krsmith17

I don't think we'll get him, and I don't think he's a top 4.

Came here to post the same thing. Our future top 4 will be... Cholowski - Hronek Kotkansalo - Saarijarvi Chychrun will never recover from knee surgery and will be a complete bust...

I never seen anything on that. Are you sure you aren't thinking about the scrimmage game we kept him out of in development camp a few weeks ago?

Why? Did he get injured in the game yesterday? Or are you referring to his one injury (fractured wrist) from last season that he is now fully recovered from?

Nill is another example of someone that left the organization to manage another team. Same as with Yzerman, I don't believe he would have shown the same aggressive style if he had taken over for Holland, and Holland stayed within the organization (like he likely would have / will). I think it's a lot easier to take over a team when you've had no previous personal connection with any of the management / players. It's a little more difficult to trade, waive, buyout, players that you've helped draft and develop, and helped your predecessor build. Maybe we would be in a better position right now if Nill had taken over for Holland, but I don't think he would have made as many drastic changes as some would like to believe. As for the bolded. No we don't need to "clean house", and it would never happen. We need a GM that isn't afraid to make trades, and will make the appropriate changes to get this team back on the right path to contention. Make some "difficult decisions", and trade a bad contract, and trade for a top defender. Who's more likely to make those changes (eg trade Ericsson)? Someone that has helped draft / develop, and / or been around on a daily basis, knows his family, etc.? Or someone that has never met the guy, and knows him only as the overpaid, bottom pair defenseman that was drafted last overall 15 years ago?

I'm not saying I think Draper would do things just like Holland, if he were hired by any of the other 30 NHL teams, but I do think he would do things very similarly if he were hired to take over as GM of the Detroit Red Wings. For the same reason, I don't think Yzerman would be the same aggressive GM if he had stayed here in Detroit. If he came back now, after 7 years with the Lightning, I think because he has established himself as a very good general manager, he would be given a bit of a longer leash, and be able to do things a little more his way, rather than the Red Wings way, based on experience alone. Yzerman stepped into a Tampa organization and was given full control, which I don't think he would have gotten here in Detroit. If Draper were hired, he would still run every decision (trade, free agents, drafting, etc.) by Holland, Devellano, and company, which is why I believe we would see much of the same. Of course, if we were to hire someone from the outside, they would also receive input from the guys above, but I believe to a lesser extent, if they have already established themselves as a successful GM. I'm not sure if we "needed" to get rid of Babcock, but I do think the message was starting to get stale, if not already. I believe that coaches and GMs have a shelf life with one organization, and it was time for Babcock to move on, and same goes for Holland now. It wasn't just fans that were saying this either. It was being reported that some players, including Zetterberg, didn't have the best relationship with Babs, and they weren't entirely happy with his coaching style. Maybe Blashill wasn't the best choice as his replacement, but I don't think this team would be much further ahead if Babcock were still here either.

Draper could be a great GM, but I find it hard to believe that either of the assistants would run things much, if at all different than Holland has. I'm sure both Martin and Draper have a voice as assistants right now, and I doubt either are pushing Holland to do anything any different. I don't think Holland is as terrible as some make him out to be, but there seems to be more flaws in his approach in recent years. His reluctance to make any sort of meaningful trade being the biggest for me. I'm just not sure if Draper were to take over, that he'd be so quick to make this his team, by putting his stamp on it and shaking things up. I don't think this team needs a major shakeup either, just a couple key trades to get them back on the right track toward contention. I know Holland isn't capable of this, and I'm not sure if anyone he has been grooming for the past several years would be either. I will say though that one thing that would scare me about going outside the organization for a replacement, would be a major shakeup, fire sale, a completely different team that is no further ahead, or possibly even worse. I do agree with going with the most qualified, but I'd still prefer that to be someone outside the organization.

I think it will be between Martin and Draper when Holland moves up or out. In saying that, I think it would be a poor decision to hire anyone within the organization to become the next GM. This team needs a new look, new approach, and that starts from the top. I think the best thing for this team would be to go outside the organization to find Holland's replacement. Who? I have no idea...

It's going to be funny looking back on this thread (as well as a few other Howard vs Mrazek threads) a few years from now... "Mrazek sucks"... "Trade him for whatever we can get"... 2019-20 - Mrazek wins the Vezina... I know, I know, wishful thinking. I'll admit it is, but not out of the realm of possibility either.

Yes.

I still wish we had taken Vilardi... I really think he will end up being the steal of this draft. If we traded back a couple spots, and taken Rasmussen AND a player like Conor Timmins, I'd be okay with it, but to just take Rasmussen over Vilardi was a huge mistake in my opinion...

