kipwinger

I think there's already a deal in place (for the most part). I think Larkin wants to be paid like a point per game 1C (9+ million), which he looked like all last year until he was injured. I think SY wants to pay him like an almost-point-per-game 1C (8-8.5 million). I think they've agree to play out most of the season to determine whether he's the former or the latter, at which point they sign the deal. I don't think there's any chance he walks.

This entire thread is proposed in bad faith. You absolutely wouldn't do what you're proposing if you were in charge. Also, nobody said the sky would fall if Larkin is traded. You're just bored.

I see a few problems with this. First, gutting your team and trading all of your better players for draft picks absolutely guts your organizational culture. Easiest way to become an Ottawa or Buffalo or Edmonton is to get rid of every guy who would KILL to win a Stanley Cup and replace them with 20 year olds (no matter how highly skilled the new guys are). Second, we don't have anything close to a 1C in our system. We'd have to tank for a few more years (and hope for lottery luck) just to get back to where we currently are. There's almost zero chance the owners are excited about having a losing franchise for even a day longer, let alone a few more years. Look at the crowds at the LCA right now. You think the Ilitch's want to go backward? No chance. Edit: Here's what I'd do to move this team into the next tier. 1. Trade for Chychrun provided it doesn't cost Kasper or Edvinsson (Zadina, Wallinder, 1st probably gets your close). 2. Sign Horvat in the offseason (his favorite team was the Red Wings growing up and he's an Ontario guy). 3. Sign Vrana long term (he's one of the most prolific 5on5 goal scorers in the league). 4. Trade Bertuzzi at the deadline to recoup assets for the Chychrun deal and free up cap for Horvat. That's it. That's how close we are to competing for Stanley Cups next year and beyond.

This is Berggren’s best game so far. He’s going to be sick AF in the very near future.

Which Kane are we talking about here?

Our offense is good enough to beat many teams most nights. And that's without Bert, Vrana, or Raymond playing at the upper end of their ability (or not playing at all). I thought we played Toronto even (or better) the other night, and I thought we generally dominated the play against Vegas last night. But our defense is still pedestrian. Better than the last couple years for sure, but not a defense that's going to shut the door. If you're not going to be a high octane offensive team you'd better have a stout defense. We don't. I realize the asking price makes all the difference in the world here, but I'd be calling on Chychrun right now and taking a REALLY hard look at the guy. Add him on the left size, and Edvinsson soon, and you'd finally have a competitive advantage at some position on the ice. For now put Walman with Seider and Chiarot with Oesterle and play or pairs: Walman-Seider (20 mins) Maatta-Hronek (22) Chiarot-Oesterle (18)

Give him Veleno's linemates and he's got more than 9 points on the season, I promise you that. He's turning into an absolute workhorse. I think he and Bertuzzi are going to look good together tonight.

So pumped about this game. First time all season that Ras hasn't been saddled with one or both of Sudnqvist or Erne. Dude has 9 points on the year and he's buried in the defensive zone for the whole game with those two boat anchors as linemates. Woof.

Says you. My boy Horvat is on his way. I'm pumped. In two years time our center depth will be Larkin-Horvat-Kasper-Ras with Raymond, Vrana, Copp, and Kubalik on the wings in the top six. We're gonna wreck shop old son.

If Michael Rasmussen flourishes in the 2C role it will be the culmination of my time here on LGW.

"Some scouts question his offense but here's 20 clips of him absolutely bullying adult men when he's 18 years old".

Don't look now but with his goal yesterday Marco Kasper has 4 goals and 8 assists through 20 games. He's on pace to best Lucas Raymond and Alexander Holtz' D+1 production (18pts in 34 games and 18 pts in 40 games). Not too bad for the "he doesn't have much offense" guy.

To be totally honest he's a guy I didn't pay a ton of attention to. He underwhelmed in his D+1 and his production last year was middle of the road when you consider it was his D+2. So I kind wrote him off. Subsequently I've read interviews with his coach in Portland that he was "focusing on defense" and his "200ft game" and I thought it was just b.s. But he's a stud, I just totally whiffed on the guy.

