kipwinger

Correct, never trade a player for another player if there's a good reason to believe the second player will not turn out better than the first. You don't have to be as smart as me. You could be as smart as the actual Kip Winger. Because even a washed up, druggie, hair metal rocker from the 80's probably knows not to trade something for something else without knowing that the later has more value than the former. Do you seriously think it's a good idea to trade something without knowing the value of the thing you're getting back? Because I've got this mystery box...

Is being "sent down" only to Grand Rapids now? He had another year of junior eligibility. If he was so un-worthy of an NHL roster spot he could have been sent down. Lots of other players from his draft class still are.

I think he was saying that Rasmussen looked "dominant" when sent down to Grand Rapids for his conditioning stint. He had two goals in three games. Hence his reference to small sample size.

Rasmussen absolutely COULD be sent down, to Tri-City, according to the very same rules of Junior eligibility that all other Junior players are governed by. Wings management decided he was too good for that, was NHL ready, and kept him on the big club instead of sending him back. This "he couldn't be sent down" crap is just another attempt by the same old crowd to make up fake talking points to justify their own irrational points of view.

You willingness to obfuscate in order to cover up your dopey preferences is admirable. I said multiple times I don't know who will be better in the long turn. Which is why it would be a stupid trade. Because you don't know what you'd be getting out of Hughes. I also don't think "most people" would say Hughes has the higher ceiling after his so-so freshman year in the NCAA. At the very least an honest evaluator would probably conclude that Hughes' NHL projection is up in the air right now, which is EXACTLY why you shouldn't trade someone like Rasmussen for him. And yes, you did say Hughes was a better player than Rasmussen. I've bolded it below. Stop trying to wiggle out of this. It's genuinely pathetic. At the very least stick to your guns, as misguided and cringeworthy as they are. I also like how you keep saying "most people think" or "most agree". Who are these people? You and Pronman in his preseason rankings? You say Hughes is a better player/prospect and I keep asking what you're basing that on. Why not tell us? Give us a breakdown why Hughes is better based on his play up to this point and not based on more made up crap.

I agree that ideally you wouldn't want Abby and Nielsen (Helm, Glenny, Dekeyser, Ericsson too) on their current contracts. But I also don't think it hurts us that much given how many ELCs we have on the books in the coming years. My bigger issue with the roster is the presence of guys like De La Rose and Ehn. Abby-Glen-Helm is a decent enough 4th line. It's a HORRIBLE 3rd line. That's a depth problem and one that will hopefully be solved with the additions of Zadina, Svech, and possible Veleno in the next year to year and a half. Plus whomever we draft this year with our top pick, and potentially some free agents, as well.

First you said Hughes "IS a better player/prospect", and then backed off that because it's based on nothing and suggested I misinterpreted you. Then you claim I'm acting like Rasmussen "IS and WILL BE" better when the bolded above shows I clearly don't think that and clearly said so. This is just another in a long list of examples where you say something ridiculous and then either completely change your argument or create some phony strawman in order to not seem absurd and arbitrary.

I've already said multiple times that I'm not sure who "will be" better (I've explicitly said so twice). I've only said who I think IS better and why I think so. If you're going to make up arguments in order to rebut them then I don't know what to tell you. Again, I just wish we were GMs. How does Hughes fill a greater team need? We already have Filip Hronek, who is exactly like Hughes except that's he's playing better at a higher level. We literally have nobody in our organization like Rasmussen. If you think that having a quality net front guy is important, and most people do, then it's hard to conclude that Rasmussen doesn't fill a greater need given what our prospect pool looks like.

I didn't "interpret" anything any particular way. You said "most would agree Hughes IS a better player". You didn't qualify it in any way in your original post. If that's not what you meant then you should be more precise. I interpreted your words exactly as you wrote them. I don't know who will be better in the long run. I think Rasmussen is definitely better than Hughes now based on that fact that he's having a decent NHL rookie year while Hughes is having a decent freshman year in the NCAA. Neither of them are even close to their ceilings. So trading our big winger for an offensive defenseman, especially considering we've got a rookie offensive defenseman who's playing great in the NHL, seems like a bad idea to me because it's so obviously premature.

