Carman

Umm.. at first I was like then I was like then I was like now I'm like .

Hossa was even more clutch for the Penguins then Franzen was for the Wings... I can say about Hossa that he has proven to be a much more consistent scorer over his career. He has had more 30 goal seasons then Franzen has played total. Not taking past events into your decision is very negligent. Franzen has never played great two seasons in a row, sure he has been close to on par with Hossa since the playoffs last year, but Hossa has been doing it for 7 more years then Franzen. Franzen also has not been impressive physically, defensively, and passing. I hate using injuries against a player, but I think it's a testament to Hossa's game that he can still be a force and not get injured (as often). He has played every NHL season with over 70 games, the guy is simply amazing in that respect. I mean you're free to say you like Franzen as a player more then Hossa, I don't agree with it, but if you are going to say it at least back it up with something other then a small sampling of stats after the team has clinched a #2 seed and are apparently packing it in as a team. EDIT: Nice little jab in your editt calling me a highly devoted/irrational, thanks.

It really won't matter whose in net, in two years we could have Luongo and some the fans would swing into a fit about bringing McCollum after a few rough patches for Luongo(Which will happen and does happen to ever freaking goalie in history).

You insinuated that Franzen "wants it more" by what appears to be by basing it off the last 14 games. It irritates me to no end - people that try and appear to judge a PROFESSIONAL players' 'drive', or 'desire'. Especially when they are going to base their entire opinion on 14 games of the season. This isn't so much a matter of who you would like more, as Franzen -if he keeps up the scoring pace- would be a better option due to money constraints. But to say 'Franzen scored 3x as much as Hossa in the past 14 games' and use it as backing to 'Franzen wants it more' just really irks me=( Sorry for a mini rant. Woke up on the wrong side. Really could use a wings victory today... haha

You can't be serious, you just cannot be serious...

**********DISCLAMER I'M NOT TAKING ANYTHING AWAY FROM FRANZEN HE HAS REALLY COME INTO HIS OWN AND I REALLY LOOK FORWARD TO A BRIGHT FUTURE FOR HIM********************** That said this thread is unsettling to me. Using incidental statistics to try and prove a players worth over which player would be a better long-term investment...? When Franzen gets to the .80 PPG mark for more then a year in a row let me know, and I'll gladly actually go into a in-depth debate over which player is better. But until then a hot and cold, late-blooming, 6'3" frame with a 5'5" mindset so called "power forward" will always take a back seat to a complete player like Hossa, on my team at-least. Of course barring salary cap and etc. which is really too complicated to get into.

Well the question is when is Larrson/Howard be ready. I think if anything we need a good veteran stop gap if this post season doesn't go as planned with the Conklin/Osgood deal. If we do well in the playoffs Conference Finals~ and lose, but not about the goaltending it will be Conklin-Osgood(Whichever played better)/Howard most likely. But if the duo burns to dust in the playoffs both will be gone and some moves will be made for a veteran goalie/Howard. Just my opinion.

Going to Ovechkin or Thomas. I think it probably should go to Parise, but I don't see it happening.

It's definitely not going to hurt. I'm sure it would be a good change to add some new blood to snap back into playoff form. Also Ericsson probably doesn't have the experience on the PP, but to be honest seeing Meech out there I have no justification for...

I'm defintely against the *training* arguement, women are free to be involved in every single training program a male is allowed into. Especially at the top level. I have a very hard time believeing those Olympic women are neglected when it comes to equipment/ice time.

Yep, it should have been saved especially at that moment in a big game. I was just pointing out that it wasn't all on Conklin, we aren't helping the goalies in general as much as we should. There is absolutely no reason Backes should have been that open on that play. Well, all I can say is at least we aren't paying our goalies 7 million a year, because I think people would start jumping off of bridges if a goalie gives up a bad goal.

It's not like we have other options, so let's all hope for the best. :stanley:

In Conklin's defense on that 5-4 go ahead goal that he will probably want back. Having a player one-time a shot from right in front of the net/bottom of the circle isn't the best coverage. It's a combination of two issues, let's hope it can be corrected with playoff hunger.

Eh, agreed they aren't the most talented player for player, but they could definitely compete and if Ryan Miller gets hot who knows what could happen. The offense can probably skate with any other country, but their defense is almost as weak as Russia's. Should be a very competitive tournament.