Daley.

Opening Night Roster 14 - 40 - 39 21 - 71 - 72 43 - 51 - 42 8 - 15 - 41 83 - 25 65 - 3 61 - 62 35 34

No team ever goes through that drastic of a change in one offseason. I'm okay with Holland finishing off his current contract, and moving on after this season (hopefully). I'm also okay with giving Blashill one more season to see if he can figure things out. If Nelson continues to impress down in Grand Rapids though, I wouldn't mind giving him an opportunity in Detroit next season (I love his aggressive approach to the game). The roster shouldn't be completely revamped in one season, but if we could make two trades, one to offload a bad contract (Ericsson), and one to upgrade the defense, I'd consider it a major success. However, nothing else will happen, aside from placing a player (Kronwall / Ericsson) on LTIR. I think we have been going in a new direction. We've brought up a lot of kids earlier than we've been accustomed to in the past, and I think we will continue to do so in the coming years.

There's actually no difference between the two. There's never been a player Holland has had interest in, that he didn't pursue. He goes hard after every player he has interest in. The only difference is, not every player is going to choose Detroit...

Sproul is likely the 7th / 8th defenseman in Detroit and Saarijarvi is likely the 7th / 8th defenseman in Grand Rapids (likely starting in Toledo) at least to start the season. I'd much rather both of those guys getting the ice time than Butcher. This team has a ton of depth on defense, we need to add top pairing quality defensemen, not more bottom 4 quality defensemen. Quality over quantity...

This is my favorite...

Am I missing something? There's nothing about this guy that tells me he will ever be a quality NHL defenseman, let alone a "top defender"... Undersized 22 year old, drafted in the 5th round 4 years ago, put up decent, not spectacular numbers in college... Maybe he'll be as good as DeKeyser some day if he's lucky. I'm not saying I'd be upset if we signed him, there's always room for added depth, but I'd personally rather give Russo or Hicketts a shot before this guy. I agree that Chicago is a likely destination. Witkowski will likely be our 12th/13th forward, so 8 defensemen and 12 forwards as it sits right now. But yeah, something has to give. We'll have a little over 900K (once Franzen is placed on LTIR) before Athanasiou is signed.

Rasmussen is definitely possibly going to be a top line center...

I think you could add Kasper Kotkansalo as well, since we wouldn't have had him without the Vanek trade, and we wouldn't have had Vanek without the Datsyuk trade. I'd still rather Chychrun right now, because I'm not confident any of Cholowski, Hronek or Kotkansalo will ever be better, but if even one of those three develop into anything close to Chychrun, it's a win for us. So yeah, my vote goes to Chychrun right now, but I could easily see it changing in the next couple years.

I've heard a few good things about Zablocki, although I think he may be another Nastasiuk type player. Ceiling is likely no more than a decent bottom 6 grinding winger. I've also heard a lot of good things on both Lindstrom and Kotkansalo. Nothing on Elfstrom. And I don't think Holmstrom was at development camp this year. Apparently Cholowski put on mad weight this past season / this summer. I think it was something crazy like 26lbs. Not bad for 10 months...

Who has argued that we should keep all of our players and not shed cap? I'm pretty sure every single Red Wings fan can name at least one player on this roster that they would love to ship out to free up cap space. I'd be happy with just moving Ericsson, although in a perfect world, I'd move 3-4 players. The problem isn't the players or the contracts they are signed to (although it doesn't help), the problem is the GM that still believes these are good players signed to fair contracts. Each and every player on the roster could be traded, but we all know they won't be while Holland is still in charge... I'd be surprised if Coreau were claimed. I think IF we were to trade Nyquist / Tatar or Howard / Mrazek, it should be a "hockey trade" to upgrade our defense, not for picks at the deadline. But yeah, Green should be shopped at the deadline, and as long as he stays healthy and produces the way he's capable of, he should net us a late 1st minimum.

Agreed. But at the same time, not even Larkin, Mantha or Athanasiou would get any defenseman of that caliber. We need to be looking at potential elite, not established elite. I still wish we went balls to the wall after Trouba last offseason...

Kronwall and Franzen going on LTIR would leave us with over $4M. Athanasiou shouldn't cost any more than $2.5 (and I think that's being a little generous). That leaves us with nearly $2M in wiggle room to call up another forward. I agree that relying on LTIR isn't the best way to do business, but if he was aware of the situation a month ago, before free agency, being in this situation is a little more understandable I guess...

Thanks. I wasn't aware of that. That's a good thing though in my opinion. As I said, I can see Saarijarvi starting in Toledo, so that's one less body he would have to jump on the depth chart.