kipwinger

I don't think anyone is anti-Eaves. I think he has just struggled to find his place on the team since missing a year to injury. As such, he just seems expendable comparatively. Especially with the accent of the young guys. Personally, I think he's ideally suited for a third line semi-scoring role (which he wouldn't get on this team). He's got more to give than your average everyday grinder. As such, I really think it's a disservice to him to stay on this team. I see him going to a young team in the offseason and having a good bit more success than he's had here. He'd fit in well on Edmonton's team to be honest.

A couple of things. Kronwall is a top 30 defenseman...easily. Also, given how Tatar and Nyquist have produced in their rookie seasons, it's not unreasonable to see them (especially) Tatar up in the 30 goal range. If so, and depending on their assist totals, they may be able to crack top fifty forwards in another couple of years. I think Jurco and Mantha both have that ceiling as well, as do Sproul and Mrazek at their respective positions.

I was thinking about Zidlicky too. I agree with your thoughts about the unpopularity of the move. But he's a good puck mover and would definitely help on the powerplay. His contract isn't too bad either.

I've heard this rumor too but it doesn't make any sense to me. St. Louis is one of the best teams in the league, Stewart is producing well, and they've already got great scoring and defense. Why screw up team chemistry to add a piece that really doesn't provide much? Even if that piece is a good one.

I like to think of my Ken Holland with giant angel wings and singing lead vocals for Lynyrd Skynyrd with like an angel band, and I'm in the front row and I'm hammered drunk.

I'm not really sure why we'd want Vanek. I mean, I get that he's really good and would be a nice fit on the team and all. But I don't think we need a superstar goal scorer. Especially at the expense of our young talent. Wouldn't a guy who put up 20-25 goals and was hard to play against benefit us just as much and not require the massive payment?

I don't think I'm being clear. I don't want Babcock fired. As I stated before, he's one of the better coaches in the league and every coach who's as good or better is locked up somewhere else. I definitely didn't want to imply that he should be fired...he shouldn't. My previous posts were 1) A response to the hypothetical "what if" question posed in the title; 2) An attempt to explain why I don't think Babs is THE BEST coach.

Right, but all that proves is that Babcock is better than Lewis. I wouldn't argue that. I'm just saying he's done a good amount of winning with a freakishly talented lineup. Show me a guy that wins almost as much, with FAR less talented lineups and I'll show you a better coach. Babs is good, Tippett is better.

Why is Brian Lashoff not playing? Too much defensive responsibility?

I agree with that, and I think he'll certainly be a 2nd pairing guy eventually. I guess I was asking if you really felt comfortable with him on the 2nd pair next season as you'd suggested bringing in a stay at home type vet to play with Lashoff and thus making Smith the second pair puck mover. I guess I just don't like him (yet) on the second pair if we're going to try and compete for a Cup.

Bingo. Compared to what we've iced for almost the entire season I think it's significantly better. But every point you made is valid and I'd add that I don't agree with many of his lines/defensive pairings. However I think that roster (rearranged) would probably make the playoffs, but not challenge for the cup, which is what I think we're capable with a couple changes (Kindl gone, Smith to the third, puck mover to the second, and power forward to the top six).

Do you really feel comfortable with Smith on the second pair? We've had our back and forth on the Kindl or Smith question, and I'll concede that I was wrong on that one. Smith is the better option over Kindl, BUT I still don't like him on my second pair right now. In a year or two, with significant progress, sure. But right now, I think a second pair with Smith gets exposed in the playoffs against a quality team. I agree about adding defense, but I'd prefer to sign a second pair guy and drop Smith down with Lashoff until he's more reliable.

His lines usually do. Tootoo is actually a pretty deft passer. It's a seriously underrated part of his game.

You're not wrong, I was. I was reading bad info. He was bought out, so his big salary is gone. He's 900,000. Both he and Boyes are making about a million a piece and are producing well. Which will only increase their value on the trade market considering how tight to the cap everyone is.

