mmamolo

This absolutely, without a doubt is a GR move. He may be gritty but he in no way is a capable NHL defenseman. He is slow, turns the puck over constantly and can't anticipate what's going on around him. No way does he see time with the Wings.

Just when I thought you couldn't get any dumber. No where did I say any team should/would give Holland that. I said that Holland may have been asking for more than other team's were willing to trade. Massive difference Your childish insults just show the lack of substance behind your argument. No where did I say the Coyotes would trade Yandle for Hudler +prospects/picks. All I said was that you (just like the rest of us) don't know that that couldn't be a starting point. If I were the Coyotes GM I wouldnt want that but you going off on these ridiculous rants about how absurd it is and then you list a million Wings prospects that would need to be included to just as extreme (to the opposite end) as you find the Kinl + Hudler + picks notion.

Agreed. I think it spreads the wealth well. Also, it puts players that make sense together. I think the 3rd line would play a strong, grinding game and would be so much more effective than say Hudler - Abs - Cleary/Bertuzzi. I also think using Hudler with Zetterberg, or he can be used with Datsyuk at times, make sense too. Based on the types of goals (and assists) their games fit more fluidly in my mind. Correct me if I'm wrong but keep in mind that the RFAs who go to arbitration may end up on 1 or 2 year deals pending their respective club's decision. Imagine being able to land Burns, Weber, or Suter. You'd say goodbye to Commodore at that point but it'd be unreal. Hell, since we're fantasizing, what if the Wings landed both Weber and Suter with Lidstrom returning. 2012-13 Suter - Weber Lidstrom - Stuart Kronwall - White/Ericsson Kindl Or hell, what if they landed all three?!? ok I'm just being a dick now...

Stevie only like the 'lower bowl'...he's a perv like that

and you ...mostly for the Sheen picture. I think Charlie would make an excellent depth signing up front for the Wings

I'm not a Rafalski hater but it seems like some people are more concerned with the loss of name recognition from the blue line than anything. Rafalski's points, especially on the PP, will surely be missed. But his defensive game absolutely suffered for significant stretches last season. His turnovers were costly at times and he struggled to get back to the puck and his first pass out of the zone suffered as a result (when he was actually able to even attempt one). I'm not saying he was garbage defensively White is an improvement from 2010-2011 Rafalski. Commodore is even an improvement over Salei. Also, people shouldn't get concerned with the order at which the D-Pairings are listed in this thread. Babcock will almost certainly try and distribute the ice time as he did last year - 20 mins per pair. If Ericsson could play the right side then I would have liked to see Lidstrom - Ericsson Stuart - White Kronwall - Commodore Kindl But since that's not exactly an option I bet we see: Lidstrom - Stuart/White Ericsson - White/Stuart Kronwall - Commodore

What, no +1 for that post? ...I tell ya I get no respect

1. You completely misunderstood my post. 2. My opinion on what Hudler's value is is irrelevant 3. I never said Hudler, Kindl + pick for star player x was justifiable. What I am saying is that until you know for fact that teams wouldn't take that as a starting point your just force feeding us your opinion that any trade from the Wings for star player x would have to start with Smith, Pulk, all the top prospects in the system etc. 4. The point was that you are crying about Hudler not being dealt when you don't know what Holland was expecting in return. Holland determined that (so far) the best possible return for Jiri Hudler was not worth moving him. Thank god some one understands. Hopefully now Heaten udnerstands what I was saying.

Wisniewski's comment shouldn't bother any one here. If anything it should show his ignorance. The guy talks about market value but the problem is he, just like so many other players, feel as though their market value is primarily based on comparable players and the current FA pool. The Wings however determine market value based on the ability of each player. The Wings try to find a dollar amount that they and the player feel is deserved and the Wings can pay it. That's real market value. If you desperately wanted a new tv but all of a sudden every tv manufacturing company went out of business except for LG and they started selling them at $20k each would you buy it? I know I wouldn't despite my absolute love for tv wow, ignorant No, you're not the only one. But I can also guarantee that had the Wings made that deal you and the rest of the fans that wanted this deal would be deeply disappoint come mid-season. This last playoff aside Ryder has been a grossly overpaid and ineffective player. Agreed Actually he will collect $19M in his first two seasons. $7M salary for each year with $2M signing bonus this year and $3M signing bonus next season.

That's kind of how it's supposed to work. It should give them the flexibility to sign players but there definitely is an issue with the Cap Floor being where it is. Obviously the league wants these teams to reinvest the rev sharing money into players but over spending on individual players (and thus driving up the prices for comparable players) is what (essentially) cost this league a season with the lockout. Smaller market teams need to be able to contend for free agents. But a lot of the spending has been out of control because those teams have to meet the floor and the free agent pool wasn't deep. Part of the issue is also that over the last few years teams locked up so many of the marquee players to exessively long deals - which dwindles the FA pool each summer. What happens when next summer's group of FA look to this summer for salary comparisons? If Jovo is work $4M and change then next summer players will want more cash. Small market teams should be able to use the rev sharing to get players but when they are constrained by the cap floor it creates over spending. The more bad (overpaid) contracts we see the more trouble the league could conceivably get into.

