achieve a competitive goal./ /You can certainly say the mechanics and crew are part of the driver's team, that's very true. But they're a much different part of the team... they aren't doing something athletic (aside from the high-speed pit crew maintenance). Yes, they aren't all doing something athletic (those pit guys are nuts, though). Then again, neither are coaches (except practices), GMs, scouts, or any number of non-player parts of the team who are necessary to maintain a team's competitiveness./ /A huge part of shooting the puck is really the stick's curve./ /Drafting a top 4 defensman with the last pick is kick ass (I'm a Wings fan- I can appreciate it!), but it's not athletic./ /There's really no other sport that relies so heavily on something outside the sporting aspect as NASCAR does. Ever seen bobsledding without the sled? Skateboarding without the skateboard? Baseball without the ball bat? All technical innovations to one degree or another that may seem simple in today's age (as the ICE-powered car will one day be seen) but crucial to the sport.. sure, you could hit a baseball without the bat, and run around Daytona for a while without the car../ / Even luge and other sled sports are highly standardized. NASCAR is relatively standardized. Tweaks to the car can be viewed as different stick curves or different ways of lacing your skates./ / I understand that NASCAR tries to use the rules to reign in some of the 'money buys speed' aspects of the builds, but they can't eliminate the experimental nature (and thus somewhat luck based) of stock car racing. I'd say drafting names like Sergei Fedorov was, at the time, rather experimental in nature and luck-based/ /Wasn't it Jeff Gordon that people mocked for having his daddy buy him a shot by funding a sweet ass car? Jeff Gordon is a ****** canoe. Then again, so is Claude Lemieux. Doesn't make him any less of a competitor./ 3. Is it fair that mechanical endurance/reliability plays such a large part in a sport? That is a huge factor in a game. If your skate comes loose or significantly breaks you're screwed no matter how good of a skater you are. 5. There isn't really a sport NASCAR compares to, besides other vehicular sports. They're a relatively new and unique breed. Hell, it wasn't until relatively recently that competitive dancing, even when involving a team, was recognized as a sport (too 'feminine', probably). Edit: It's even more fun to discuss pro gaming/cybersports as a sport.

It's not possible anymore. Back in the day, $ could be part of the deal. Draper was acquired for $1 because Winnipeg was folding, and they were literally handing out their players for pennies (there technically had to be some assets coming their way for it to be considered a trade).

As much as I dislike the sport, and as much as I crack on it being a bunch of guys driving around a circle for the entertainment of a bunch of drunk rednecks, I have to disagree with that statement. 10-20 laps on an aggressive semi-pro racing circuit (one that only sustains speeds at maybe 2/3 of NASCAR speeds is probably enough to burn most of us out to the point where we can barely breathe. NASCAR drivers are a very specialized sort of athlete, and the sort of conditioning they undertake is different from that of most other athletes. The fact is, though, is that only a small percentage of the population has the right combination of mental and physical attributes (coordination, mental stamina, hand-eye, reflexes, cardiovascular system, heat tolerance, etc) needed to be a NASCAR (or any other high end racing) driver. Fewer still have the skill and will to compete at such a high level. There's a reason that there are tons of schools (similar to CHL and so on) and amateur and semi pro leagues (equivalents to UHL, AHL, so forth) and that only a select few make it to the top (just like the NHL). They're a select few, a rare breed, one both capable and trained to withstand and compete with and under the physical and mental rigors of the competitive activity. I'm no fan of NASCAR (it bores me to death and reminds me of the taste of Bud Light, eeechhh) but I tend to find statements as such to be made either in spite, profound ignorance, or both.

Not that I'm saying I support it, but if there were ever a checking line player that should have his number retired by an organization, Draper is the guy. 1000 games with the team, most of them as 3rd line center, a Selke, tons of PK time, faceoff domination, a crucial part of 4 cups, and a leader. What a guy.

