Coolio Mendez

I prefer Datsyuk to Zetterberg. He's 'prettier' to watch and I think he's a smarter player than Zetterberg (in fact, I think Datsyuk is one of the smartest players in the league) Zetterberg needs Datsyuk more than Datsyuk needs Zetterberg. Whenever the two have been split up in the past, Datsyuks production has been relatively constant while Zetterbergs production drops off quite a bit.

Would love to see any of these guys in red come playoff time.

Not by any means comparing Yzerman to Iginla leadership wise, but Iginla was voted best leader amongst current NHLers by the active players. Who am I to question what the players know? Ultimately the points between the two cancel each other out (keep in mind if Datsyuk continues to play at the same level this will be his first year to surpasses Iginla in point department) you prefer Datsyuk's defensive mastery and I prefer Iginla's leadership and grit. To-May-to, To-Mah-To.

One Datsyuk is a center the other is a RW. The center better be the better face-off guy. They are both great players, Iginla has been around longer playing at a high level so that counts in their rankings. Iginla is a goal scorer, Datsyuk is a playmaker, generally we put more value on goals. One thing that is valued so high is leadership. Iginla the best leader in the game. He's the epitome of what captain is and should be. A leader of men. I can teach an idiot how to skate, pass, and shoot the puck. I can't teach leadership. A guy who will do whatever is needed. A goal, a hit, a fight...whatever.

307 NHL GMs and Scouts have Iginla ranked #1 overall in the NHL, and he's been there since January of 08. I happen to agree. He hits He leads He fights He plays defensively He's a playmaker He scores Non of the guys you have mentioned have all the tools....if so not nearly the same level. If Iginla weren't in the West, he'd be a much bigger star in the league. In fact, if I were starting a franchise from scratch, he'd be my choice as its cornerstone. While you could argue better skill available, you can't argue everything else Iginla would bring to the table.

If you were to trade bewtween the 2....I believe the trade would be a wash. I believe that Datsyuk fits in better to Detroit's 'team first' attitude and Ovechkin fits in better to Washington's 'Ovechkin-centric' offense. What would Detroit gain with Ovechkin? - a few years What would Detroit lose with Ovechkin - bigger cap hit - less disciplined play - less defensive skill What would Washington gain with Datysuk - smaller cap hit - defensive skill up front What would Washington lose with Datsyuk - a few years - some offense The more I think about this, this is one of those trades that could possibly be a lose-lose for both teams. Both teams have their offense primarily driven around these two players. Datsyuk feeds Zetterberg and the two of them have an uncanny ability to find one another. Backstrom feeds Ovechkin and they two have an uncanny ability to find one another. IFF Datsyuk plays on a line with Semin and Backstrom both, then this deal would work out well for Washington because Ovechkin and Zetterberg would never complement one another (nor would Ovechkin and Franzen). Dastyuk is the better skater, the better puckhandler, and the smarter player. He's a team first player. Ovechkin is a faster skater, and has a better shot, and is far away a flashier player. But whereas Datsyuk leads the NHL in takeaways, Ovechkin leads in giveaways. Datsyuk is the type of player that all teams would love (if he could only fight than he would rival Iginla as the leagues premier player) and he currently excels in the team first dynamic that Detroit has. If Detroit had a bona fide goal scorer in the Ovechkin/Kovalchuk/Heatley mode, Datsyuk would a perennial contender for the Art Ross. Ovechkin on the other hand is not as well loved around the league as Washington fans would have the world believe. He is prone to taking nnecessary hits (as per his own coach and GM), he is prone to taking unnecessary shots (as evidenced by his league leading missed shots total), and he has led the NHL in giveaways two years running. Fortunately, he is deadly around the net, and has matured into one of the great goal scorers. As long as there is someone to get the puck to him, he'll find a way to put it in. But, this is a trade both teams would lose as the effect of losing your offensive cornerstone would be difficult to overcome despite the trade being a straight up of two superstars. BIG question mark I have about Ovechkin, and a question mark I had with Lecavalier 5-6 seasons ago. It's great to be extremely talented, and be a superstar. But at some point, you need to gain maturity for the game and be able to read it. It took Lecavalier a while to do that. Ovechkin hasn't got there yet. At the risk of ruining my reputation. Had Alexandre Daigle showed any desire to gain maturity for the game, and learn how to read it and be a team player, people would have a lot more respect for him and he might have become a solid NHLer (and maybe even still be playing). Another way to look at it: If Datsyuk was drafted 1st overall, and was thrust into the NHL as a 1st line forward, I think he would have done a lot better than 35 points. In Datsyuk's rookie season Detroit had guys with the last names of Robitaille, Hull, Shanahan, Fedorov, Kozlov, and one name escapes me.......oh yeah.........Yzerman. A team that won the Stanley Cup. Ovechkin came into a team with names like Halpern, Zubrus, Willsie, Sutherby, Pettinger (shall I continue?) Patrick Kane led the Chicago Black hawks in scoring last year for 2 reasons. One, Havlat was injured for ages, and Two, he WAS the man. Steve Stamkos is NOT leading the Lightning in scoring this year for three reasons, Lecavalier, St. Louis, and Prospal. Datsyuk's development happened because there were hall of famers ahead of him. Stamkos' development is happening because there are recent Richard and Ross trophy winners ahead of him. Ovechkin's sudden stardom happened because he was talented and was givent 22 minutes of ice time (Datsyuk only broke the 20 minute mark last year, and played 13 minutes as a rookie). I took their situations in hand. Who is the better player? Ovechkin, but not by much. Given the teams involved, I don't make the trade. Now, had he said Zetterberg for Ovechkin (and since Detroit fans consider Zetterberg and Datsyuk almost as equals)............I do that trade in a heartbeat if I'm Detroit because Ovechkin's offensive sensibilities outweigh Zetterberg's defensive mastery. I can go on........ That being said I'd rather have Crosby or Iginla over both.

