kipwinger

I'm not trying to talk you out of anything, and I don't want to argue. But I really, really, want to know what you like about Smith. You can message me if you want so that you don't have to argue with anyone else. But I've got to know why he's on that list.

Next year Kindl will be second in defense scoring on this team, just behind Kronwall. And it will be closer than anyone thinks. He's made the 2nd PP his own, and had a knack for timely production. He's also improved in in zone coverage tremendously. He's still got some work to do on his first pass, but otherwise he's really made strides. I have no idea what's not to like about that for 2.4 million. He probably just needs to punch someone and the naysayers will get on board.

No.

Now I'm curious what kind of money Brendan Smith is going to make. Hmm...

Well good deal. If you can skate and you've got that kind of size and attitude you can help someone in the NHL. I'll have to follow his development a little more closely. Thus far I've pretty much focused all my attention on Richard Nedomlel as our future blueline tough guy. But he's more like Volchenkov and less a fighter.

Considering he's the third best defenseman on our team I can't complain too much. He'll be more productive next year as well. I've always sort of pulled for Kindl too so I'm happy with it. He really stepped it up last season and I think he's still got another level above what he accomplished this year. There were times when he was a legitimate threat skating the puck out of the zone. Once he can do that consistently I think he's a second pair puck mover easily. Edit: Good point by Crymson too, I think he clearly had the best shot on our defense this season too. He finds open shooting lanes...if he gets a little more accurate with it he'll be a real good point on the PP.

I'm not mad about this contract, but I really believed he'd get less. Damn this free cap space sure does go quickly doesn't it?

How does McKee skate? That pretty much will determine the rest of his career. A big lumbering goof who likes to fight won't make it in today's game. A tough guy who can skate a quality shift has a future however.

He doesn't want to play on a team of chronic underachievers? Oh wait...

I'm pretty surprised that Letang is quibbling about 500,000 dollars. He must really want out of Pittsburgh.

lol. Clarkson has scored more than 20 goals exactly once and never topped 50 points. Horton has scored more than 20 goals six times, and topped 50 points four times. I'll agree that he'll be cheaper and that he's likely tougher. But to suggest that he's as capable a point producer ignores the entirety of both their careers, and rests on the demonstrably false assumption that a 30 year old player is somehow going to develop offense he's never had up to that point in his career. If you believe that then I've got a 5 million dollar contract for Valtteri Filppula I'd love to have you sign. Clarkson had a good season last year. Nathan Horton has been scoring goals his entire career. No comparison.

For real, Bickell hasn't score more than 17 goals in any of his NHL seasons and Clarkson has had one and half good years. Sure they're both tough but to even consider paying them the kind of money they would make on the open market is insane for Detroit. Unless we want five million plus wrapped up in guys who can barely skate, are physically strong, and MAY contribute offensively. You know what's funny, even last year when Clarkson had his breakout 30 goal season he still only had 8 more points than Bertuzzi.

Right or he tries his patented coast to coast b.s. and some defenseman who can actually skate blows him up. Kronwall, Stevens, Konstantinov. They didn't have defensemen that open ice hit like that in Orr's day. Hence, he could skate around and make them look stupid.

Mlive wrote an article today about Joe McDonnell and his draft responsibilities. Not going to say he's diverging from past trends, but it certainly sounds promising. http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2013/06/red_wings_prefer_decent-sized.html

I can't believe how gaga everybody is going over Bickell and Clarkson. Half this forum goes into an uproar about Franzen, his contract, and how he hasn't played up to the level he was signed at. And now we're going to pay more for Bickell or Clarkson, who have a shorter period of goal scoring success? Horton is the only one with a track record for goal scoring, and he's going to make a fortune. Does the difference between wanting a guy and not wanting a guy really boil down being able to punch people once in a while?