You fail to mention that Datsyuk is a more physical player than Marleau this year, the massive discrepancy in their TA:GA (which is not the end-all be-all for a Selke, but certainly an examinable factor to determine their respective control over the puck), and how, upon observation, Datsyuk is clearly the more dominating player on the ice. This is going to sound insanely homer of me, but so be it because I believe it: Datsyuk is one of the most clearly dominant players on the ice (puck/game-control wise) since Bobby Orr, and is probably about as close to you can get to such with the league's current talent level and parity.

Refer to my post earlier in this thread. Furthermore, regarding the bolded, I actually did a write-up earlier in the year in another thread regarding this particular bit. After research, I found out that the most successful teams in the NHL currently (San Jose, Boston, Detroit, Calgary, Washington, a handful of other playoff teams) all spend around 32-36 million on their top 5 players, with the 33-34 mil Detroit would spend on those 5 right in the midrange of the most successful teams. The primary differences between Detroit and the other teams which do this are the following: 1. Most teams top 5 contracts include a goalie. That's never been the modus operandi for Detroit, as we know. 2. Due to the discounts players take in Detroit, their top 5 is by far the most talented in the NHL (#1 d-man, top 10 d-man, arguably #1 forward, top 10 foward, top 20 forward). Now, on further examination, I found spending between 12-15 million on the next 5 is also within the norm for the most successful teams, and that the remaining salary distributed to fill in the bottom 6/holes was around 10 million, give or take a couple.. as, agan, is showed by your example. Thus, it would seem that the formula to success in the cap era is having a "key" top 5 (6 mil + players), a "core" second 5 (2-5 mil players), and then reasonably fill out the holes with roleplayers and cheap young talent. The Wings would not be doing anything out of the norm with this, but rather, continuing the most successful practice. TL;DR: In Kenny We Trust.

I'm with you too, believe it or not (two Red Wings fan sticking up for a Blues fan.. what's the world coming to?) I started GMing a Blues fantasy team right after the All-Star break and watched a lot of their games to familiarize myself more with their players. Some impressive young talent coming up for sure.

The difference between Grigs and Daigle is "big time bust" meant epic fail for Daigle, and "big time bust" for Grigs meant a near-fatal, life-changing car wreck.

Classy move by Sid... Smart move by Savard. Noone wants to get it in the jewels.

Well, actually, it's closer to 9.3 free next year. If Hossa signs for 6.1, that's 3.2 left. Counting that with all the contracts Wings have right now for sure (including the likely permanent callups: Helm, Ericsson, Howard): Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom Cleary - Flip - Hossa ? - Helm - ? Maltby - Draper - ? Raffi - Lidstrom Kronwall - Ericsson Lilja - Stuart Lebda Meech Osgood Howard That's 55.614, unless I can't use a calculator right.. say the cap is 57 (it's current 56.7 and it's been suggested it'll go up a nudge this year). That's 1.386 left. In my opinion, Lebda gets traded or something, so that's just a little over 2m. UFAs: Franzen -- Gets a nice payday somewhere. He's earned it. Chelios -- Crumbles into dust. Samuelsson -- Gets a decent 2m or so somewhere else. Every slapshot against us from him is top corner. Kopecky -- Re-signs for around .6 Downey -- Re-signed for league minimum (.475). D-Mac -- Isn't re-signed. Maybe retires, maybe plays in GR. Conklin -- Gets a 1A/1B role somewhere. RFAs: Hudler -- Lands us a 1st and a 3rd, or more. OR Flip gets traded and Hudler gets a similar salary. Leino -- Resigned for .9 1.975 spent there. Couple hundred thousand under the cap. A tight year again, but I think that was expected. There's a possibility Lilja gets traded, that frees up a little space. He's gonna be worth probably the most he'll ever be worth this off-season. If someone minor gets injured, LTIR and call-ups from our massive depth in GR. If someone major gets injured, we just play with 3 and a half lines like we have a few times this season. Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom Cleary - Flip - Hossa Leino - Helm - Kopecky Maltby - Draper - Downey (Meech) Raffi - Lidstrom Kronwall - Ericsson Stuart - Lilja? Meech Osgood Howard If you think that isn't depth, you need to be slapped around a bit with a large trout. Just for grins, here's one of Franzen and Hudler (Unless you think they're gonna combine for 6.1m or less, which I doubt) and Sammy kept instead of Hossa. Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom Franzen/Hudler - Flip - Sammy (One of Franzen/Hudler around 3, 3.5, Sammy around 2) Leino - Helm - Cleary Maltby - Draper - Kopecky Downey (Meech) Raffi - Lidstrom Kronwall - Ericsson Stuart - Lilja? Meech Osgood Howard Basically, same thing, with .5-1m more cap space left, probably used as wiggle room for callups. So would you rather have Hossa, or one of Franzen/Hudler + Sammy + A bit extra cap space? Given that we've seen how well Kenny handles the cap space situation (we're only sitting within the top 3 in the league again).. well, I know which I want. A side note: I firmly believe Downey is going to be re-signed next year, and not only that but have a permanent roster spot. Holland, Stevie and crew talked him out of retirement this previous off season, and I doubt he went along just to play in GR and get a handful of NHL games. I think he was promised a roster spot for this upcoming year, with the management knowing he'd be a cheap, effective, and POPULAR solution to a bottom line roster spot.