Pronman's ranking was made pre-season. Since then Hughes has been OK in college hockey, and Rasmussen has been OK in the NHL. But that's not what I asked. You said Hughes was already is a BETTER PLAYER than Rasmussen. Care to explain what you've based that assessment on? The reason I bring up Werenski is because Quinn Hughes is supposed to be an elite offensive defenseman, but he's not having an elite offensive season relative to other elite caliber defensemen in the same situation. And unlike Werenski he's neither big, nor defensively adept, so if he's not putting up big points he's not really having much of an impact elsewhere. Meanwhile, Rasmussen is playing in the hardest league in the world, is getting quality developmental time including on the powerplay (where we hope he's going to be lethal one day), and he definitely looks like a 20+ goal guy going forward. You're welcome to like whomever you want, but I wish we were both GMs. I'd gladly take all your decent 19 year old NHL rookies for my decent 19 year old NCAA freshmen.

Based on what? Hughes is currently scoring at a slower clip than Zach Werenski did at Michigan his freshman year, but instead of being 6'2, 200 lbs, and a stud defender, he's 5'10, 175 lbs, and is not especially good defensively at all. I venture to guess if you just looked at his performance, size, and deficiencies, and didn't know he was Quinn Hughes you wouldn't be all that impressed. Which is exactly my point. Quinn Hughes may turn out to be a good NHLer, maybe even better than Rasmussen But at this point that's FAR from certain and definitely not a slam dunk.

Trading a top 10 pick and one of the organization's most promising young players counts as a pretty significant price. Particularly when we've already got an guy who looks like he'll be an undersized, top 3, offensive defensemen and powerplay specialist. And we don't have anyone like Rasmussen in our organization As for the 2nd line winger vs. top 3 defenseman, depends on what they're good at and what you've got a lot of. If the winger makes your powerplay lethal because he's so good around the net then maybe he's the more valuable piece because he's so specialized. I know when Holmostrom was on the team nobody was clamoring to trade him for anything, let alone an offensive defenseman who isn't likely going to be a #1 top guy (given his small stature and defensive shortcomings).

I get such a kick out of how hung up people are on big names sometimes. Quinn Hughes is a really good defensive prospect. But there are a couple of reasons to not just throw the bank at a guy like that. First, his style might not be that conducive to the more structured NHL game. So there's a chance he'll be a better prospect than he will an NHL player (happens all the time, see: Pulkkinen, Teemu). Secondly, we've already got a pretty good offensive defenseman who's putting up good points in the NHL already as a rookie. Filip Hronek is scoring at a 40 point pace in the NHL ALREADY. He just doesn't have the draft pedigree so people downplay it. Why break the bank for a smallish, offensive, powerplay specialist, who needs to be sheltered at even strength when you've already got one? Not saying I wouldn't trade for Quinn Hughes. Just saying if you took names out of it and said Player A vs. Player B this might not be so clear cut.

I'll be curious to see how Stone fits in with Vegas. He's going from one of the league's slowest systems to one of the league's fastest. Plus his skating is his only real weakness. May not be a home run right away.

Yup, good call. I had that totally wrong. Guess we're hoping FLA has a late season collapse then. They're currently 9th from the bottom, but are within 5 points of 5th. So there's that.

So we're hoping Florida has good lottery luck now? I'll take that. They're in the bottom 3rd of the league right now.

Link isn't opening for me for some reason. Is this legit? Florida's 2nd? I feel WAY better about that.

This is such an odd deal. I'd almost rather the Stanley Cup finals condition not be met by SJ because it would turn the second rounder this year into almost a 3rd rounder. If they lose early we don't get the 2nd next year, but the one this year will be higher. So really we should all hope SJ loses early in the playoffs, but then Nyquist decides to sign with them in the offseason anyway lol.

I think I'd rather they just targeted a prospect here. San Jose's picks are likely going to be late rounders and any 2nd rounder picked this year or next is likely 3-4 years away from helping us in the best case scenario. Well, I just f'ing hope someone decides they need Howard pretty badly between now and tomorrow afternoon.

Ouch.

How do we know you're not a social justice warrior acting as an agent provocateur? Isn't that exactly the kind of thing they'd do?

Veleno with another 3 point night tonight.

Mickey Redmond is such an insane old coot. I can't wait until he retires. Hronek is 170 lbs. Why is he on the PK?

Well, that and the fact that the only thing he ever had going for him to begin with was that he was a really good story. Being 5'8 or whatever is the only reason he mattered to anyone to begin with, and ironically that's a big reason why he'll never been any good.

If we wanted to re-sign Kronwall wouldn't he just take...Kronwall's spot?