It would be nice if Holland would lock up Conks and for a while. we will have Oz and Conks, and just trade Howie and then bring up Liv once Ozzies contract is over and he retires.

Unless he improves his skating, he's going to find the NHL very challenging. I'm not completely sold on Tavares, as far as superstar status I don't think he has the talent of Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin, Iginla, Thornton, Lecavalier (shall I go on). The OHL had an incresae in goals/game this year, and Tavares stayed at the 2.00pts/game. He's been playing at the same level for four seasons, which is a concern. This doesn't even put him in the top 10 for a 18 yr old Even Craig Hartsburgh and Brent Sutter have said he's not the phenom that everybody is talking about. Hartsburgh went to far as to say he's a special player on the power play (and he is) but he's just another player on the ice 5 on 5. As I already said, he needs to work on skating, he needs to work on 5 on 5 positioning. He takes hits well, he has a great shot, he has pretty good hands............and he adapts well. Last year he was a goal scorer, and this year everybody cut that off and he became a playmaker. He's a little weak defensively, but that is on par for the CHL as these are all kids who were the offensive stars of the AAA teams. He has talent, and he has potential, but doing a quick comparison to OHL stars of the past and looking at their NHL careers, he's not a phenom..

Tavares has been pegged as the first overall draft in the 2009 draft since 2005. He was granted exceptional status which allowed him to join the OHL at 15 years of age. He's been the talk of the hockey world since 2006. As for the game against Slovakia, most NHL scouts are still very disappointed in his skating. He still ranks behind Sweden's Victor Hedman on a lot of team lists. His point totals in the OHL have NOT set the world on fire. He has never averaged more than 2 points a game in the OHL (something that Patrick Kane did as an OHL rookie 2 years ago averaging 2.5 points a game). Taylor Hall and Cory Hodgson are both averaging more points/game this year in the OHL than Tavares There's a lot to like about Tavares, but there's a lot of room to improve. He's a very good player, but not a great player. You need to wipe out your competition to be considered great. I'm still waiting for him to wipe them out.

Theodore was caught on camera at a hells angels party in a Hells angels clubhouse. The loan sharking operation was his father and brothers, well they did the jail time anyway- he probably financed the operation although that was only speculation and never charged or proven. I think NHL games could be fixed especially by younger players who have significant roles on the team but are still paid a low entry level salary. The mess there is getting crazy, although as more players look like bad guys some pressure comes off Gainey and Carbonneau. Maybe you can fire the team and keep the coach. Mtl definitely have some leadership issues. Hamerlik's name implicated surprises me- not the other two. Anybody remember this The Riberio video reminds me of the last troublesome trio there in Mtl who were partying too much and associating with the wrong crowd. Riberio Theodore and Pierre Dagnais. All three were moved out by Gainey. I wonder what the fallout with these will be, this is the team that got rid of Carbonneau after giving a reporter the finger on a golfcourse. La Presse is one of the more respected papers in the city. The Journal de montreal is the tabloid that people at least I take with a grain of salt. La presse usually have facts to support their stories. Although I think it was La Presse that wrote the Basilie said that Gillete said that Habs were for sale story. There I think it was probably something taken out of context. This one I think there is something too. At the end of the day they can rent a room at Chez Pare if they want, associate with any criminal the want as long as the show a little effort an Heart on the ice. The off ice stuff is affecting the on ice product I'm sure but as a fan I only care about the 12 losses in 15 games. Fix that!! If that means fixing off ice issues go for it but its time for the men on this team if there are any to step up and be accountable. Lets see if Kovalev is one, does he have any pride left?

Read page 4 I've answered this already.......

Some people probably feel that Rafalski is having a better year than Lidstrom. Chara has Wideman, Lidstrom has Rafalski, and Mike Green has Tom Poti?

Tell that to Scott Stevens a hard hitter who personified the defense-first mentality, Craig Ludwig who was well-known for his shot-blocking ability. Both these guys combined have a total of zero Norris's. How come Mike Komiskarek get any considerations? He one of the best if not best at blocking shots, plays the PK, great in his own end and a fierce hitter. His play defines defense. It's no secret if you have the numbers your getting the vote.

