SouthernWingsFan

The difference between the two is... Meech has barely had any chances to "do s**t" or "do less s**t" in the NHL since he's only gplayed 4 games so far. Norton has had plenty of chances to "do s**t" in the NHL, and has accomplished it with flying colors since he's PLAYED MORE THAN 4 GAMES. The two aren't logically comparable. Thanks for playing.

There was no logical reason to bring up Norton and fighting in this thread in the first place. Norton has nothing to do with the Wings re-signing Meech. Trying to bring up Norton in here makes absolutely no sense, even to people in here that like fighting more than others, in all likelihood.

Well son of a b***h, I was actually going to take the bait and get involved in my first fantasy football experience, but my birthday is on the 31st so I'm going to be out and about that evening in all likelihood.

Past playoff performances of course, but only a few times it's been mentioned that the Wings were soft? Hell, it was mentioned probably every 15 minutes in here during hockey season. Where the heck have you been? I don't keep up with other sports forums or visit sports sites every day, but if you think that the overall perception of Detroit was that they weren't soft (whether it was a right/wrong perception), again where the heck have you been? Everybody and their cousin thought Detroit was "soft" going into the playoffs. You know Calgary and San Jose were perceived as the more physical teams out of the three teams, they were both supposed to outhit the Wings and be more physical and intimidate them, and look what happened. Detroit matched their "physicality" and beat them.

No grit? What about these playoffs where they were supposed to get destroyed physically by Calgary and San Jose, but pretty much matched them in the hit department roughly? I'll even go on a stretch to say that Anaheim, another fairly physical team, didn't just absolutely push the Wings around 100% either. Definitely not denying the Wings could use some more size. You can be under 6'0" and be gritty though. Keep those two independent from each other though and I'm pretty much in agreement with you. Yet they still won the Cup with very little fighting! Stop the presses! I guess you can win a Cup wtihout people "dropping the mitts" often then! FYI when you want to comment on a previous post, click the quote button and type under the quote, makes it a bit easier to read the flow.

It defintely doesn't hurt, I won't deny that, it's just not that important to me. In my earlier posts I don't want to give the perception of going out as the "Lone Ranger", one against the world kinda guy where I don't need anybody at anytime. Everybody needs a hand in any job, but in the end they know how to handle themselves if it comes to junk getting out of hand in a hockey game. It's a normal part of the game. I'm all for the whole "sticking up for each other mantra", but the main gist again is that these guys are professionals and adults capable of handling themselves in the normal course of a hockey game, it's not like they need a babysitter to constantly watch his shadow. 2002 the Wings won a Cup and barely dropped the mitts..........

What does Brad Norton and fighting have anything to do with the Wings re-siging Derek Meech? Nobody thinks Meech is the main cog and the person of absolute importance to the Wings future, no need to be so dramatic because he might not do the things you like as much.

Sly and the Family Stone - Hot Fun In The Summertime

People standing up for themselves, singing kumbayah together is good, don't get me wrong, but it doesn't really matter the profession you do as an adult whether you are a pre-k teacher, a florist, or a professional athlete, you should know by know how to take care of yourself in normal circumstances of your job. No, I'm not implying somebody is going to just come in the door and beat the crap out of a teacher or florist at random. That's not a normal part of their job. If nobody stood up for me after I got hit hard in hockey or if I got beaned in baseball or something, I wouldn't complain at my teammates or call them out or whatever else. For good and for bad, those things are part of the game, I should/could be able to handle it if I was involved in the every day activities of those things. You're an adult, you should have learned to be responsible and take care of yourself a long time ago. Enforcement/physical hockey has it's place in the sport, just like good goaltending or scoring, leadership on and off the ice, coaching, off-season training, and a myriad of other things that make the game important, but it isn't significantly more important iversus other aspects of the game to significantly change my mind in how I feel about the game. Did I actually say that?

Perhaps so. I could care less on survey all the NHLers who might think this and get an exact percentage as I got a day job and could find plenty other better things to do with my personal life, but I perfectly understand where you are coming from. In terms of your main gist, no I don't think fighting is all that important. I don't know if you think this goes into the contradictory/grey area, yes I do like the normal fight every now and then. Do I drool and do jumping jacks when it happens though? Do I scream to the top of my lungs? No. Okay, two people fought, good for them, I got 2 minutes of "entertainment". Let's move on to the rest of the game then as there are plenty of other things that decide the match as well (i.e. good goaltending, reducing turnovers, passing, creating traffic etc. etc., things that have little/no emphasis on fights). EDIT: On the contrary, do I throw a hissy fit if somebody doesn't "stick up for their teammate" in the form of a fight or whatever else? Not really either. Is it nice when it happens? Of course, but this isn't the pee-wee pre-puberty league where you are trying to learn to be a man and stick up for yourself. These are professionals, adults who probably have a good bit of sense/maturity since they are working, doing the thing they love best to make a living. It's nice when it happens, but I don't get angry if it doesn't b/c they are professional adults and know how to take care of thesmelves in the grand scheme of things within the overall game.

"Toughness" over a full season is nice and dandy, but you and I know very clearly that most of the regular season is an audition for the playoffs. Unless the Wings snooze through their alarms every game, they are making the playoffs. Yeah yeah, weak division most years, but what can ya do, the Wings cannot control that. They are still in the playoffs then. If they turn up the "toughness" for the games that matter most, what's the problem then? Doesn't really bother me all that much actually that you and others don't think they are "tough", it's more humoring to me actually. It's pretty self-explanatory, some people and probably some players, who are professionals, know more about the game than we do, don't put as much of an emphasis on fighting. If that's the case, I'd take the word of a professional over the word of any beer-bellied fan any day of the week.