Unfortunately this is exactly what I was thinking. But I'm sure he will do a hell of a job, should be extremely exciting.

Fair enough, I'll agree that McCrimmon isn't as big of an issue as I first believed. The more I think about it if it was just him it would have been long taken care of by now. We'll see in the off-season if I'm correct about him being here next season or not. Won't know until then.

Well-deserved for him.

I don't mean to call you out on this, but defensive/assitant coaches have a heavy heavy influence on the defensive scheme. It's very much like football in that respect. There is a difference in the style the wing's have been playing and I feel that should have some blame on the team giving up ~200 more shots then they did last season. EDIT: I'm also not saying it's 100% McCrimmon's fault certainly the players have to hold some accountability. I don't think I've said that, I just feel he is going to be the expendable one if this situation continues into the playoffs. If you don't agree with me that's fine, not the end of the world.

Are the overall goals down? Or are the goals getting more spread out throughout team's lineups? In mean the wing's don't have a 40 goal scorer, but are scoring a ton. Too lazy to look it up, haha.

Absolutely, I completely agree that the effort hasn't been there all season. I'm just finding it hard to believe that the 'cup hangover' is the only reason for the defensive play. McCrimmon's system has never been very successful in any city he has been in, to me it just seems like he has to have a part of the blame aswell. There have been breakdowns this season that have been due to positioning of the forwards which doesn't have as much to do with the effort as much as it has to do what they are being told to do. Either way no one can stop this team if they play their best. Let's all hope they find that switch and maybe if they are playing 100% they will look like a completely different team in the defensive zone.

Yes. Yes I am. It's pretty evident if you watched the games from last year to this year. The Wing's are playing a much more conservative style and are letting many more shots on net then they have last season. They are making adjustments and lately the play has changed, but just switching the coverage that they have played all year is near impossible especially if McCrimmon believes in it thoroughly. It can also be a lack of effort that is causing some of the breakdowns aswell, but the blame is going to come on the coach moreso then the players. Edit:Also sorry if I'm sounding a little testy , don't mean to. Just giving my opinion on the subject. I don't mean to say that McCrimmon is the sole reason for the defensive lapses, but I believe he is the easiest target if the worst case scenario plays out in the playoffs.

Well McCrimmon has a lot to do with the overall position and defensive scheme the team has ran. I'll give you the goalies haven't been spectacular, but neither has the overall defensive zone play in front of them. If all these goals where coming from the red-line I'd be on board with the goalie bashing, but a lot of these goals have came from breakdowns/giveaways that have been present much more this season then last. Defensemen are only as good as their system allows. I've never seen a team play so loose in front of the net, and the collapse of the forwards seem much more hesitant then they did in the past. If you feel like going on a tirade about how you feel the goaltending is the only problem at least do me a favor and watch the difference between the defensive scheme last year/ or watch how San Jose collapses and are much more forceful and insistent then the laid back conservative play of this season by the wings'.

Brad McCrimmon is not going to be here next year. I have a pretty good feeling about that. It's not all his fault, but it's a lot easier to replace/blame a coach then find new d-men. Most of the breakdowns happen because of coverage in front of the net, usually that's because of two things 1. Defensive system 2. Strength/Size/Quickness of the d. And considering the talent of the Wing's D there has to be a change somewhere and he is the scapegoat. I could go way-more in-depth about how McCrimmon's system is just ugh. If you want a quick reference watch a San Jose game and pay attention to the differences and how their forwards are much more involved down low like we were last season. Also on the goal that people are blaming Conklin for playing the puck, It's the defensemen's job to assert himself and call for the goalie not to play the puck. The fault will always go more to the player then the goalie in that situation. It's not like Conklin had all day to make a decision. I'm also not going to bag on Ericsson for that, mistakes happen and that's a pretty common mistake that will be corrected easily. But watch the play over again, Conklin was expecting Ericsson to make the play and Ericsson backed off, which unless Conklin actually called him off; which almost never happens and I sincerely doubt with Conklin's puck handling confidence(*cough* Edmonton *cough* actually made Ericsson back off.

OMG GOAL. SO THE WINGS AREN'T THE WORST TEAM IN THE HISTORY OF HOCKEY ANYMORE.

Bleh not much they could do on that goal bad bounce.