krsmith17

This is very difficult for you to grasp isn't it? I still wouldn't do it. Why would you give up assets for two years of a player when we're nowhere close to ready to contend? Faulk will most likely test free agency two years from now. We're not winning anything in those two years. So WHY? Explain what that move accomplishes, aside from making a move just for the sake of making a move...

So we sign Green, then a week later, trade him AND eat half his salary... We also lose one of our top two defense prospects, plus a 1st round pick (and maybe a 2nd round pick) for a player that will likely walk in two years time... F***ing Brilliant! We just lost two key pieces (three if you add the 2nd round pick) that would be part of our rebuild, and have absolutely nothing to show for it... Thanks Bergevelli! I have no issue losing any of the pieces you mentioned, or several others, if the player we're trading for isn't soon to be a UFA, or if we were ready to go on a Cup run. This is not a trade that a rebuilding team should be looking to make. I get it though, you want change for the sake of change, even if it sets the team back long term. That's the way Bergevin and Chiarelli run their team as well, which is why they're the laughing stock of the league...

Yeah... I didn't think you'd get it... You're not smart, and that's ok! I wouldn't give up much for a player I don't have much interest in, and you're somehow surprised by that... You're acting as if I said, "I really think we should go after Justin Faulk!!! He's exactly what this team needs!!! We should offer them Nyquist and a 2nd!!!" When in reality, I don't think we should go after Faulk at all, and I only would if we could get him for dirt cheap, even acknowledging that it wouldn't happen. I don't imagine myself as a GM, let alone a good one. I do know one thing for sure though, if you were a GM, you'd rival Bergevin and Chiarelli for stupidity... Apparently I'm not smart either though for entertaining your bulls***. But whatever, I'm bored and just want to talk hockey, even if it's a mind numbing debate... Just out of curiosity, what would you offer for Faulk? This should be good...

No, that's what I'd give up for Jeff Skinner... You know why? Because he's another player I don't think we should give anything of significance up for. Why the f*** would we give up a big package for a player closing in on free agency, when we're a rebuilding team? The only teams that should be in on Karlsson, Faulk, Skinner, Pacioretty, Duchene, etc. are the teams that feel they are ready to go on a Cup run in the next year (two years in Faulk's case). Do you think Faulk (or any pending UFA) puts us over the top in the next year or two? No? Well why the f*** would you offer up anything other than scraps for any of these players? Nyquist will likely fetch us a 2nd round pick + from a contending team. What do you think a non-playoff team would offer for him, knowing he's not going to help them this year, and they may or may not be able to extend him beyond this year? Jack s***, that's what they'd offer, and rightfully so... I know you probably still won't understand this, but that's on you... Once there's a player (defenseman) on the market that I'd actually want (24 years old or younger, with term remaining), then I'd suggest a reasonable package. Until then, you're right, I'll throw out lowball, s*** offers. Pacioretty? Sadowy, Hicketts and a 6th round pick in 2023... That's because you blindly hate players based on what's being said on social media. I doubt you even watch the games based on your dumba** comments...

I don't particularly want Faulk, given where we're at in our rebuild, his age, and the fact that he's two years away from unrestricted free agency. But yeah, I should want to overpay for him just for the hell of it right? I don't really want the player, but f*** it, offer up Larkin and 2nd anyway, just to shake things up... kickazz and others think you're baiting, but I think you might actually be that dumb...

Source? That is MASSIVE overpayment. No way the Hawks give up that package, and no way the Canes get anything close to that asking price... Nyquist and 2019 2nd round pick (NYI). I doubt that is close either, but I wouldn't give up much more than that.

Right? I can't wait to rid this team of the useless Nyquist - Zetterberg - Franzen - Kronwall - Ericsson, so we can make room for Elfstrom - Holmstrom - Berggren - Malmstrom - Lindstrom...

Yeah, not at all what I was saying. Zetterberg is the last person (player) I'd expect to be spiteful and stiff the team with the recapture penalty just because. I'm sure if he does decide to hang them up, it will be for good reason, and on a mutual understanding. It will also be via LTIR not official retirement until after the contract is up.

Who's saying this? I'm assuming you're referring to some other website or Twitter or something? I haven't seen anyone here say anything close to this...

