krsmith17

Why do you hate Pavelski sooooo much? He's a player I would love to have in our top 6...

Ekmanc, you're Swedish aren't you? Do you ever catch any of Janmark or Holmstrom's games? From their stats, highlights and the scattered article I read, I think both are going to be great players, and Holmstrom looks to be yet another late round gem. Any insight on either of them?

Looks like the surgery will wait. Quincey given green light to start practicing and return to lineup when Wings feel he's ready, per Ken Holland.

It would make the passes less consistent and slightly harder to read, which is what you want in a practice drill.

I like the way you think amato. We win the division and Florida squeezes into the Wild Card spot past Boston. We play Florida in the first round, then Tampa in the second, Islanders in the Conference Final and Chicago in the Cup Final... Mark it down!

And here I actually believed you when you said you didn't read my last post... Come on Kip, you NEVER back down from an argument, unless of course, you have come to realize that you were wrong... and completely overanalyzed my original statement... Noooo Anyway, enough of that ridiculous argument, let's move on from this and save our energy for our inevitable upcoming debate...

Great response Kip. I wouldn't have expected anything more.

Kip, it's easy enough to admit you're wrong when the facts are out. You admitted thinking that Jurco would be ready when it's clear now that he probably wasn't, with him now struggling and being demoted to the 4th line. You admitted being wrong about Helm and Abdelkader because it has become evidently clear that both are having great seasons, and providing a spark in their respective roles. But in both situations I'm willing to bet you were adamant about your opinion, and there was no changing your mind until you were eventually proven wrong. I specifically remember another argument that you and I had at the beginning of the season, where I was saying that Helm would look great on the wing, and you were firm on the fact that Helm is a center, so he shouldn't be playing wing. Babcock said he is the best third line center in hockey, so there's no way he should play on the wing... He has proven that he is just as good on the wing if not better than he was at center. If Smith doesn't mature into a reliable top 4 defenseman in the next few seasons, I would without question, admit that I was wrong. Just like if he does, I would expect that you would as well. If Andersson remains with the organization and becomes an Abdelkader type player I would gladly admit I was wrong. I admit that I was wrong in thinking that Franzen was going to finally put his injury woes behind him and have a career year this season. I have absolutely no problem admitting when I'm wrong, but in this instance I am not. There is absolutely nothing wrong with me saying that Pulkkinen is the right handed sniper "we've" been longing for. If you think there aren't a ton of Red Wings fans that would love to have a right-handed sniper in our line-up or that Holland and Babcock don't get a chub thinking about having a right handed sniper in their top six, you're delusional. If we did a poll thread and asked fans if they think we need a right handed sniper on our team and the consensus was "no", or if Holland and Babcock were interviewed and asked if they would like to have a right handed sniper in their lineup, and they responded with "no", then I would gladly admit that you were right, and I am wrong, I had completely misspoken... But we both know that there's no way that would happen, you're just way too damn stubborn to admit it... Me guaranteeing that fans and management would love to have a right-handed sniper but not being able to back it up with a quote, is like me guaranteeing that we (fans, Holland and Babcock) would love to win every single game for the rest of the season, and go 16-0 in the playoffs on our way to our 12th Stanley Cup... Well nobody has come out and said it, so it can't be true... Give me a break man... Every management team in the league would love to have a balance of right and left handed shots throughout their lineup. It's no secret that their is better flow, and easier to set up plays with righties and lefties up front and on the back end. It's also no secret that we sorely lack right handed shots throughout our lineup. A huge thing when we signed guys like Alfredsson and Samuelsson was, they can really help out our team's scoring with their heavy right handed shots... But you're absolutely right, fans and management are not at all excited about this young Finnish sniper that is currently ripping up the American League with his booming right handed shot... Anyway, I'm done talking about this. I expected a bit of a confrontation about the idea of trading a proven NHL player like Nyquist or Tatar over a somewhat unknown prospect like Pulkkinen, but I never expected an argument about whether or not we need a right handed sniper in our lineup... Crazy...

You're absolutely right Kip, I'm not sure why I'm surprised though, you always are... I am the single Red Wings fan that would love to have a right handed sniper. There is no other Red Wings fans that would love to have a right handed sniper, nor would Red Wings management, or the coaching staff. All left handed shots throughout the lineup is clearly the way to go. I apologize for my ignorance...

No Kip, my original statement that you took completely out of context was what I was referring to as my opinion. But yes, I do guarantee that a LOT of Red Wings fans as well as management and the coaches would love to have a few more right handed shots in our lineup, both at forward and defense. You get why I would want a right handed sniper in our lineup but you cannot understand why the Red Wings as a team would want that same luxury. Great logic there Kip...

jimmy, I started out being "argumentative", because kip, like he often does, put words in my mouth. I never said anything about the organization originally but he made it seem like I did. Also, he did say no one agrees with me... Kipwinger - "it shouldn't come as a surprise when nobody agrees with you on a "team need" that you AND ONLY YOU, have articulated"...

LOL I'm being argumentative? You're the most argumentative person on this site by a long shot. It's quite humorous actually... How about we start a new poll thread asking the fans (LGWers) "Should we be looking to add some more right-handed shooters (snipers) to our lineup?" You actually think most people would click "No"... F***ing hilarious... And I could care less if management have ever come out and said anything about having a right-handed winger in their line-up, I do guarantee they would love to have one... You assuming they wouldn't is ridiculous... But yeah, nobody would agree with me that we need a right-handed sniper... No one at all... Get over yourself Kip...

