Carman

470 games before he's 26 is a little? Over 470(25 years old) games he has 1.415 points per game. Ovechkin has 593(27 years old) games at 1.219. Crosby also has a higher shooting%, 14.90 to Ovechkin's 12.1. Might as well add that to the mix.

Ok, you can't really prove any of what you said. Show me where he broke both of Giroux's wrists? Oh he dives? So do a lot of people, it's up to the NHL for enforcing the penalties, because players are going to use every advantage to win. Here's that saint Giroux, I'm sure he'd never exaggerate anything. So you don't think points per game matters at all then Kip? Especially over a 450 game sampling? So a player that has more points = better? I guess Thornton is the best player in the NHL then by this critera. I understand points per game is flawed in a small sampling, but over a career? Fine how about this year, where Crosby has more points than Ovechkin, even when playing in fewer games? In a career total, but on a season by season basis he's not taking more penalties. That's just not true. And you don't think a suspension should harm Ovechkin in this area? He's not noted for being bad defensively, like Ovechkin is. And he does score more points. If points per game didn't matter then Bertuzzi is apparently better than Ovechkin. And Prospal is better than Datsyuk. Come on. No, but I'm saying centers don't have the offensive freedom that Wingers do. And that if Crosby was to move to a wing, and solely focus on offense, he would likely put up more numbers. That's all

Show me the slash that broke Giroux's wrist. If Crosby intentionally slashed him on the face-off, then why didn't he receive a penalty, or why wasn't there talk about it during the series? Let's say he did slash Giroux, that's one player. Ovechkin has a laundry list of questionable hits, he's actually been suspended for them as well. And Character? Show me where Crosby is a a**hole off the ice. The guy is amazing off the ice, he does so much for his community and his fans. He never gets in trouble, you can't find a video of him snubbing fans like ovechkin. Crosby's not paid to be liked on the ice.

Agreed, Ian White has the highest ceiling of any of our defenseman not named Kronwall. He can play and should play a important role for our team.

Was Jason Williams coming off a .57 ppg season?

Prefer less, but in this market that's what he is worth. He's the best option. Expectations will be higher on him though, I'll expect him to be top 10 at least, or he will face criticism. Right now he's a huge bargain though.

Can't believe this is really serious, your cherry picking and leaving out facts is fascinating to me 1. Crosby scores more points than Ovechkin, by a pretty significant margin. Therefore he is a better point producer than Ovechkin. Goals are indeed more valuable, but if you are saying .62 goals per game to .51 goals per game is worth more than 1.41 points per game to 1.22 points per game, I have to question that logic, because it's just nonsensical. 2. Fair enough, Ovechkin is a better powerplay player. 3. Yep more durable, no question about it. We'll see how the rest of his career goes, personally I think Crosby's game can carry on well into his 30's, while Ovechkin's might diminish more as goal scorers usually age quicker. But Crosby has had injury issues with concussions, so who knows. 4. Completely wrong, Crosby plays SH, not a lot by any means, but he's out there on 5v3's this year now that Staal is gone (54 seconds a game). Ovechkin has never been on the penalty kill(5 seconds a game). You are conviently leaving out the biggest difference, Crosby plays a center. I don't know why you don't think this is a big deal, but being a center in the NHL means you have to cover guys down low in your zone, you have to win face-offs, you usually have to be behind on odd man rushes. Wingers have much less responsbility, and while Crosby is no Selke, he's far removed from his days of being a liability. If you watch his game he is actually a very effective defensive player, and Ovechkin floats around the blue line. 5. More clutch? or better goal scorer. Think that's a flawed outlook personally. If Crosby assists on a game winning goal I'd say that should be counted no? Or how about we compare playoffs? Because that's the clutchest time of the year right? Crosby = 33 goals and 57 assists for 90 points in 68 games, Ovechkin has 30 goals and 29 assists for 59 points in 51 games. 1.15 per game to 1.32 per game. That looks to me like Crosby is pretty clutch in the most important time of the year no? He also had that nice game winning goal in the Gold Medal game, and was the youngest NHL captain to win a Stanley Cup. I don't see how any of this makes Crosby less clutch than Ovechkin, but maybe I'm just biased? 6. Ok this year in 40 games Ovechkin has 15 minors, and Crosby in 36 games he has 8 minors. Did Crosby use to take a lot more penalities? Yep, he was bad in that department, but over the years he's gotten better. Going down each year from .99, to .88, to .76, to .64, to .44 this year. While Ovechkin's goes from .71, to 1.24, to .52, to 33, to .75 this year. To me I'd say Crosby has the advantage here because you can see the progess he's made in that department. Also I'd like to think getting a suspension for a few games should hurt this attribute no? 7. Giveaways and takeaways are a pretty flawed statistic, each rink is different. Crosby also controls the puck more more than Ovechkin does, as Ovechkin usually shoots the puck immediately. Not to mention Ovechkin is sent in on the forecheck more than Crosby because *gasp* he's a winger. So more opportunity for takeaways. I guess Patrick Kane is better than Zetterberg defensively because he has more takeaways right? 8. I don't see how a player that injuries people is a wash with a player that dives or cross checks. I'm sorry, I'm at a loss here. Crosby plays the center position which has more defensive responsibility, and he scores more points. Therefore he is the better player right now. When Ovechkin gets back to his 07-10 form then there can be a good debate.