Yeah, Zetterberg would get paid regardless going on LTIR. I'm just thinking about how much motivation he'd have to come to the rink every day, knowing he's making pennies compared to what he's made throughout his career. He's made over $85M, so I doubt money is much of a factor anyway, but when it gets cut that low, it makes it even less desirable to play out the contract, especially when it was never designed for him to play it out. Add to that, the team isn't likely to win much over the next couple years, it's not like he has another Cup run to think about. He also has a young family that I'm sure he'd like to spend more time with, and maybe even grow. I think Zetterberg plays one last season, and hangs them up toward the end of this season, or after the season.

Okay, I somewhat agree in that sense then. When I hear "more versatile", I think more so positionally; a player that can play center and both wings (which Rasmussen can). But that doesn't really have anything to do with work ethic. When I hear "one dimensional" or "multi-dimensional", I think more of style of play; one dimensional being a player that is pure offense (or defense), and multi-dimensional being a player that plays more of a two-way game (I think Rasmussen would fall more so under the ladder). Being a one-way or two-way player sometimes has to do with work ethic, but not always. Regardless, I agree that Van Riemsdyk is more of a one dimensional winger, and Rasmussen seems like he could be more of a two-way winger (or maybe center). Aside from that, there are a ton of similarities in their style of play in my opinion. If Ras can be what JVR was for the Leafs for the past 6 years, I'd be thrilled. I still say those are pretty lofty expectations though. I'll bet we improve on last year's record of 30-39-13 (73 points). Zadina... with Grand Rapids...

You think 30 goals, 30 assists is Rasmussen's floor? I'd be thrilled with that but I have to disagree. I'd say 20 goals, 20 assists is a more realistic floor (and even that's high for a floor), and 30 goals, 40 assists could be a somewhat realistic ceiling. His work ethic will help him reach that ceiling (hopefully), but I'm not sure what his work ethic has to do with his versatility... He'll likely be a good defensive forward, but I don't expect any Selke nominations or anything.

I'm not concerned at all about him dropping in the draft. It literally happens every single year to at least one player. And like each one of those players that are passed on and end up going much later than projected, he'll make several teams regret passing on him as well. He should have been a top half of the first pick in my opinion, and of the opinion of many draft analysts. We got an absolute steal. I'd even argue Veleno at 30 was a bigger steal than Zadina at 6. Veleno thinks the game at an elite level, which is in my opinion, the most important attribute of a top end center. He also has elite speed and very good stick handling. The only glaring weakness in his game is his shot, and I'm fine with that. The best centers in the league are always better puck distributors than shooters anyway, and Veleno is very good in that area of the game. Put him on a line with a couple wingers that can finish, such as Rasmussen and whoever, and I think he'll look great in the 2C slot behind Larkin. Speaking of Larkin, remember all the naysayers when Larkin was drafted? He was projected to be a good middle six, two-way center, and compared to Helm with a little better finishing ability. Now Veleno is being projected to be a good middle six, two-way center and being compared to Lars Eller. Coincidentally, I've heard the Veleno to Larkin comparison a few times as well, and I see that as a very apt comparison. Even Tyler Wright had this to say about him... "We had him extremely high on our board. We were targeting centers, and while I don't like to make comparisons, he skates like Dylan Larkin and he plays the game like Dylan Larkin." I love this pick, and I truly believe he's going to prove a lot of people wrong and develop into a very good 2C.

Source?

Maybe, but I don't see it. I see Veleno as the more apt comparison to Kadri, at least in style of play. I also see Rasmussen as more of a winger than center. I don't think it's any coincidence that his game finally took off last season when he switched to the wing. I actually see JVR as a great comparison for Ras. Good net front presence, great hands in tight, power-play specialist. I'm not as high on Rasmussen as some (still think he could be a top six guy), and I'm higher on Veleno than most (see him developing into a legit 2C). So there's definitely a bias there, but that's the way I see things shaking out... Mantha - Larkin - Zadina Rasmussen - Veleno - Athanasiou / Bertuzzi / Svechnikov / Berggren

Like I mentioned, he significantly changed his workout routine to accommodate his back issue. I don't see the offseason training to be an issue at all. Also, medical diagnosis or not, playing 4 straight full seasons after surgery, and then saying he can no longer play, coincidentally when his salary is cut in half, after already saying that he (and the team) had no intention of him playing out that contract, will cause issues for sure. It's not even like he took a bad hit that further damaged his back. There's no way he goes on LTIR for the full season (and the rest of his career) without a thorough investigation. I expect he'll play at least half of this season, and maybe miss some games toward the end, with back issues, to cement his case for the following season.

