PavelValerievichDatsyuk

I agree that it's not guaranteed that he will produce in the NHL, but all of what I said still stands. Most of this conversation is pretty pointless since said you'd be willing to trade Mantha for Subban, Pietrangelo, etc. and those guys are not going to be traded. In talking about Mantha's NHL potential, though, I think you are talking too generally about probability. If you stick to generalities, I would probably agree with you, but if you need look at Mantha specifically compared to other CHL players that didn't work out. Not to say that size is everything, but it really does matter when transitioning to the NHL. Those that couldn't make the transition are all small players: Justin Azevedo: 5'8" Corey Locke: 5'10" Pierre-Marc Bouchard: 5'10" Simon Gamache: 5'9" Brendan Shinnimin: 5'10" Sergei Varlamov: 5'10"

In principle, yes it's smart to trade potential for proven production, but in actuality it's a huge risk in this case and not very smart in my opinion. Mantha has huge potential with his size and skill set. He could be a cornerstone player for the franchise for the rest of his career. I'm not saying that will happen, but that is the potential you'd be trading away. Could you get a player like that in return? Could you replace Mantha with another player who is 6'5"? Also, the fan base (me included) would never forgive you for letting Mantha get away if he has any success elsewhere. Mantha is not a regular prospect. The general excitement around him coming to the Wings is something that is great for the franchise (And business - people will buy tickets to see the new junior phenom start his career).

He definitely looked tired at the end, but it was triple OT after playing 4 games in 8 days with every team being relentlessly on him. Also, add in the long QMJHL playoffs. Of course, The NHL playoffs would be even more of a grind so maybe it does show a bit of a weakness. As for taking long shifts, that seemed to be the norm for his team and coach just kept sending him out trying to get the winning goal so I'm not sure you can fault Mantha for that. He actually looked pretty good in the last game to me. He had a lot of chances and probably should have had a goal or two.

During the Olympics, one of the russian former wings (I think it was Larionov) was talking about how he wanted to bring a team to Sochi. I guess he succeeded. Since it's a new team I assume it will be starved for players. Emmerton could actually be a "top" player for them. Anyway, he'll get to enjoy the beach life and Emdog can pick up a few stray dogs.

I don't want to give any credence to the idea that Babcock wants to leave. To me this a non-story. He's stated he's very happy here - we just wait to see if Holland wants him after next year. But, as for the money argument - you forget that Gretzky was paid 8 million to coach Pheonix. They, of coarse, were paying for his name and the publicity that he brought to the franchise and it was a totally unique situation, but there definitely is no limit on what a team will offer for a coach. The Gretzky situation should be a good lesson against paying too much for a coach, though.

Yeah, I just figured it out from the intermission discussion. I was wondering why there wasn't much urgency in the commentary

I think Val D'or has to win tonight to be in the semi-final. It's 2-2 going into the 3rd. ...now it's 3-3 going into OT

Nords. The rest of my post makes that clear.

I think you have to understand how they failed, though. This was no break up because of loss of love. They pretty much sold out their 15000 seat arena until the end, but there's not enough income from just tickets. They needed a bigger rink and Corporate deals. They left Quebec in 1995 - before the Salary cap. Canadian teams had to pay much more for players because $1US was .70. Because of that and the escalating salaries the team began to struggle financially. Now there's the salary cap and the Canadian dollar is .92 and has been even in recent years. The team couldn't get corporate sponsors because the Quebec economy was in turmoil. This was in larger part because of the seperatist movement that lead to the 95 referendum. Nobody wanted to invest in Quebec because of that uncertainty. It's a lot different in Quebec. As already stated, Quebec City is already building a 400 million dollar modern arena just on the hope of a team. The also have a huge deal with Quebecor media for the naming rights on the arena that increases if an NHL team is there. As for your idea of fans fading in interest if the team is losing - you can still buy Nordique merchandise in any sports or souvenir shop in Montreal and the team hasn't existed for almost 20 years. I think that says something.

Quebec City is currently building an NHL sized rink right beside the old Nordiques' Pepsi Colosseum. It will open in 2015. Back when the owner of Blackberry was attempting to Buy the Coyotes and move them to Hamilton, it was said that Copps Colosseum (named something else now, think) could be expanded to NHL size.

Okay, if you look at those numbers, Quebec City is already larger than Winnipeg. Quebec City: 765,706 Winnipeg: 730,018 Hamilton: 721,053 Hamilton is low but, like I said, it is about an hour away from Kitchener (477,160), St. Catherines (392,184), Brantford (135,501) and Toronto (5,583,064). Without including Toronto, that's 1,725,898. I believe Hamilton would be the safest bet. And, yes, I agree - say no to Saskatoon. At the end of the day, though, you do have to ignore the number and look at level to which Hockey is present in the culture of an area. If you only look at the numbers, why wasn't Atlanta (MSA: 5,522,942) a slam dunk and was is Florida struggling (Miami: 5,828,191) If you go to Quebec City during the winter, there's outdoor rink on like every other block (slight exaggeration, but only slightly). The answer people always give back is: but they had team and it failed. From everything I've read, the financial problems were due to the fact that they couldn't get English media deals (and, therefore, english TV audiences) and couldn't get corporate backing for a new arena. Media is certainly very different than 1995. The Canadian sports media goes crazy over any Canadian team now and I'm sure CBC or TSN would be all over a deal. Hell, CBC even shows games in Punjabi so I'm sure they'd want to serve English Nordique fans. As for financial backing, the municipality is building them a rink and there's not even a team yet so clearly there's money to back them. Also, the Canadian dollar argument isn't as meaningful as it used to be since the CAN dollar has been pretty high for quite a while.