Interesting tidbit. Jim Nill had nearly the final say in all draft related issues before he took his job in Dallas. Today I read that Joe McDonnell will be taking over those responsibilities as the new assistant general manager. It will be interesting to see whether there are any variations in the way that they draft this season. I don't think it will be major, as our draft philosophy isn't going to get flushed down the tube, but history has show a preference for versatile two-way centers and defensemen at the draft. Maybe McDonnell likes the wingers more? Who knows, but no matter how long he's apprenticed, he's bound to have his own ideas.

In his article today, John Niyo of the Detroit News suggested that the Wings should seriously consider trading any one of their young up and comers (not named Dekeyer). He listed Kindl and Smith by name and lumped all the young forwards as potentials as well. I don't want this thread to become a debate about the merits of Niyo's suggestion, but rather wanted to know who you'd all rather keep if it came down to trading Tatar or Nyquist. I think one of the two is likely on the way out for a couple reasons. They're stock is about as high as it's going to get. There's very little roster space as it is without adding anybody from outside the organization. Also it would be a bit redundant to have Tatar, Nyquist, AND Brunner on this team. That's a lot of small skilled euros on a team that keeps talking about getting bigger each year. My thoughts? Nyquist is undeniably talented and showed good chemistry and skill with Andersson and Brunner in the playoffs. However, Tatar had the better season in terms of point production, seems to attack the net more, and might have leap frogged Nyquist after his Calder Cup performance. Tough call, but I've got to say I'd rather keep Tatar. So, your thoughts?

So my question is, would any of you trade Brendan Smith plus whatever for that 5th overall pick so long as we kept our 18th as well?

Agreed, but the point of the thread was to determine who you would trade IF you had to, and why.

Who presents the trophies in every other major sport? I seriously don't know.

I'm down with this trade, but it only happens if Dave Dombrowski is given control of the Red Wings for an afternoon. Agreed, this proposal is pretty tongue in cheek. He made a trade and buyout thread so I just threw the first one up I could think of. I have no idea whether Wheeler is available or what it would take to get Weiss's rights. It's just for a laugh.

Sweet, trade Filppula's rights and whatever else to Winnepeg for Blake Wheeler's rights. Trade a conditional 4th to Florida for Weiss's rights. Bingo bango, got a big power winger and a center to replace Flip. Also, sweeten either pot with Tootoo, Colaiacovo, Eaves, or Emmerton as necessary.

I agree, he was better than any other defenseman in his era. He was the very first "offensive defenseman". That's the reason he scored so much...because he tried to do it. In those days all defensemen were stay-at-home. That's how they played the game. Bobby revolutionized that. HOWEVER, saying that he's the best of his age doesn't then also mean that he's the best ever. Bobby could never do that against today's competition because everybody does it now, and therefore teams plan for it. Lidstrom would score just as many points, no matter what era, because he scored them classically. Point shots and assists. He was just SUPER good at it. But technically speaking he didn't score in a different way than McInnis, Iafrate, etc. etc. etc. I compare the Bruins with Orr to Bill Walsh's 49ers and their "west coast offense". They tore it up because nobody had seen it or figured it out yet. However, eventually everybody caught up. So now, when a team running a west coast offense puts up gaudy numbers (though still less than the 49ers), it's actually more impressive because it's not succeeding because it's new, it's succeeding because it's executed well.

If Z or Dats were on the cusp of retiring I'd say keep Nyquist, but given that they'll be around a few years I say move him for a scorer or top flight defenseman.

Lidstrom, bar none. Orr didn't play defense. He had a good plus/minus because he put up a zillion points. Tighter defense and better goaltending would expose his "offensive prowess" and his defensive numbers would likewise suffer. Orr's over rated, Lids played in a time when scoring was harder, defensive assignments were tougher, and going "coast to coast" was almost unheard of. Even then he managed to win 7 Norris Trophies and and twice as many Stanley Cups and he was a factor in every one of them. Bobby was good, but score 150 going end to end against Weber, Suter, and Rinne. Not happening buddy.