He played all 82 games three years in a row and 78 the year before that. The fact that he "wasn't able to practice" at the end of last season doesn't concern me that much. I'm sure it was precautionary more than anything, and saving the energy for what mattered (games). Although, I'd argue games didn't matter much at the end of last season either... His minutes will and should be decreased at the stage of his career anyway. Larkin and Nielsen are more than capable of picking up the slack. I'm not too worried about Zetterberg "losing a step" when it comes to his skating, because Z has never been a very good skater. He's always relied more on his hockey IQ and positioning. He can still protect the puck as good as anyone in the league, and he'll always have the vision and passing ability. I wouldn't be concerned with any major drop off from last season from Z.

NHL.com just put out an article https://www.nhl.com/news/detroit-red-wings-team-reset-2018-19/c-299484304?tid=281151520 and added their projected lineup to start this season... Tyler Bertuzzi -- Henrik Zetterberg -- Gustav Nyquist Darren Helm -- Dylan Larkin -- Anthony Mantha Andreas Athanasiou -- Frans Nielsen -- Thomas Vanek Michael Rasmussen -- Luke Glendening -- Justin Abdelkader Danny DeKeyser -- Mike Green Jonathan Ericsson -- Trevor Daley Niklas Kronwall -- Nick Jensen Jimmy Howard Jonathan Bernier Barring any injuries, I think this is pretty much what we can expect to see, at least to start the season.

Assuming Zetterberg plays this season, I don't expect a big drop off in production. I still think he's more than capable of putting up around 50 points. As long as they can manage his ice time, I think he'll be fine. He's changed up his workout routine over the past few offseasons too, so I assume he would stick to whatever has been working for him. I just don't see how he can play back-to-back-to-back full seasons, and all of a sudden go on LTIR (once his salary is cut in half) without the league digging deep into it. They may even call bulls***, leaving us in a similar situation as the Hawks with Hossa. I'd be shocked if Zetterberg is placed on LTIR for this full season. I think he still has some gas in the ol' tank.

I think we're around where the Leafs were before they got Matthews. We have some really nice pieces, we just need that elite player to put us back in the conversation. Let's hope Zadina is that player, or maybe whoever we draft next year. Matthews is better than Larkin, and Marner is better than Mantha, but hopefully they can narrow that gap as the team improves over the next few years. Athanasiou is better than Brown. Bertuzzi is better than Hyman. I think Zadina could be better than Nylander. I think Svechnikov could be better than Kapanen. I think Berggren could be better than Johnsson. I think Rasmussen could be better than what they had in Van Riemsdyk (or whoever his replacement is). Maybe Veleno could be as good as Kadri (I have high hopes for Veleno). I think Turgeon will be better than Gauthier. Tavares was a huge add for them, but we have Nielsen ... I think this is pretty accurate. At least that's what I see right now. The problem is, our defense is still a disaster, with no top end players coming any time soon. The Leafs have Rielly and even Gardiner, and we don't have anything close to that. They also have Dermott, Liljegren and Sandin who look like they could be top 4 defensemen some day. We have Hronek, Cholowski and McIsaac that we're counting on to be top 4 defensemen in the future. We need all of our players to develop, and most to hit their ceilings, we need to add another high (top 5) draft pick next year, and we need to add a top end UFA over the next couple years if we want any chance to compete with our division (Tampa, Toronto, Boston, Buffalo) over the next decade or so...

I think everyone should do swimming lessons early in life. I did at a young age, and live in the water all summer, whether it's swimming or water sports. I certainly will have my children in lessons at a very young age. In saying that, you can be the best swimmer in the world and still drown. My grandfather was a great swimmer, but jumped in the water one evening (it'll be 20 years in a couple months), hit his head and drowned. I'm assuming something similar happened to Emery... I think everyone should know how to swim, but more importantly, any time you do go for a swim you should have reliable, able swimmers with you. Unfortunately my pop didn't. It's still unknown whether Ray did or not...

I completely agree that he's extremely competitive, which is why I fully expect him to play this season. I also agree that he's still one of our top players, but when when you're in that much pain to be contemplating retirement, you'd have to think once the team was out of it, they should have probably eased off the heavy usage. That's all I'm saying.

It confuses the s*** out of me why the f*** Zetterberg was still playing upwards of 20 minutes a night, even after we were "mathematically eliminated", if he was in that much pain on a day to day basis, that he couldn't even practice. I still say he will play this season (at least partial), to hopefully hit 1000 points, but it will really piss me off if he's "forced" to retire (LTIR), after seeing him continue to get top minutes the past couple seasons. If he was struggling that much with back pain, his minutes should have been cut big time, and maybe even put on the wing. I just want one more season of Z...