Quebec City currently has a population of 516,622. That may still be a small market, but the study that started this thread was projecting for the year 2035. Quebec City is a growing city and it's very likely it will be the size of other cities that support an NHL team (Vancouver: 603,502, Winnipeg: 663,617). So it won't be a small market. I also want to throw in that Buffalo only has a population 259,384 and can only support a team because of the vicinity of other cities. Hamilton (504,560) is also growing, but it would have no problem supporting a team, since it's about an hour away from Toronto, Kitchener, Branford, St. Catherine's.

Also, it is not really in Babcock's interest to sign an extension because a multi-year deal would raise the possibility of being fired, which would stain his record. Going year by year he can just move on after whatever year. If it's anything like players contracts he might make more money not asking for a multi-year deal. Okay, now I've thought about it too much...,but hey, it's the off-season.

I think there is reason enough to keep him just in the fact that he seems to be doing a great job in helping to develop our prospects. And also the way he has implemented structure that allows call-ups to make the jump to the NHL pretty seamlessly. Without considering the future, that would be something that we wouldn't want to put in Jeopardy next year - especially when we will have important prospects in GR (Mantha? Sproul? Marchecko? Oulette?, etc) I think it was an integral part of the team's Rebuild/Transition strategy to have a strong coach in GR that has served alongside Babcock for a year.

The area could definitely support another team. Fans would convert over time. As someone born in London, Ontario, I think a lot of Southern Ontario has a natural animosity against the city of Toronto so they would probably love to have a different team to cheer for.

That's not true. Cleary was scratched before he was injured. Bertuzzi only got in 1 playoff game when no one was looking effective. He was playing before late in the season because we were missing pretty much everyone and the kids were still in the lineup so he wasn't taking their spots. Beware of the grass on the other side.

Tom Renney probably wants to be a head coach again.

Okay, I can see that. They would be a pretty attractive team to go to. I thought you meant because of the style and system we play that he wouldn't fit here. I think he would fit in well with Dats and help the PP.

Yeah, that's some horrible journalism. People are just building up speculation to push paper (what's the modern internet equivalent - get clicks?) Here's Babcock's response: http://mapleleafshotstove.com/2014/05/07/mike-babcock-on-toronto-rumours/ He says after talking about his great situation in Detroit (Paraphrase) "Why would I want to leave." It really sounds like only reason he would leave is if Holland wanted a change. P.S. In the interview there's good bit on Mantha where he says: (Paraphrase)"We'll see if he needs a half year in Grand Rapids." which makes it sound like he'll be on the team at some point next year. Also, On defensemen, when talking about the players next year becoming a puck moving D core again, he mentions Backman with other rosters players. I hadn't thought he would be a possibility for the roster next year. Hmmm

You've said this a couple times. Why?

Okay. I thought you were claiming that we hadn't drafted RH D in the years before, Marchenko, Sproul, Jensen. I actually think it would be safe bet to say that either Marchenko or Sproul will be a regular on the roster next year by Christmas time. At least that's what I've taken from recent Holland/Babcock quotes.

I really don't think Helm and Glendening are similar at all. Helm got 12 goals in 42 games this season and has really started to show some offensive ability. Secondary scoring is essential to team success - especially on a team that is starving for offence. Also, of course, he's been a great PKer. Helm can move up and down the line up 2nd line to 4th line. He's also been around for a while and in the age group of players that hopefully are becoming leaders for us. He shows incredibly hard work and that should be an example for the rest of the team. Yes he's been injured, but I think he's unmovable unless it's a huge return. I like Glendening, but he's only shown defensive abilities. Great at shutting down stars and PK, but I really don't know how you can see these 2 as similar players. If Weiss works out as 2nd line center, then we do he have 1 too many centers and one of Sheahan, Helm, and Glendening would have to be moved to the wing or else they could become expendable. It would be a hard decision since I like them all. Oh, and Andersson, Miller, Tootoo(who will be bought out), Kindl, Lashoff(though good 7th D) are expendable, but I really don't know how much he'd get in return I Like Smith, Dekeyser, E, Kronwall on Defence. If 2 young guys grab roster spots then we have some tradeable D prospects

That's not really true. There was a 4 year period when the wings didn't choose any right-handed Defencemen, but that was back in 2001-2004. We chose 2 in 2000 so there were those guys in the propect pool and we had Chelios, Dandenault, Krupp on the roster for those years and even Olausson in 2001 so there wasn't much need for rightys. Since 2005, there has been a lot of RH D chosen, but the draft picks just haven't worked out. Right-handed Defence draft picks since 2000: 2000: Paul Ballantyne 2000: Alexaner Seluyanov 2005: Juho Mielonen 2005: Bretton Stamler 2006: Logan Pyett 2008: Max Nicastro 2009: Nick Jensen 2011: Ryan Sproul 2011: Marchenko From everything I have read, It looks incredibly likely that Marchenko and Sproul will be on the Red Wings in the future.

I thought Smith played really well in the second half of the season and the playoffs. I really have no idea why you'd want to get rid of him.

2013: ANTHONY MANTHA R CAN 6' 3" 190 QMJHL VAL D'OR ZACH NASTASIUK R CAN 6' 1" 190 OHL OWEN SOUND TYLER BERTUZZI L CAN 6' 0" 178 OHL GUELPH MATTIAS JANMARK C SWE 6' 1" 189 SWEDEN AIK DAVID POPE L CAN 6' 2" 187 BCHL WEST KELOWNA MITCH WHEATON D CAN 6' 4" 228 WHL KELOWNA MARC MCNULTY D CAN 6' 5" 185 WHL PRINCE GEORGE HAMPUS MELEN R SWE 6' 2" 165 SWE JR TINGSRYD Show me the undersized "soft euro" Mitch Wheaton almost fits your demands almost exactly except that he's 13 pounds heavier and he's from Sherwood Park, Alberta.