Well played.

This was hard because it's significantly better than what we've got now, and because it would probably make the playoffs. But I don't think it would win the Cup and I want one more of those before Datsyuk and Zetterberg decline. As such, any lineup that doesn't compete for a Cup is wasting another year of their careers and the lineup above needs a power forward and a better puck mover than Smith to make that happen.

Dave Tippett consistently produces playoff quality teams with almost nothing to work with. Look at my post above. The VAST majority of Mike Babcock's success came with that kind of talent. Babs came to Detroit in 2005 and walked onto a team that had four 80 point players. He coached that team to a first round loss by the way. Edit: For accuracy, Mike Modano had 85 pts. in 2003, and Mike Ribiero had 83 in 2008. That's it. Twice in his coaching career has Tippett had that kind of player and he still takes his teams to the playoffs consistently. Edit Edit: Both Babs and Tippett became head coaches during the 2002-2003 season. Since then Babs has 445 regular season wins. Tippett has 427. Not too shabby with a tenth the talent level, budget, or free agent allure.

I think the love for Babs gets a little overblown sometimes. Is he one of the better coaches in the league? Yes. But it's crazy how Iron Mike has hoodwinked everyone. He put a good year together with Anaheim and there really wasn't much to work with...so kudos to him for that. Then he came to Detroit and walked onto a team with talent like Yzerman, Shanahan, Osgood, Hasek, Draper, Maltby, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall, and eventually Hossa. If he didn't have a Cup and a bunch of wins with that kind of talent he'd be the worst coach in the history of professional coaching. It's not unlike what Quenneville adopted, except maybe his team was a little less proven. Many deride Q for adopting his team, but conveniently overlook the fact that

I honestly have never really seen Gilbert play too much. I looked at his stat line, which was impressive, and his salary (which seems high at 5 mil) but I'll gladly defer to someone who's seen more of him than I have. I also noticed he doesn't score on the PP alot, which either means he doesn't play on it...or shouldn't play on it. In an ideal situation I'd prefer a puck mover who can play the point on the PP and let Alfie do what he ought to be doing (halfboards). As for Boyes, he's scored a ton of goals in his career but I don't really see how he fits. We've already got third line wingers and I don't see him in our top six. Also, while being a quality goal scorer, he's incredibly week on the puck and I'd prefer someone who's hard to play against. Then again, it's a ton of production for almost no money so I can see the allure.

When asked to comment on his first start in Boston since his puzzling departure, Tim Thomas had this to say... "I'm really just focused on getting ready for tomorrow's game," he said. "You know me, I don't try to overblow things." Ha. I sure hope that was Timbo being cheeky, because if he really feels that way he's delusional...er...more so than usual.

Fair enough, all good points.

The Fourth Period is rumoring that the Wings are now interested in Brad Boyes AND Tom Gilbert of the Panthers. Boyes has 14 goals and Gilbert 24 pts. this season. There's one way to get Weiss' offense going...bring his entire team up from Florida. Unfortunately, while Weiss' game will pick up, our team will only be as good as the Florida panthers.

I mean, I can't objectively back it up. There are guys with more wins, guys with more Cups, guys with loads of international accolades. But nobody has won as often as Tippett with less talent than Tippett. That, to me, is the best in the biz. Can't argue there. Hitch is a real good coach.

For me it has nothing to do with politics. Guys screw their careers up all the time. Wade Redden did it by signing for too much money, Jeff Finger did it for (being no good) and going to Toronto, Dipietro did it by not committing (even a little bit) to good training habits. Every one of them got made fun of relentlessly on this forum and every other forum. Timmy is not exempt from being clowned on just because he was better than they were.

I think if we had Hudler back Babcock's head might explode. He'd stick Huds on the third line with Tatar and some center, and they'd be the highest scoring 3rd in the league and Babs would be sooooooooooo pissssssssssssssssed.