...and hookers

I don't understand how on one hand you can say that the Minny trade should be used as a comparison and then shoot down people's suggestions of Smith, Fil, and a 1st. Since you think Yandle is better than Burns there would be no pick coming back as there was in the SJ/MINN deal. This whole thread has been ridiculous. Everyone keeps freaking out and saying Holland couldn't even trade Hudler for a pick or that the Wings don't have the assets to make a Yandle deal happen. First, you have no clue what Holland was asking in exchange for Hudler. For all we know Holland wanted a roster player back and teams were unwilling to go that route or trade a roster player the caliber of what Holland was asking for. So before you continue to freak that Hudler wasn't dealt you should consider the fact that the Wings don't overpay in free agency and they do not give roster players away unless the return is greater than what they're shipping out. Secondly, the Wings would have just as good a shot at landing Yandle as any other team. You can't compare some of the trade proposals in this thread with what other teams could include a deal. You dont know that those teams would be willing to include better/more pieces. If Yandle is going to be traded the Wings will set their limits (in terms of what could be sent the other way) and if Phoenix wants more than the Wings will pass.

I dont know this for sure or anything but I would imagine that the Jovo contract offer would have been in lieu of the Commodore signing. I dont think it was Jovo or White....it was probably Jovo or Commodore.

One of the funniest movies you'll ever see. In fact, this thread inspried me...I'm gonna watch it tonight for maybe the 20th time. I would take White before Kaberle under absolutely any circumstances. When you compare dollars, interest in the game, heart, conditioning, physicality...essentially every good attribute Kaberle has is far, far outweighed by his terrible ones. The only way I would take Kaberle on my team is if he signed one year deals for $1M per. Other than that I'll awtch him play soft and turn the puck over constantly for another team all year long.

Penny is a joke. Don't get me wrong, Coke and Porcello aren't lighting it up either but Penny looks so shakey out there. Porcello will be good. Thank God Verlander and Scherzer are tearing it up. Verlander for the CY Young

It's called 7 Degrees of Kevin Bacon - MuchMusic (the Canadian equivalent to MTV) used to do it on tv all the time. Pick any Kevin Bacon movie and another random movie star you want to determine the separation from. Then pick a person who was in that Kevin Bacon movie with him and the chain starts...

If you check out Bob Mckenzie's twitter he's posted a link that better explains the waiver process for Barker. Since he's an RFA the article explains that there is a second round of waivers he'll have to be exposed to if he isn't claimed by 11am tomorrow. Then the Wild would potentially buy him out at 1/3 the cost as opposed to the normal 2/3. He's be scheduled to collect just over $1M from the buyout so if he wants to break even for the year's salary he'd look for $2M. But that doesnt meant he'd get it. I'm too lazy to get the link but it's there

Personally I would rather Wisniewski. But I do think there's a chance they can get both. I'm NOT saying the Wings SHOULD do this but I think they could: Ehroff $5.25 and Wisniewski $5. That would leave them with approximately $6 to sign another defensemen, a back up goalie, Eaves and another forward. For Example: CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR FORWARDS Jiri Hudler ($2.875m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Daniel Cleary ($2.800m) Tomas Holmstrom ($1.875m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Johan Franzen ($3.954m) Todd Bertuzzi ($1.937m) / Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Jaromir Jagr (or whoever)($2.000m) Justin Abdelkader ($0.787m) / Darren Helm ($0.912m) / Patrick Eaves ($1.000m) Cory Emmerton ($0.533m) / Jan Mursak ($0.550m) DEFENSEMEN Nicklas Lidstrom ($6.200m) / Brad Stuart ($3.750m) Niklas Kronwall ($3.000m) / Jakub Kindl ($0.883m) Christian Ehrhoff ($5.250m) / James Wisniewski ($5.000m) Jonathan Ericsson (or whoever)($2.000m) GOALTENDERS Jimmy Howard ($2.250m) / Ty Conklin (or whoever)($0.850m) CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter) (these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion) SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,192,044; BONUSES: $0 CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $107,956 Those are all very reasonable numbers to get it done. We all know Ericsson may want more so you could let him go if you choose. A back up at that price can be had and Ehroff and Wis at those numbers should be the most any one on here wants to pay. Jovo should be signing for way less...I'm thinking like $3-3.5M max

I also think Eaves. Despite what a lot of members on this board think about Ericsson I'd prefer not giving up on him yet (obviously at a reasonable contract price) but Eaves' has come a long way and is becoming a valuable part of this team (if he hasn't already become that already). He may feel as though he could have a bigger role elsewhere and that probably is true. But if he continues to remind himself of the path Dan Cleary took to get where he is now with the Wings he should understand how he'll be rewarded by moving forward with the Wings. To me, he's the key guy right now of the Wings current UFAs

That's definitely a good point - there could be more to this. But at the same time it would defintely be worth inquiring as to what money he may want. More often than not you can get these kinds of guys on cheap 1 year deals. Then you see how it pans out.

I couldnt agree more. Although I like Laich there is no way I could ever justify that cash. If I was McPhee I would have traded his rights once I found out this was the number. Laich is more easily replaced than the cap space he's eating up no matter how you shake it (Salary, % of cap etc)

Obviously everyone is talking about how Vancouver is still trying to sign Ehroff. I haven't heard one word (realistically) about the Canucks and Sami Salo. Just like Jovonovski, Salo is a guy I could see the Wings taking on in a short term situation. Plus he's a right handed defenseman who can play the point on the PP.

Although it usually happens that doesn't mean technically or logically yes.

Sorry, but that's not necessarily true.

Don't be crazy...Jiri is beyond 4th line duty, he's just too good for it