kipwinger

Not that they don't get treated well, but that when they go on long road trips it's a lot of miles, in a lot of cities, a long way from home. Living out of hotels and planes and buses, away from families for long(er) periods of time than they would be if they were in the East. That has traditionally been one of the arguments for going into the Eastern Conference. I wasn't saying that at the end of the analysis I agree and think the Wings should go East, but just that I understand the argument. You're right though, this is a professional sports team, they are accomodated wonderfully I'm sure.

You're right about point production but he's a -14 on the season (-18 with the s***ty Islander I know), and at his best he's not a franchise defenseman. I don't see him making that kind of money in the salary cap world. That said, I've seen the New York Rangers do dumber s*** so you may be right. I'm thinking 4.5 tops, and a steal at 4. You bring up an interesting point though and stranger things have happened.

Agreed. I'm certainly not opposed to a little dirty play when it's on our side. Chelios did it, Pronger does it. It's the name of the game sometimes and it keeps opposing players guessing. Let Datsyuk be the gentleman, let the Wiz make people pay a price.

This is why I'm saying it's important to know what role he's going to be filling. The tendency is to want whatever guy that's coming in to be in your top pair, which he won't be. Compare everything above to Rafalski over the last two years and you have a guy who's scored more points, is younger, and plays about the same amount of ice time, and is much more aggressive, but who may turn the puck over or get beat on defense. Gotta remember that Rafalski was among the team leaders in turnovers and didn't have the legs to play good D anymore so was often getting beat. Essentially you've got a guy who has most of the same flaws as Rafalski has had for a couple of seasons now but is bigger, younger, faster, and tougher, and you can get for a couple million dollars cheaper, but still gives you Rafalski level points and plays the same role as Rafalski on the PP. He doesn't have to be Nic, or Kronwall, or Stuart, he just has to be better than Rafalski was for less money and you've come out ahead. I think he is, and I think it's a no brainer...unless Bieksa is coming in around the same money haha (he'll get paid more though), then all bets are off.

I completely agree, as a matter of fact, a total dick might just be what this team needs. A little attitude or spark or something. I know it's a different game but this is exactly why the Pistons brought in Rasheed Wallace years back, his attitude supposedly kept the more passive guys from being complacent. But all that aside, the Wiz is a hell of a hockey player for the money and we absolutely must sign a top four d-man for mid range salary, there aren't many options aside from him, Bieksa, and Erhoff with that skill level and for that salary. I still like it, d-bag or not haha.

Jesus Mr. Literal, the point was that it's not good to play a steady schedule of lower quality teams and then try to make a playoff run. Switch Altanta with Toronto if it will help avoid further nit picking.

That's a bummer. Where did you find that info, I've never heard it?

You're absolutely right to have that concern. But for me the issue isn't whether or not he'll have huge numbers, realistically, if he had 20-25 per season I'd be thrilled. That's what they were hoping for from Hudler actually. Basically, I wouldn't want or need him to shoulder a huge offensive load, just enough that you have options for mixing and matching lines, and providing scoring depth through three lines by being able to (above) adequately fill several roles in the top two or three lines, something like Jordan Staal or Ryane Clowe do for their respective teams. For instance, if you had him on the second line opposite Franzen, that would leave Cleary and Bertuzzi on the third which is big advantage for us because most teams don't have the defensive depth to cover three solid lines. Plus then you don't have guys like Hudler and Miller or Eaves having to go nose to nose this guys like Pavelski, Staal, Clowe, Couture, etc. Like I said, it's a good solid depth move in my opinion.

I don't see them signing anyone older than 32-33 and I definitely don't see them signing anyone to one year contracts considering the pieces they need aren't really role pieces but core guys (top four defensman and top six forward). Look to Bieksa, Erhoff, and Wisniewski on D, and I really don't know about the forwards, not much out there...hopefully, Brooks Laich.

I agree with both of the last two posts, and so does the vast majority of sports writers who are all saying "west is best". You don't get ready for the playoffs against the Atlanta's, Florida's, or even Ottawa's of the league.

Yeah but I mean the Wings have play makers every bit as good as the Capitals and have been near the tops of the league in "goals for" for several years, so it's not like he'd be going from and offensive team like Washington to Nashville or something. He'd still have real good offensive numbers if Miller's ten goals and Eave's 13 are any indication.