I'm not comparing careers, I'm talking 08-09 season. This year, Wideman and Chara have BOTH been better than Lidstrom. I'd also have Boyle ahead of Lidstrom. Amongst defencemen- -Lidstrom is tied for 9th in goals - tied for 7th in assists - tied for 6th in +/- Yet you think he is a possible frontrunner? At this pace, he will be lucky to finish in the top 5 in voting!

May I ask what games have YOU been watching? Mike Green is NOT badl in his own zone, in fact he has improved considerably this season! Norris is for best "all around" Dman.....Green has been that guy.

Most of you posters knocking Green, have you guys ever watched him play? He's very good defensively (he's noted around the league for his positional play). The primary knock against him is that he's not the greatest of skaters, but he makes up for that with his shot and positional play.

I put some stock in takeaways and giveaways but let's not get too carried away, it is a "second page" stat. That being said I look more at the giveaway/takeaway differential then I do at the two stats individually. If you are a star and getting lots of ice time and taking risks and coughing up the puck a ton then I want to see you on the stat on the other side as well where you are stealing the puck alot. As a defencemen, Scott Neidermayer would be a prime example......sure he has alot of giveaways but he has more takeaways. Souray and O'Donnell are two of the worst.......so I think it has it's merits. It shows you are responsible with the puck and make good decisions.Lets be honest, offensive numbers count bigtime in this award. It is supposed to go to the best all round in the position- not the best defensively. If it was Craig Ludwig would have won one for blocking shots and Scott Stevens would have a truckload of them.

Last summer, Lidstrom's own President (and the guy who drafted Lidstrom) said that he doesn't have Lidstrom in his top 20 and that Denis Potvin was the best defenceman he ever drafted.

25 years ago there was a guy on the Oilers who was widely considered a defensive liability (Mike Bossy called him a pylon) but he would score at will.............and he could skate like the wind. Paul Coffey won two consecutive Norris trophies..............simply by threatening Bobby Orr's records (and coming within 2 goals of becoming the first defenceman to score 50). Both years that he won...........he led all NHL defensemen in giveaways. Randy Carlyle won a Norris trophy by leading all NHL D-men in points and giveaways AND was a -16.

The numbers are extremely accurate as they just obtain the tally as provided by the NHL for each game. Teams are required by the NHL to report attendance as the number of tickets sold, and not turnstile count (In February 1977, the Sabres played a home game.............pictures taken at the game suggest that the attendance was a few hundred..........NHL records indicate the attendance was 16,000+). As part of the current CBA, teams are required to provide proof of the sale. The numbers are a lousy indicator of local interest in a team For example, during the 50s and 60s, 90s and this decade.... the Red Wings were 100% capacity. In the 70s and 80s, this nuimber dipped below 80% a couple of times. Similar stories for the Black Hawks and Bruins over the last 20 years.

Meant to quote and reply to you...read above post.

Milwaukee falls within Chicago's territorial rights and the Wirtz family is seeking $150MM from the owner of any team that wants to put a team there.

That would make for a much more interesting trade, Ovie for Datsyuk. I believe that Datsyuk fits in better to Detroit's 'team first' attitude and Ovechkin fits in better to Washington's 'Ovechkin-centric' offense. What would Detroit gain with Ovechkin? - a few years What would Detroit lose with Ovechkin - bigger cap hit - less disciplined play (having Hossa is bad enough) - less defensive skill What would Washington gain with Datysuk - smaller cap hit - defensive skill up front What would Washington lose with Datsyuk - a few years - some offense The more I think about this, this is one of those trades that could possibly be a lose-lose for both teams. Both teams have their offense primarily driven around these two players. Datsyuk feeds Zetterberg and the two of them have an uncanny ability to find one another. Backstrom feeds Ovechkin and they two have an uncanny ability to find one another. IFF Datsyuk plays on a line with Semin and Backstrom both, then this deal would work out well for Washington because Ovechkin and Zetterberg would never complement one another (nor would Ovechkin and Franzen). Dastyuk is the better skater, the better puckhandler, and the smarter player. He's a team first player. Ovechkin is a faster skater, and has a better shot, and is far away a flashier player. But whereas Datsyuk leads the NHL in takeaways, Ovechkin leads in giveaways. Datsyuk is the type of player that all teams would love (if he could only fight than he would rival Iginla as the leagues premier player) and he currently excels in the team first dynamic that Detroit has. If Detroit had a bona fide goal scorer in the Ovechkin/Kovalchuk/Heatley mode, Datsyuk would a perennial contender for the Art Ross. Ovechkin on the other hand is not as well loved around the league as Washington fans would have the world believe. He is prone to taking nnecessary hits (as per his own coach and GM), he is prone to taking unnecessary shots (as evidenced by his league leading missed shots total), and he has led the NHL in giveaways two years running. Fortunately, he is deadly around the net, and has matured into one of the great goal scorers. As long as there is someone to get the puck to him, he'll find a way to put it in. But, this is a trade both teams would lose as the effect of losing your offensive cornerstone would be difficult to overcome despite the trade being a straight up of two superstars. I can go on......

I'm sorry, as soon as you had Mike Modano in the same boat as Wayne Gretzky I couldn't continue. Modano isn't even the best leader on his team!

Couldn't have said it better