newfy

Never said they would be slighted by it I said some of them might not think he deserves to get his jersey retired. None of us know what those players think is what my point is. Ozzie has no individual awards at all, he has team awards. He doesn't have a high career save percentage and he was basically never even the go to starter. The wings usually ran a 1a 1b system. Having a lot of wins just shows he was with the team for a long time and the teams were consistently good. Ozzie helped with that but was never the main or really even a huge factor in that. You could have put a lot of goalies on the wings and they would have won a lot. Not a slight to Ozzie, just pointing out the obvious. Of course Ozzie was a good, solid player but that doesn't get you in the rafters at the joe

Yeah but what would be the point of an internet forum if we just all agreed and didn't try to prove our opinions? And I really doubt those players would care as well but some of them might think he doesn't deserve it. You don't know what those players think. I also doubt anyone from the wings would care if we got a third jersey but there are tonnes of people on here who think it would be a travesty. And yeah I tihnk it would be tarnished, a bunch of all time greats plus Osgood really doesn't make Detroits rafters look as legendary as it once did

I think after the big chill and the record set that the wings might be seeing another winter classic very soon. Detroit vs Toronto at the big house would be unbelievable. The two biggest fanbases in the league are probably Toronto and Detroit. Not to mention the big house is not far for most Ontario people to drive, 4 hours from Toronto roughly. Plus the whole original 6 thing going for it. The rangers should probably be in one but who are they going to play that will make it interesting? Not the Islanders or Jersey.

I just dont get how he still gets in the line up at all, he should be traded immediately. He could probably get a third or second round pick which is fine with me

I'm not refuting what he has done and I am not putting him down. I have said he was a very solid goalie. I'm putting him down from having his jersey retired because I think it is pretty foolish that anyone could think he deserves it. A lot of the same people here who say the wings don't need a third jersey there is too much tradition and a legacy behind it also think Ozzie should have his jersey retired. If someone like Ozzie gets his jersey retired it will tarnish a legacy of all time great players that have their number retired by the wings. I would hate to see that happen because Detroit has a history of being great, and only the best of the best make it to the rafters

Does he fight?

Yeah I think this camp will show what he can do a bit better. Playing in the NCAA he plays older more mature players but if he comes to this camp and shows he can produce against players his age then I think he will be on the team. Bob mackenzie tweeted yesterday saying depending on what team Canada wants if they want a high offense center there is Nugent Hopkins (which I dont really buy, he hasn't been scoring much at all) and then he said if you want a big, strong defensive center take Riley Sheahan.

17 seasons as a wing Selke trohpy played a large role in 4 cups That looks pretty much as impressive to me as what you said about Osgood, should we retired Kris Drapers jersey?

Yeah the peak when Sawchuk played with the wings, he is arguably the best goalie all time. Don't look at numbers because the game has changed so much. Look at the Vezinas he won and the cups. Osgoods only hardware is 2 cups as a starter, yeah thats good but he was never really anything out of the ordinary. Sawchuk was the absolute best goalie in the league and dominated in his prime

No I used it to say he got waived by the wings from the get go, thats all I said was that he got waived and you came in here talking about how he played way better when he left. Man you are dense, Ozzie had an average year with the islanders and a horrible one. And to top it all off show me where I said he was down right awful out of Detroit? Or is this one of those Doc argumens where he puts words in someone else's mouth then tries to act smart afterwards?

Yeah but you also compare relative to their peers. Sawchuk won the vezina 4 times and the calder, as well as being our number 1 during the dynasty years. He also played in a time when goalies hardly stopped the puck. He was by far the most elite goalie of his time

Ok so Doc you think Ozzy became a better goalie and that his stats improved when he was in new york. He had a good year that was on par with most in Detroit, a .910 save percentage except for one basically and the he had a completely horrible one with a sub 900 save percentage. You call that becoming a better goalie then he was with detroit? His average save % the past 6 years in detroit is .909 and the reason that is so low is because he had a bad season his last one there where he got WAIVED. If you really wanna say Ozzie improved when he had a .910 save percentage then so be it but I call that being his average self the past 7 or so years. The year after that in New York where you say his numbers improved he had a sub 900 save percentage. I never said he was so much worse with the Isles in the first place anyways, I said his play wasn't as good which it wasn't as evidenced by his second year. He had an average year and a horrible one. Where is the improvement?

