kipwinger

Basically how I'll feel if Tampa wins the Cup as well.

Like I said, it's 2008 Datsyuk vs. Crosby. No denying that McDavid has been the better point producer (like Crosby was) but Draisaitl is the better all around player (like Datsyuk was). He just influences the game in so many more ways, AND now he's finally out producing McDavid too. Sick burn. But you forgot a few things. Size/Strength: Draisaitl, Faceoffs: Draisaitl. P/60: Draisaitl. So this knob figures it 5 to 3 for Leon.

It's hard to say he's not better in some very key areas than McDavid though. He's better defensively for sure, better face off guy, kills penalties, and scores more goals. McDavid has him in playmaking, and is certainly a better transition player, but it's not obvious to me that McDavid is the better overall player. Reminds me a bit of 2008 Datsyuk vs. 2008 Crosby.

So, at what point do we start talking about the elephant in the room? Namely, that Leon Draisaitl is the best player in the NHL and it's really not even that close. Dude's got 10 points in the 4 games McDavid has been out of the lineup, basically putting to bed the "well I'd score on McDavid's wing too" narrative AND he plays Selke caliber defense.

You're absolutely right, Lafreniere has a much better track record when he was in midget hockey. ELITE!!! And that totally matters as much as what a guy does in his draft year. Which is why Joe Veleno is such a superstar these days.

Hahaha, you just keep digging your own grave. There is not a single player in the NHL making 5.5 million per year who hasn't topped 50 points. Not one. Most of them have done so multiple times. So tell me why Namestnikov is going to be the special case again? AND on a long term deal too? You literally have no idea what you're talking about. Also, even if your Hayes example were accurate (it isn't) he's a more productive offensive player by a pretty substantial margin (.55 ppg vs. .45 ppg) so of course Namestnikov will make less money. They're not really comparable at all. Just admit you're wrong bro. The truth will set you free.

So in the face of me pointing out that Rossi is better defensively, plays a harder position, and scores just as much as Lafreniere this is your response? Why don't you address the facts? Tell me why Lafreniere is so much better "and it's not even close". Seems pretty close to me. Edit: Also, I've said what I would do multiple times. If I had the 1st pick I'd trade back and absolutely fleece some gullible dummy who (like you) thinks there's some huge divide between Lafreniere and the rest of the top 4 or 5 picks. Then I'd take one of Byfield, Stutzle, or Rossi along with the haul I got from that other GM and continue to rebuild my team. See, unlike you, I don't mind having a contrary point of view once in while and doing so definitively and publicly. I think Lafreniere will probably end up being about as good as Patrik Laine. And I think if you look back across most NHL drafts you'll find that the best centers and defensemen are more valuable pieces than the best wingers, regardless of draft position. So yeah, I wouldn't draft him.

Lol. You said Namestnikov would make 6 million, long term. I said nobody who's never scored 50 points gets that kind of contract. I backed that up with facts (there literally isn't a single example of it in the whole league). And you're still doubling down? This time by changing it to 5.5 million and arguing that the Hayes example (which you provided) isn't really all that relevant anyway? You're like the Larry Nassar of mental gymnastics.

You literally couldn't be more wrong. Kevin Hayes has scored more than 50 points. And so has every other forward with a cap hit of 6 million dollars or more. So your "one example" is wrong, and there literally are no others. Nice try though. Keep after it and one day you'll make a valid point. Here's the list. https://www.capfriendly.com/browse/active/2020/caphit/all/forwards

That was actually a real question, since you and I recently discussed his value in the context of the way the market is shaping up. But yes...I'm bored everyday.

Still thinking "AA = 2nd round pick"?

You're right, Lafreniere is way better. Which is why he's worse defensively, plays an easier position, and has the same number of points. They're clearly worlds apart. Edit: Also, they're both in the CHL. So you can stop with this "different leagues" crap. They have the exact same rules, in the exact same country, and the exact same recruiting pool. There are marginal differences in scoring between the OHL, WHL, or QMJHL, but they change almost ever single year. If they're "different leagues" because of that, then so are the AL and NL in Major League Baseball. Which is, obviously, idiotic.

Guilty as charged. I am condescending when dealing with things like you. But you didn't respond to my original post because you wanted to point that out. You responded to my post because you thought you had some really valid insight about GMs and bad contracts. And you failed. Which I suspect is a common occurrence for you. In the future, if you wanna make the point that I'm a d*ck, just say that. Leave the hockey part out of your equation. It's easier for you that way.

As is your norm, you responded to me, and then acted butt hurt when you got exposed. Not my fault. Why don't you just block me? I get nothing out of making you and KRsmith look stupid as often as I do. And if you're going to keep coming for me, better get your facts straight bud.