Oh please. That's the most ludicrous thing I've seen. Crosby is not as good of a scorer, not as good of a physical presence, and not as durable. But every other conceivable attribute is in Crosby's favor, he plays a two way center game(Is he a Selke candidate? No, not yet at least but his responsibility on the defensive end is just miles above what Ovechkin is asked to do. Crosby take absolutely no nights off, Ovechkin takes weeks off when not being productive with points. Crosby has an over .20 PPG difference, how is it even a question who is better offensively really? Crosby is 4th all-time in point per game right behind Bossy, during this one of the lowest scoring eras. I mean give me a break, and is .20+ ahead of anyone currently in the league. Oh and add that Olympic gold medal to the ring too, and don't forget who clinched the victory. Ovechkin is a great player, but Crosby has separated himself from him since Ovechkin's prime in 07-10 where there was actually a debate. I hope Ovechkin regains his 60+ goal form, he is a great talent and fun to watch. But Crosby is also fun to watch, and I just don't understand how supposed hockey fans can pass over the opportunity to watch one of the greatest players to ever play the game grow as a hockey player, it's a once in the life time opportunity and it's just sad to me. Because as a hockey player my whole life, Crosby is and will be the best player I'll ever watch live, and that's something that I will cherish. There isn't a Gretzky, and Howe in every era, but we are lucky enough to be experiencing one of those type players and it's a shame people don't care about the actually game when it comes to Crosby. And don't forget how cheap Ovechkin is, he's been suspended, and has countless of at the very least questionable hits. If the Red Wings fans think Backes is cheap, I'd love to see how they would react when Ovechkin would have ran Lidstrom like he did Gonchar, or Gleason, Let me refresh your mind, this video doesn't even include his suspension and cheapshots from the past 5 years.

All wings fans should care. Samuelsson would really help our devoting issues.

Production and time played, powerplay position, shoot first mentality. It's a good conparable, and its not a knock on Brunner at all, Samuelson is a very good NHLer just like Brunner. If Brunner can produce over .80 ppg over 70 or so games you can feel free to classify him as a top line winger.

I completely disagree, you don't need to be a 220 6'2 guy to be a good NHLer. Plenty of good players are under 6'0 and under 190. Brunner isn't that weak, he is a very good NHL player, he has great skating ability, laser shot, and very good effort on the ice. He is most certainly NHL material, he's just not a top line player at this point in his career. He's a great 3rd liner, and a good 2nd liner in spurts. He definitely has the potential to be more, and I have seen it at times, but it's not been a consistent dominance that you see in other top line wingers.