Osgood the 4 years leading up to the new millenium .911 .910 .913 .907 So you think when Osgood went to the islanders he got better when he got a .910 save percentage. Looks to me like he stayed pretty much the exact same as his last 5 years of his career pretty much. But of course you would only wanna bend stats to look in your favour eh doc, big surprise there since an intelligent argument isn't something you usually make Ozzie has a lot oof wing records sure, but is wins really something that speaks about how good he is. I agree he was a very solid goalie most of his career, but that many wins isn't just on Ozzie alone, he played behind great teams. Sawchuks talent level is ten times that of Osgoods he was an amazing goaltender from all recollections, an all time great. All time greats get in the wings rafters, does ozzy honestly qualify?

First of all, Ive already proven that nothing I said isn't true. You say he improved going to the islanders, when really his save percentage dropped below .900. What you said is unsubstantiated. He found a starting position with 2 teams that have had a history of not being that great, especially the islanders, and he played very sub par. Maybe he didn't fall off the map but he did not play better with them like you seem to wanna tell everyone Anyways, find me something in this thread that I said about Ozzie that wasn't true and then maybe I'll take you and yuor man crush on Ozzie seriously

And Pulk is a guy everyone expected this from, we was projected to go first round until he got hurt. Callahan is a feel good story in a sense and thats why a lot of the posters here really like him

Its not even about that, everyone is entitled to their opinion, just because you dont think enforcers/agitators help a team doesn't mean I think you know nothing about hockey. I just think that you are wrong about the Q being the best league to develop players in when most people (Probably 99%) would have it as the worst of the three leagues. As for Callahan it does kind of seem like youre trying to down play what this kid has done so far inn his junior career. He has shown that he is a great fighter and a physical player sure, but he's also showing tremendous improvement. He went from a walk on try out for a junior team, getting drafted they didnt even have his name to put on the draft board and now hes being invited to try out for the USA world junior team and is producing over a ppg while being strong on the PK and defensively and a great fighter. That is something a wings fan should be proud the wings scooped in the 6th round, just as much as stealing some skilled european

Well if you dont want his number retired then why are you even arguing what I am saying? And you think his numbers improved with the Islander? His save % stayed right about on par with what it had been his whole time with the wings in his first season then in his second year with the islanders it plummetted below .900, genius.. He didn't "produce" with the Islanders, he was a solid goalie in his first season, just like his whole career. Got the job done but was never anything special, then he fell off the map completely. So tell me where anything I said is unsubstantiated?

Like I said earlier, Crosby and Lecalvier are the only really high touted prospects to come out of the Q, where are the rest of these future hall of famers you were talking about, Crosby is just one player From California actually and is already a great fighter. No worries Chris we have a north american fighter on the way, I know you've wanted one for so long

Yeah so he got better with the Islanders, that means Detroit should hang his jersey? Osgood was never an elite goalie during his time in the NHL, a good goalie yes. I cant believe you think he belongs with Howe, Yzermans, Sawchuk etc. These are all time greats, not just good players

Only a wings fan would really think that Dats deserves it over Crosby. Without Crosby the pens would be absolutely nothing, probably in the bottom 5 of the league really. Without Datsyuk we still have a tonne of depth that can step up and cover our losses

You think him winning a cup as a backup is going to have any sway in if he gets his number retired? I doubt it, he was the backup. Osgood has not been that great for a long time now, I know people are saying its the end of his career, but what about when he was with St Louis and the Islanders? There is a reason he got waived and no teams wanted to trade for him. If he was an all time great, which is what I think you need to be to get in the rafters, he would not have been waived. He got the job done for us, made some saves which is all he had to do with the team infront of him and he did it. He had a great career but not a rafters worthy one

Hoping for a wings win tonight, Abdelkader will meet up with Pelley, and I think we see a pretty big win, 5-2ish sounds about right. Then right after I get to watch GSP beat the crap out of that cocky bastard Koschek, I can't wait

Whats the history between these teams anyways? Must really hate eachother

He won 2 cups with us thats it. Yeah he played a long time with the team and filled his role admirably but a goalie who at one point gets waved by the wings when he was around the age of his prime. We had powerhouse teams for the most part when Ozzie played here and he did his job well. But he was nothing spectacular ever. He got the job done but he never played well enough to be an all time great thats for sure and like I said earlier, does anyone really think Ozzie compares to any of these players... Howe, Yzerman, Sawchuk, Abel, Lindsey, or even Lidstrom in the future?

The last 10 years who are the best players to come out of the Q? Compare that to the O and the WHL and the Q isn't even close. I'm not talking about the days of super mario, Lafleur etc playing in the Q right now. You will be the only person on this site that says the Q is a step above the dub and the OHL.