kipwinger

If he thinks that, then he clearly hasn't been paying attention to how the Edmonton Oilers have run their hockey club since around 1990.

I'm getting a little irritated by this whole "giving up the future" argument. They are absolutely loaded with defensive prospects. Moving one out of the bunch isn't going to "mortgage the future". They have defensive prospects like we have forward prospects, we're lousy with them. God forbid we move one and rely on the rest for the "future".

I agree, but I don't just mean this season. I mean in general. If you look at the Pens team, who did they develop on their own? Crosby, Fleury, Malkin, Letang, Kennedy. Those guys are all good, but they are only marginally better than Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Howard, Filppula, and Kronwall...if they're better at all. However, they've gone out and acquired Neal, Kunitz, Sutter, Martin, Dupuis...and now Murray and Morrow. I'm not saying Shero is a better GM than Holland, he doesn't draft or develop players any better than Holland does, and Holland didn't have the option of picking high for guys like Crosby or Malkin. Where Holland really misses the boat is in the trade/FA markets, where he usually misses out on higher end talent because he likes to play it safe. You don't get quality players (that you didn't develop yourself) by refusing to move good young prospects, and by refusing to pay market value. Which is why they got Neal, Sutter, Kunitz, Martin, etc. and we got Sammy, Bert, White, and Quincey.

I don't mind that they're setting the price high. It's actually kind of refreshing to see a GM who recognizes holes in his lineup and goes out and acquires the pieces he needs to win. Shero could have paid third rate prices, and he would have got third rate players. As it is he got two guys that could really help his team and he didn't make excuses or ***** foot around about it. Good for him.

Haha. Cute. Who does he think Jarome Iginla is...Jarome Iginla 6 years ago?

Again, I'd do it for M. Subban because he's highly overrated. I certainly wouldn't for Mrazek. As I stated in the Iginla thread, I'd rather pursue just about any other winger than him.

If I could get Iginla for Malcolm Subban I'd do it in a second. Subban is garbage. But I agree with the sentiment, Iginla's asking price is sky high by all accounts.

Not true, Brian Burke has called out the league on this type of stuff for a long time. Going so far as to compare it to European soccer. Of course, it's Brian Burke, so he's obviously wrong. Speaking of, the Maple Leafs team that Burke put together in spite of a zillion jeers is playing pretty decent hockey eh?

He's in the same situation that we have with Nyquist right now. An obviously talented player who just isn't putting it all together yet. What he needs is more development and to be eased into their system. I doubt they trade him, as they're on record as wanting more offense. Just like here in Detroit, you've got the fans screaming for him to play because they like their shiny new toy, and an organization who realizes that all the skill in the world doesn't guarantee success in the NHL if you don't play the right style of game.

I can't find the presser anywhere online, should be happening now though. Edit: Boooooooring. Just a bunch of silly platitudes about "finding their game" and "playing angry" and blah blah blah.

I wouldn't agree to that because I have never seen him play, and the odds are against him ever being as good as either of those two. We'll see what he turns in to, but in general I'm against comparing the development of a 21 year old prospect with no North American hockey experience to vaunted NHL superstars. Then again, I would have said the same thing about Dats and Z at that age. And I would have been wrong.

Right, I completely agree. As I said, he's got a couple more years before he'll play in the NHL effectively.

This kid only weighs 175 lbs. He's got a while before he's ready to play in the NHL effectively. I am happy to see what he can do in the AHL though.

I don't want an expensive rental. I'll take a cheaper rental, but not one that's likely not going to say with your team and who will cost a boat load. If we're in the market for an expensive star winger I'd chase Gaborik before Iginla. At least he's under contract for another year. Also, Iginla seriously loves Calgary, as does his family by all accounts. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if he was traded, Calgary got a king's ransom for him, and he returned there in the off season. No thanks.

Thank you, finally someone else who's not mesmerized by the legacy of Stevie Y. So far he's done nothing to show he's a good GM. People tend to forget that long before Holland was a GM he was the head of scouting for Detroit and that has no doubt shaped how he's built his teams. Stevie doesn't have that background, nor does he have first hand experience at any other level of management.

Well if he doesn't trade Tatar we're not doing anything because god knows Nyquist isn't going anywhere. I mean, look at how he stickhandles. Kid's gonna be a star I tell ya.