He's a younger Samuelsson from 05-06 very good secondary scorer, not quite top line material. With a little more speed, and less strength and defensive responsiblity. His ceiling may be higher, but he's still 27, so not that much time to grow. Excited to have him though, he's a great addition and very good player.

Yeah, it's been too long. He shouldn't push himself at his age to try and come back. Hopefully he can get to 100% before next season and won't have any recurring back issues. The scary part isn't if it ends his seasons, the scary part is if it keeps coming back throughout his career. This was the right decision.

And that's why we are struggling with secondary scoring.

Completely disagree, Bertuzzi and Samuelsson are better players right now. They are both coming off of .54(Bertuzzi), and .57(Samuelsson). Tatar and Nyquist will hopefully one day surpass that, but to expect rookies to put up numbers like that, yet playing a defensively sound game is ludicrous. I don't understand why people undervalue Bert and Sammy, they are very good secondary scorers, and our teams is worse off without them. Would the Islanders miss Okposo or Nielsen? Would Nashville miss Hornqvist? Would Columbus miss Brassard, or Wisniewski(defense I know), Ott, Yandle, Hensky, Setoguchi, Umberger, Wilson, Koivu, Laich, Gagne, Mueller, Enstrom etc. are all about the same production. So yes we do miss their production.

Umm, 2011 7th in the league, 2010 2nd in the league?

Having two .50 PPG players out for such a long time hurts quite a bit too.

Good news Dekeyser looked like our best defenseman. Bad news Dekeyser looked like our best defenseman. Kronwall takes too many dumb penalties, he must have a lot of IQ loss from all his hits. He now leads all defenseman in the league in minor penalites, absolutely unacceptable. Datsyuk was completely ineffective yet again, enough excuses for him, he needs to simplify his game, he cannot lead our team in turning the puck over, it gives us no chance for our top players to carry the play when Datsyuk always loses the puck. Nyquist is the only guy on the team creating anything right now, good for him, bad for the rest of the team. We need to get our offense on track, something needs to happen on Babcock's end. We've been shut out too often this year.

Well this means Zetterberg is out. This sucks.

It's just a post on the internet, I'm not really expecting Smith to move to forward. Nor am I saying it would a good or right move. I'm just assessing the situation right now in my head, we are small up front, and will need a bigger body to play bigger minutes as forward for the future right? I mean having Abdelkader as a top line forward just doesn't excite me much, I don't know about you. Smith has skill, he has speed, he has size, yet it just hasn't shown up yet on the defensive end this year. He looks like he's playing his the weight of the world out there right now, I'm only saying if he continues to play like this for more than just this year.

Oh I agree. But I'm not just basing it off his NHL play, he was the same way in the AHL and college. He's always been a risk taker. His value is higher as a defenseman no doubt. But if he's getting sat and gets passed up by deykeyser, lashoff, kindl etc. rather than sitting him I'd like to see what he could do offensively. You can't say you aren't curious what he would look like with his size, speed and puck skills playing in the top 6:) It way too early to even talk about it, but I do see similarities between burns and smith that's what caught my attention.

That's where I got the idea from, San Jose did it because they needed offense why not us, we need size on the forward en? I'm just throwing it out there really not going to happen, but he's got good offensive skills, great speed, good size. Just hasn't played defense that well this year. Never going to happen, but would be interesting to see him because I think he's trying to do too much and makes too many bad decisions defensively, where if he's a winger he could get some more freedom. Does anyone know if he ever played forward in college or before?

Awesome! news. With Nyquist starting to feel comfortable in the NHL I sure feel good about our future.

Never said you couldn't. I was just giving my opinion on your criticism. Everyone should be able to chime in.

And he immediately got a goal If something works I have to keep it up! It worked perfectly tonight as well. I'm definitely not serious when I'm talking about Datsyuk. Every time I complain about him he scores, so I do what I must.