Edit: Double post

Edit: LGW went down when I was posting and garbled this

eva is a serious downer on Datsyuk and has been pretty sore about it ever since the Selke last year, but I'm going to agree with him on Lidstrom. He has dropped off a little this year, yes, but that just narrows the gap. Here was last year: Lidstrom Ovy, Dats, Crosby, Malkin, Chara, etc. Now this year it's more like: Lidstrom Ovy, Dats, Chara, Malkin, Crosby, etc

Something similar to this, followed by Hossa, 7+ years at $6.1m.

Now that I've done my 'real' list, here's my satirical list: Art Ross Trophy - Malkin Lester B. Pearon Award - Malkin Hart Trophy - Malkin (media drools over points) Vezina Trophy - Mason (he's liek yung lololololol) Norris Trophy - Mike Green (see Hart) Calder Trophy - Mason (see Vezina) Lady Byng Trophy - St. Louis (10 PIMs! 10!) Frank Selke Trophy - Mike Richards (See Hart; short handed GOALS = defensive skill, amirite?) Jack Adams - Hitchcock (even though it's Mason's Vezina-winning performance carrying the team...) Maurice "Rocket" Richard - Ovechkin Masterson - Whoever got the worst injury/disease and is still playing this year

We score off PPs from the instigator penalties that get called for scraps that start after Kronwall hits. You heard it here first.

Art Ross Trophy - Malkin Lester B. Pearon Award - Malkin (My personal vote would be Dats) Hart Trophy - Malkin again (Ovy 2nd, Parise 3rd, Dats 4th) Vezina Trophy - Thomas Norris Trophy - Lidstrom (2nd Chara, 3rd Green) Calder Trophy - Mason (by a long shot) Lady Byng Trophy - Datsyuk (around the same PIMs as last year with a more physical game) Frank Selke Trophy - Datsyuk (2nd in TA, insanely good TA:GA ratio, high +/-, hits, feared reputation) Jack Adams - Julien (or Sutter, toughy imo) Maurice "Rocket" Richard - Ovechkin Masterson - Whoever got the worst injury/disease and is still playing this year

Anyone else watching this? I sorta am. Having to 'cheer' for the Ducks is painful, but Duck Guy being an alright dude is a little bit of consolation as far as that goes. And the Sharks have LePew, possibly the only thing worse than having Pronger... Sheesh, look at me trying to rationalize.

And then pistol whip Pronger, amirite?

Carlyle during the time out: "Okay, Chris, you huge buffoon, elbow Marleau's head into the boards and stomp on his leg. Perry, you're a dirty little s***, go board someone. Niedermayer brothers, take a nice vacation."

Jesus, everywhere but the back of the net.

Semenov, you're such a worthless tool.

Those schmucks the Ducks need to wake the f***s up and with some lucks put some pucks in the net.

Lol Moen.

Both goalies playing well, SJ on a cold streak, the Ducks in suck mode..