Wrong again guy. Here, let me help you. https://www.nhl.com/player/kevin-hayes-8475763#stats See, you have to add his points from NYR (42) to his points from Winnipeg (13) together. How much is that? C'mon, you can do it. So, do you just wanna take a loss on this one or are you going to triple down on being a goof?

And if you fact checked that dummy you'd realize he's wrong. Kevin Hayes scored 55 points in 18-19. So is the egg on both your faces for being reactionary dipsh*ts, or just his? Edit: Also, providing one (factually inaccurate) example isn't even close to your insinuation that there are "no shortage" of GMs giving out these types of contracts to these types of players, which implies it happens with regularity.

For a 50 point defenseman maybe. Which forwards are making 6 million long term and have never scored 50 points? I'll wait.

Remember when I started telling all you losers about how awesome Marco Rossi was, and you couldn't stop butt-sniffing Lafreniere? Chew on this nugget from the Athletic's Scott Wheeler, douchebags. "Rossi has reached video game levels in the OHL. He’s probably junior hockey’s most dominant three-zone player, frankly. And while he’s older than most in this class, the number of remaining doubts I have in the translation of his game sits at zero. Don’t listen to anyone who says he will have to switch to winger at the pro level, either. Rossi is a dominant defensive center who is so strong on his feet and low to the ice that I have literally seen him throw people over his shoulders. There have been times this season when Rossi was so good on faceoffs that teams have moved players to the wing because they can’t beat him. He’s got it all. He’s slick with the puck, he absorbs contact effortlessly and stick checks effortlessly. He can open up and go heel-to-heel to survey the offensive zone and he sees things that other players don’t. Though you have to consider the strength of team and age, I have little doubt as to whether Rossi would be terrorizing teams no matter where he played. I recently asked Ottawa 67’s general manager James Boyd for his honest opinion on Rossi. He didn’t hold back. “He’s a phenomenal player. Phenomenal. A few teams that have picked up on it. I’m biased but I think he’s the best player in our league. It’s not often you’ve got a player on your team who is the best offensive player, the best defensive player, the best guy on faceoffs, the best guy on the power play, the best guy on the penalty kill and probably your No. 1 shootout shooter,” Boyd said. “And the thing is he doesn’t cheat, so as the game goes along, he takes over. The No. 1 thing for me is his skating — which was a concern for some people — is phenomenal. He’s just continued to improve. He is obsessed with getting better. Some guys are interested in getting better, he’s obsessed. If I told him to eat a pound of sunflower seeds every day because it would help him get to the NHL, he’d be right on it. It’s only going to continue. You hear this sort of stuff about Sidney Crosby or Shea Weber when they were juniors, it’s almost like a disorder, the striving to get better. I see the same thing in Marco, nothing’s going to stop him.”

Some of my favorite things to do on LGW are compare what people A) think someone is worth in a trade vs. what they actually get in return, or B) compare what people think a UFA will sign for vs. what they actually do. It's hilarious how bad most fans are at player valuation. Anybody who thinks a guy who's never scored 50 pts in the NHL is going to get a 6 million dollar contract for (near) max term is delusional.

Marco Scandella AND Brendan Dillon both traded, both get 2nd and 3rd round picks in return. So we about ready to up our expectations for Andreas Athanasiou yet or no? Correction: Scandella return was a 2nd and 4th.

Comparable to Madison Bowey.

Puljujarvi is not a top prospect. He's a bust. He couldn't produce with Connor McDavid as his center. So no, I wouldn't. As far as Keane, he's a "middling" prospect because he has no track record of production and only projects as a 3rd pairing defenseman. His numbers this year, while reasonably impressive, are the exception and not the norm. Haven't seen a single source who suggests he's be anything other than a defensive defenseman.

If not you hang on to him, let him play out the season, and trade him at the draft or at next year's deadline when he's bounced back. He's an extremely valuable asset because he's a proven scorer, young, RFA, and isn't in line for a huge payday. People looking to offload him for Jesse Puljujarvi or whatever have no idea what they're throwing away here. Same thing a couple years ago with Tatar. Look back through LGW and see how many dummies were trying to give that guy away for basically nothing. Or better yet, if Brendan Smith was worth a 2nd and 3rd then AA is worth a f*ck of a lot more than a 2nd.

I think that given the prices that guys like Toffoli, Zucker, etc. are getting you'd be dumb to trade him for a 2nd. Especially since it's looking like there's an arms race shaping up in the east and 1sts are already on the table. If he gets traded for a 2nd there will be other valuable pieces thrown in. He'll either fetch a 1st, or 2nd plus (another 2nd or good prospect).

Would you trade AA for a 2nd straight up? Yes or no?