Did I say everybody?

How many playoff series does it take for a team to be tough then? Two? Four? Nine? Sixteen? What's the standard?

What does this tell you then? Maybe even players don't put as big an emphasis on "fighting" as some fans might want. Maybe fighting isn't as big a deal to some/a fair amount of professional players either, who know more about the game than fans. There's nothing wrong with that.

While they certainly have more potential to than Samuelsson, getting Datsyuk and Zetterberg to be consistent 40-40 producers is a tough chore to ask as well...

Despite him being a jerk off the ice perception wise...how is he overrated? Won a Stanley Cup. Among the leaders in all-time wins. Yep, real overrated there...

Bill Medley and Jennifer Warner - Time of My Life Or, the final song in the Dirty Dancing movie.

That isn't THE MAIN REASON, and nobody is slighting or insulting Yzerman in any way, shape, or form. I think it's a safe bet to say the fan in every one of us wishes he was still out on the ice. We would have all been happy I think if he played another year. But you have to ask yourself, and be serious. What more did Yzerman have left to prove? He won 3 Cups. His body must have gone through hell and back his last few seasons, pain that none of us are even going to come close to having a clue about in our lifetime. Again, Yzerman himself said he had little else to offer the team at the end of his career. It sucks that pretty much any good thing has to come to an end, but it was time to hang up the skates, in HIS opinion, not just some of our opinions.

Perfect short and sweet summary of Samuelsson. I'm no slappie of his but the discredit he gets from members in here goes a little bit overboard. He's not going to be your main guy for goal production, but he's not a cancer on the ice and doesn't stink up the joint. As stated, he doesn't take anything off the table.

And you know this how? Not knocking Steve Yzerman as we all know what he's done etc., but this team made a deep playoff run "without" Yzerman and if it weren't for two awful breaks the 2nd-to-last game before the Wings got eliminated, I think it's a safe assumption to say they would have been playing in the SCF, "without" Yzerman. He even said himself that he pretty much didn't have anything else to offer, his body couldn't take much more abuse. I don't care who you are, the body eventually wears out for everybody. Anyways, for me Yzerman retiring is not really a distant memory, it's weird to say this, it's not much of anything to me. I'm trying not to say this in a snobby or "I don't care" kinda way, cause I do. I apologize if it comes off like that. I actually haven't thought or reflected about him retiring that much to tell you the truth. The day after the Wings got eliminated in 2006 against Edmonton, it hit me that Yzerman might not play anymore and that was a rare reflection moment for me. January 2nd of his ceremony was another one of those days as well. But honestly, that's it for me. Again, please don't mean this to say that I am unappreciative for what Yzerman did or any of that stuff. I definitely had a blast watching Yzerman play, and a part of me wishes he was still out there on the ice. I guess it's just my attitude, when it's not a time where you get "caught up in the moment" in sports or anything else, I really don't think about those kind of things, I just go about my daily life, routine business, and the like. I try not to get too high or low on the emotional scale.

Could've said the same thing last year as well about the Wings division to lose, since they've won it pretty much every year in the past since the latest round of expansion, despite Nashville being really solid throughout the year.

That's all nice and dandy, but you pretty much lost me there after that 3rd line of synopsis. Nobody is going to care that badly, outside a sports statistician, about those stats. I certainly don't. Goaltending in all likelihood, wasn't the SOLE reason they struggled.

The Associated Press Pre-Season Top 25.......... AP TOP 25 The Top 25 teams in The Associated Press preseason college football poll, with first-place votes in parentheses, 2006 records, total points based on 25 points for a first-place vote through one point for a 25th-place vote, and final ranking: Rec. Pts Pvs 1. USC (62) 11-2 1,622 4 2. LSU (2) 11-2 1,511 3 3. W. Virginia (1) 11-2 1,396 10 4. Texas 10-3 1,375 13 5. Michigan 11-2 1,371 8 6. Florida 13-1 1,276 1 7. Wisconsin 12-1 1,192 7 8. Oklahoma 11-3 1,166 11 9. Virginia Tech 10-3 1,148 19 10. Louisville 12-1 1,031 6 11. Ohio St. 12-1 876 2 12. California 10-3 790 14 13. Georgia 9-4 782 23 14. UCLA 7-6 605 -- 15. Tennessee 9-4 571 25 16. Rutgers 11-2 560 12 17. Penn St. 9-4 542 -- 18. Auburn 11-2 519 9 19. Florida St. 7-6 392 -- 20. Nebraska 9-5 377 -- 21. Arkansas 10-4 376 15 22. TCU 11-2 283 22 23. Hawaii 11-3 256 -- 24. Boise St. 13-0 187 5 25. Texas A&M 9-4 162 -- Others receiving votes: Missouri 128, Georgia Tech 94, Boston College 75, Oregon 73, South Carolina 69, Miami 68, Alabama 66, Oregon St. 42, Wake Forest 40, South Florida 28, Arizona St. 17, BYU 14, Southern Miss. 12, Notre Dame 11, Virginia 7, Clemson 6, Oklahoma St. 3, Texas Tech 2, Houston 1, Kentucky 1, N.C. State 1,

Goaltending or lack there of probably wasn't the only reason why the Blues went in the tank a few years ago.

Samuelsson scored a pretty good goal from the point on the PP in the playoffs against the Sharks and played a pretty big part in helping put them away the last 2 games of that series.