I think the Larkin deal gets done. I'm not at all convinced that the reason he isn't signed yet is because of HIM and not SY. He's having the best season of his career. Imagine if he'd signed in the offseason for 8 million (or whatever) when he's likely above 9 million now. Maybe he wants to play most of the season out to increase his value? Bert's trickier. I absolutely love the player but his value is hard to determine. He's been injured most of his career. But when he wasn't he had some really solid seasons. So, is he a 6 million dollar winger or a 7.5 million dollar winger? And how do you know what you're getting going forward when there's no track record. There's not a chance in hell that his agent and SY agree on that value and we're running out of time before the TDL for him to prove to SY which player he is. You might very well be better off trading him, getting the assets, and throw that 6-7 million at a guy like Horvat.

Also, anybody else REALLY excited about this guy?

You're not gonna like this but Bert is as good as gone. In an ideal world he'd re-sign but I don't see it happening. He's gonna want way more than Steve is going to be willing to commit to him by the TDL and SY isn't going to lose him for nothing. Plus, Kubalik's awakening has basically ensured that Bert's loss (offensively) can be mitigated. Plus, if they go out and get Horvat they're essentially getting a similarly productive, gritty, and aged player at a position of need. Regardless, Bert's days with the Wings are numbered.

Andreasson has been really really good. He's got a lot of Berggren qualities to his game (skating, deception, excellent passing) but he's a little grittier than Berggren is as well. I like his game a lot. Cross Hanas has also been really really good in Grand Rapids. Still a little bit of polishing needed in his defensive game, but he's looking like someone who's going to play in the NHL which is a surprise to me because I had basically written him off. Finally, nice to see Chase Pearson back. He's not a game changer or anything, but he should help GR stay competitive and that's good for the prospects overall.

I had to listen to it on the radio while I was driving but it sure seemed like the Wings mostly gave as good as they got. There are definitely a few things that need to get ironed out before this team starts competing with the big boys though. 1. The 1st defensive pair needs to be able to shut the door against good offensive players. Whether that's Seider-Chiarot or Seider and someone else. 2. Copp is not a long term solution at 2C. I'd be going hard after Horvat at the TDL or in the offseason. 3. We need Vrana (or someone like him) badly. Someone who can change the game their his offensive ability. How nice would it have been to have someone last night who could pick corners.

I think I saw recently that Fabbri is practicing with the team and I'm pretty sure Ken or Mick said he was ahead of schedule during one of the broadcasts.

Filip Hronek will probably never not score again. Mark it down.

Generally I'd agree, but the situation is fluid because we're actually a better team this year than anticipated. If teams want to have long term success they need to take advantage of entry level deals and undervalued deals. You lock up Horvat now, while you've got guys like Kubalik, Perron, Vrana, Raymond, Seider, Husso, outperforming their contracts you're in a really good position next year. The alternative is that you wait a year or two and a bunch of those guy are either gone or making so much more that you can't afford that missing piece or two if you need it.

Optimistic how?

I wouldn't say "thin" but I agree that behind centers our biggest need is RHD. Wallinder will be a top 4 dman for a long time. McIsaac, Buium, and Johansson have 3rd pair floors with room to grow into bigger roles. After that it's more of a crap shoot. I'd still consider defense the strongest part of our organizational depth. Essentially we have a top 4, all 25 and under, already in the organization (Seider, Hronek, Edvinsson, Wallinder) with McIsaac, Johansson, Buium able to be in that conversation too. That's not too bad when you consider that between Kronwall and Hronek we really didn't draft and develop a single top 4 defenseman. If I have to pick an organizational weakness it's still at center, though Larkin-Kasper-Ras-Veleno isn't as weak as I once thought our center depth was. Followed by goalie, but again, Husso-Ned-Cossa isn't terrible either. Honestly, at this point I'd be drafting for dynamic skillsets. You've got all your foundational pieces in place. Now start looking for guys who can be game changers at whatever draft position you're sitting in. And for the love of god SY, please sign Bo Horvat in the offseason. Bert-Larkin-Raymond Copp-Horvat-Kubalik Perron-Ras-Vrana Fabbri-Veleno-Berggren Chiarot-Seider Maatta-Hronek Edvinsson-Whoever ^^^^^^^^^^^This is a Cup Contender^^^^^^^^^

From the guys you listed here I'd rank them (in order of "Definite Top 4 Dman" to "Will not play NHL games") Wallinder McIsaac Johansson Buium Sebrango Viro

I wouldn't hate it at the right price. The Caps are on a downward trajectory, maybe he wants to ride some Red Wings coattails. He's pretty much exactly the kind of guy I'm talking about.