Why are you so concentrated on the organization? I don't get it... I never said anything about the organization... My original statement was "although "I" don't want to trade either Nyquist or Tatar, "I'd" almost prefer that than trade Pulkkinen at this point"... If you haven't noticed, that was "my" personal preference based on what "I" believe our need is, and who would garner the most interest from other teams in a trade... How is that so difficult to understand? If you think for a second that Babcock wouldn't love to have a right-handed "sniper", in his line-up, you're being very naïve. Another thing, you're taking the term "sniper" way too literally. I'm more or less talking about a right-handed shooter that can score goals, I'm not talking about the top 3 right handed shots in the entire league... I think there are a number of right-wingers in the league that Kenny and Babs would be very interested in based solely on the way they shoot the puck. I don't think they believe we need an Ovechkin or Stamkos to be successful, but Pulkkinen is a huge weapon because of the way he shoots the puck... I really didn't think there would be controversy over that statement at all... I get that people think it's a bit crazy to suggest trading Nyquist or Tatar before Pulkkinen, but to be that taken away that we need more right handed shots on defense as well as forwards is crazy to me...

Umm Kip, re-read what I said... Never did I say anything about the organization, I said "we" as in Red Wings fans. YOU may not care about that right handed sniper, but I guarantee most Red Wings fans would agree that we DO in fact need a right handed sniper... And just because Holland or Babcock haven't necessarily come out and publicly said, "we need a right handed sniper, that we could use on our power-play", doesn't mean they don't. I guarantee that is up there on their priority list, and for that reason, I don't think Pulkkinen is going anywhere... I don't get why us needing some right handed shooters that can score is such an outlandish thing to say...

Both Nyquist and Tatar hold much more value in a trade right now, Pulkkinen is out-producing both of them in their respective minor league careers, and Pulkkinen is that coveted right handed sniper we've been longing for...

zombo, although I don't want to trade either Nyquist or Tatar, I'd almost prefer that then trading Pulkkinen at this point...

Which is why I believe he should be in Grand Rapids. A player of his talent should not be playing on a checking line, he should be playing on a scoring line, whether that be in the NHL or AHL...

I agree Kip, I just really wish he spent more time in the minors. I do believe he would have been better off down in the AHL for another season... Oh well, he's not going down at this point...

Jesusberg, I'm not sure why you directed all that at me. It's like you're trying to convince me that Jurco should be down in Grand Rapids, when you know just as well as anyone here that I was one of the few advocating that Jurco spend another half to full season down in Grand Rapids. There's not a question in my mind that his game would have benefited, and he would be further along in his development with more time in the AHL, and I'm starting to wonder if him being rushed into the NHL hasn't stunted his development a little. Like I've said before, I kind of feel that this has been a rare case of mismanagement of a very promising prospect by the Red Wings... He should have absolutely been down with the Griffs on a line with Pulkkinen all season, and if he were, they would have definitely been 1 / 2 in scoring, ripping up the American League. I also agree that Callahan would have been the better option to have up here, but that's more in place of Andersson, not Jurco. As for Babcock pushing players like Tatar. I'm well aware of that, and that's what I feel he is doing with Jurco as well. Like I said, maybe there is a method to his madness, but sometimes it is very hard to see as a fan, when you watch a player struggle in a role that he shouldn't have been put in in the first place. Maybe Jurco does benefit from Babcock's "tough love" and it makes him stronger mentally and helps round out his game... who knows... I also said he should be with scoring players, and that includes playing on a third line with Sheahan and Weiss or whoever. I just don't believe he should be on the 4th line in a grinding role with the likes of Glendening, Miller and Andersson.

... and that's where he got the majority of his points. Bottom line is, Jurco is NOT a checking forward, he is a skilled forward. He is not going to produce much with the likes of Glendening, Miller and Andersson. Hell, even Datsyuk would struggle putting up points with those guys... I don't get why Babs always has to make it difficult on his players... Maybe there is some sort of method to his madness, but it's often times very difficult to understand. Jurco is a skilled forward, put him with skilled players, Weiss is a skilled forward, put him with skilled players, Glendening is a great checking forward, put him on a checking line, Andersson is a borderline NHL player, put him on the bench, put these players in a position where they can succeed for f***s sake... Anyway, back on topic... I'm happy to see Pulkkinen is being put on a line with some skilled players, (although I'd prefer to see him on Datsyuk's wing) let's just see how long that lasts...

Definitely not a showcase.

e_prime, nope. I said I wanted Helm to take Andersson's spot, not Jurco's. Either way, can't wait to see Pulkkinen light the lamp again.

Yup, for a couple games. Abdelkader had a scoring role for about two seasons before he started to score... and he's not again now... So what? I'm one of the few on here that said that Jurco should have spent another season down in Grand Rapids and I still think he should have / should be. Jurco is a skilled forward, and he should not be playing in a checking role. I'm afraid that the Wings rare mismanagement of a prospect could be stunting the growth of a very special player in this situation...

No way Smite, Jurco doesn't belong on that 4th line. Exactly what I said e_prime...

Thanks, I love Cleary, but that has nothing to do with my bias in this situation. This isn't even about Cleary. I know he's done all he can do in this league, and he will in all likelihood hang them up after this season. This is about Nestrasil and how he is not in any way, shape or form a great hockey player. The right decision was made when he was waived...