No, but I do think that that's a part of it. Ericsson has played outstanding this season, but he's not a top pairing defenseman. We need a legit top six and top four, and if we don't have those and keep relying on guys to "take the next step" or "dust the cobwebs off" or whatever then we're going to stay exactly as we are, a good team that's missing the right pieces. Abby's game last night is a prime example. Good for him for playing that well, and it sure worked out last night. But he's not a top six winger, and I don't think there's anybody (aside from the reactionary dips***s at the Free Press) who feels comfortable relying on him to play that way. Does anybody think he could be a difference maker like that in a seven game series? Does anybody think that Ericsson could shut down top lines on top teams consistently in a series? The fact that they've done as well as they have is a god send, but without actual high end pieces our luck will run cold eventually. Your rhetorical b.s. aside, nobody thinks that an acquisition guarantees us anything. But not making moves and playing .500 hockey all but guarantees we won't even get close. Also, it's not like the only guys available are rentals. You could get guys that have a shelf life, you'd just have to pay for them.

I think the fact that we've beaten the Ducks and played strong against Chicago is a testament to how competitive a team we really have. But the fact that we lost to the Ducks once, and Chicago twice is a testament to how we need a piece or two to get over the hump. I've been saying for a while that we're not a bad team, and that we really are only a piece or two away from being a Cup contender. Those games you mentioned only illustrate that point for me.

I'm really not so sure about that. His cap hit makes him mighty attractive to other teams. The term of his contract is bad, but nobody realistically thinks he'll play until the end of it anyway. The only thing stopping him from being moved is Holland's reluctance, which very well might be wearing thin. Not because Franzen is a bad player, but because if you haven't had success after repeatedly doing the same thing, a lateral move might be necessary. I wouldn't move him just to move him, but I'd definitely move him for Gaborik if NY was interested.

I'd move Smith for Yandle. Yandle is only 2 years older (26), so it's not like we wouldn't have a young d-core. Plus, Yandle already is everything that Smith is projected to be. A stud on the powerplay, super durable, capable of producing in transition as well as in a defense first system, and amazingly fast. Not quite as aggressive as Smith perhaps, but we don't really need our offensive d-men to be too aggressive. Plus Yandle is signed through 2016, which means you've got stability on the back end while these other young guys develop. I like Smith, and think he'll be good. But I don't think he projects any higher than Yandle, and the latter has been doing it for a while now. Who knows whether Smith turns into an all star one day, with Yandle you've already got it and will have it for quite a while. Then you can get Kronwall back to doing what he should be doing, leading the second d-pairing. Look he's a good player, he's just not better than Yandle and even if he reaches full potential, he's only projected to be what Yandle already is (and has been for a while). Yandle helps us now and in the future. Brendan Smith is still a crap shoot. He'll probably make it as an offensive d-man, but for the right return (and Yandle is that) I'd move him.

Yeah but a couple of non rentals might really help us and given what we've got coming in a few years I'd be willing to take the chance. Say Fanzen + 2nd for Gaborik, and Smith + Tatar + 1st for Yandle. All predicated on signing Dekeyser of course.

If they sign this kid we've got a whole lot of d-men with few places to put them. We've also got a lot of them coming up soon from the minors to the AHL. With all that defensive talent, Holland could possibly take a chance and move a higher end piece. I know it's not a popular opinion around here, but I'd be willing to move a package with Smith as the center piece for Yandle. We'd be so boss with that guy.

I agree, I'm just repeating what he was saying in the interview. Here's his words from the interview and the link if you're interested... “We got to win some games first,'' Holland said Friday, prior to the game against Anaheim. “I look at the trade deadline and there's buyers and sellers and (teams that) stand pat. Those that stand pat are teams on the bubble. “You don't want to throw a lot of assets at something (if) you're not sure you're going to (make) the playoffs. So we need to win some games.'' http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2013/03/red_wings_gm_ken_holland_says_3.html

John Keating rules! His analogies are legendary. Anybody remember when he compared complaining about the refs to listening to Pearl Jam? Something about how it feels good at the time but in the end it doesn't make a lot of sense. Killed me. Unfortunately he splits time with the Tigers so I don't think he'll be the replacement, which is a bummer. It'll probably be Shannon Hogan for some dumb reason.

The funny part is, the way they're playing right now, CBJ would absolutely murder the Rangers in a 7 game series. I thought all along that while Columbus could have probably got more for Nash, what they did get made them a better team. They're definitely a blue collar bunch, but there's a ton of guys on that team that play a tough hard working brand of hockey. Back to the Gaborik thing, I think it would all depend on whether Holland was willing to come off Franzen because the Rangers aren't likely to get anything better on a return and they like their big bodied players. Plus we could pretty easily handle Gaborik's contract, which will price him out of the market for most other teams. I think it's a real possibility, depending on whether Holland has the will to do so. If you added Gaborik and (in a dream world) Yandle to this team and we'd be lethal.