I haven't read this whole discussion so maybe some agree with me on this, but I doubt it. I'm one of the few people who doesn't like a move to the East. People justifiably worry about the wear and tear and travel time for the Wings during the regular season, but I think it actually serves them well in the playoffs when there's no way to avoid a gruelling schedule. For the Wings to be successful in the Western conference means they absolutely must be successful on the road, and that is exactly the same in the playoffs no matter what conference you're in. Over the last decade the Wings have been hockey's most successful organization, regular and post season, and I really feel like the fact that we MUST win on the road and DO win on the road is a huge part of that success. I think teams in the East are often unprepared for the gruel of the playoffs because they don't have much of a taste of it throughout the season. If I had a vote, I'd say Columbus to the East, Minnesota into the central division west.

Yeah I completely agree, don't break the bank for him. But I like the depth a guy like that would provide, in addition to the toughness and size. The only issue would be that signing another forward means that either Eaves, Miller, or Hudler doesn't have a spot. I like Eaves and Miller on the fourth line with Helm, and I really wouldn't mind seeing them dump Hudler's contract (I was one of the many who thought bringing him back was a terrible idea...especially at 3 million) but would anyone take him? Or would we have to continue to sit guys like Eaves and Miller who did more with less (and for less) than Jiri?

I'm not going to lie, I'm unfamiliar with Babchuk's game. All I know about him is from what I'm reading online right now. My biggest two concerns with him would be 1. He only averages 16 minutes time on ice, and if you were playing in the top two defensive pairings for Detroit you'd need to be coming in at around 22-23 minutes. Is he capable and quality enough to take on the bigger role at this stage of his career? 2. Again, not familiar with his game, but ideally I'd like to see Rafalski's replacement play a little grittier, with more of an edge. It's not necessarily a matter of size, but of playing big and being able to compete physically with big power forwards. Sort of like Stuart does. Now here's my bias, I generally think North American defenseman are more prone to this as I believe European defenseman tend to play a more positional style of defense. How is he with physical play? Note: I just reread the previous post and realized you were talking about replacing Ericsson with Babchuk, which sort of negates the two concerns I just brought up. I thought you meant as a replacement for Rafalski. Interesting idea given this Ericsson situation.

The only other right handed shooter of this caliber in the FA class is Bieksa, who's probably better defensively, but only marginally, and not as good moving the puck or offensively. Bieksa will also likely command a much higher contract after the post season that he's had. Plus, I don't think you really have to go for a lock down defender with this signing. They're replacing Rafalski, who hasn't been real great on D for the last couple of seasons anyway, so as long as he's as good as that or better then you're even money but with more offensive production. Then when Lidstrom retires you go after the biggest, baddest, lock down guy out there in next year's FA class. Probably Burns from Minnesota. Also, here's hoping Wisniewski would sign for the old home town discount.

Yeah but wouldn't it be smart of Holland to send an offer sheet on someone like Weber (not expecting to sign him) and force Nashville to pony up and spend more of their cap on him than they really want, in essence using money to sign him that they would like to use to sign Suter next year? Sort of like what San Jose did last year with Chicago and Jalmerson. In the end they had to pay way too much to keep him and ended up losing players they likely would have liked to keep. There's more than one reason to send offer sheets to guys. That said, I tend to agree with everyone here who suggests there's no way that the Wings outbid Nashville for Weber without breaking the bank, which would be dumb and not a good idea in the long run.

It's not unrealistic to think that we could send offer sheets on low end RFA's, but it is unrealistic to think we could do it for someone like Weber.

How about signing Bieksa or Wisniewski to shore up Rafalski's hole on D (both right handed shooters and point men on PP) and pursuing Brooks Laich or Andrew Ladd as a much needed addition to the top forward lines. Both Bieksa and Wiz make around 3.5 mil now and would want a raise, Laich and Ladd both make around 2.5 mil and would want a raise as well. All told, I think we could sign one of the defenseman and one forward for around 7 million, which is offset by Rafalski and Modano's contracts coming off the books. The team would look something like this (not married to these line combos but have to make due with what we've got considering the old guys are under contract and nobody is going to trade for Homer or Bertuzzi at this stage of the game). Zetterberg - Datysuk - Homer Ladd/Laich - Filpulla - Franzen Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Cleary Eaves - Helm - Miller/Draper/Mursak Lidstrom - Stuart Kronwall - Wisniewski/Bieksa Kindl - Ericsson