krsmith17

Franzen is NOT getting bought out. Get over it! And besides if we did buy him out, we wouldn't be eligible to resign him to this "short term prove it contract"... Prove what anyway? That despite how streaky he is, and despite him not having his whole heart, body and soul into every single game, he is still capable of taking over games, he is still capable of putting up 0.75 points per game...

Agreed. That's why he is paid nearly double.

I agree with that. I don't believe ANY player is untradeable. I think Pittsburgh would trade Crosby with the right return but of course it would have to be massive over payment. And everyone knows Gretzky was traded, not once but twice... But I stand by my statement. I believe that if Smith was traded, it would be a huge mistake and people would be calling for Holland's head a few years down the road...

Mantha was labled inconsistent two years ago when he was just a teenager. He has been working on that area of his game and it has shown. He only went a handful of games this past season without a point and was putting up on average, over two points per game. If that isn't consistent, I'm not sure what is. Also he was an alternate captain for the Foreurs this past season, so does show leadership qualities as well...

That both Vanek and Franzen are very talented players and are over scrutenized by fans league wide.

You can say what you like about corsi stats, love em or hate em, they are somewhat accurate and are becoming more and more commonly used. I don't care too much for them, but then again I don't care too much for any stats really. Yes stats are important but I'd much prefer to just watch the game and base my opinion on players and teams based on the trusty ol eye ball test. And anyone that has watched Smith over the latter half of last season and has come to the conclussion that he is "useless" or "tradeable" or whatever, obviously haven't been watching the same Brendan Smith as me and the entire Red Wings brass. Everyone in the Red Wings organization are very high on Smith, and like myself, believe that he has the tools to be a top pairing guy in this league.

I'm not a baseball guy so I can't comment on the first guy, however I never had huge expectations of any of the other guys. I was one of the few here that always thought Ericsson would grow into a top 4 shutdown guy, but I never had the expectations of him becoming anything like a Chris Pronger. I never had huge expectations of either Brunnstrom or Brunner when they came here. I always seen them as 3rd line support guys. Same goes for Leino. I still remember his first NHL goal and everyone was salivating, saying that he is the next big thing. I never seen it. Also, all three of these guys were undrafted players signed as free agents and Ericsson was the last pick in his draft year. How often do those type players turn into all-stars? Not very often... The guys that I am saying will have great careers as top line guys were all drafted in the first two rounds. Mantha (20th), Smith (27th) and Sproul (55th). All of whom, have dominated leagues prior to playing in the NHL. There is a much better chance they become all-star caliber players then anyone you mentioned.

Lol speaking of which raise your hand if you're currently or ever or ALWAYS at work on the computer or phone reading LGW when you're supposed to be working?...

Jamie Benn is my favorite non Red Wing in the entire league, I absolutely love the guy, but I would still shut down that trade in a heart beat. Mantha is the most highly touted prospect we've had in a looong long time, he has the "potential" to be a Jamie Benn is just a few years. I like Jordie Benn as well but I think both Smith and Sproul will be much, much better in a few years, and I'd bet a decent amount of money that at least one of them will be a better player then Jordie. Unlike many others here, I believe that Smith and Sproul will be our number one pair in the mold of Keith and Seabrook in 5-7 years. Then you add in Pulkkinen, the much needed right handed sniper we've been lacking since Hull, and then a first as well... HUGE over payment in my opinion...

I think Holland will make at least one decent UFA acquisition this offseason, maybe two, and I'm ok with that. I can also see him trading back in the first round to get the second rounder back that he lost in the Legwand trade. I would love to see Callahan win a spot on the forth line but I just don't see it happening, we have too many bottom 6 players as it is. I agree that the players that are waiver exempt will be sent down and I'm also quite ok with that. I don't think it will hurt Jurco, Pulkkinen, Ouellet, Sproul, Mrazek to get another full year in Grand Rapids, with a few injury call ups of course. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Kindl start the season on our roster. I don't think he has any place here anymore, but I will be pissed if Andersson is still on the roster this season. He needs to be traded before the draft for a later round pick.

I would be more willing to move promising prospect Xavier Ouellet then Smith. I know that Smith would be more enticing to other teams but I would dangle Ouellet and Tatar plus picks for a decent trade. Players / Prospects that I would be offering in potential trades. Tatar, Andersson, Kindl, Ouellet, and of course the fillers with little to no value right now, Ferraro, Almquist, plus picks Defensemen that I would be targeting as UFA signings in order. Matt Niskanen, Tom Gilbert, Dan Boyle, Anton Stralman, Derek Morris.

Well, let's agree to disagree on this one, I just don't like the trade. But I'm sure Kip and a few other would agree with you I would just be really reluctant to give up Smith and Tatar, plus other assets, when I believe Smith will be much better than Ehrhoff and on par with Yandle in just a few years. I would prefer to sign a decent UFA this season, and wait for Smith and DeKeyser to reach their potential and then add in Sproul and maybe one other of Ouellet, Backman, Marchenko and Jensen.

That would be an absolute STEAL... for Phoenix or Buffalo... Neither Yandle or Ehrhoff are worth that package. I wouldn't involve Smith in any package deal unless it is for an elite right handed defenseman and I wouldn't consider either Yandle or Ehrhoff elite and they're also left handed shots. To add in Tatar plus other picks and prospects is huge over payment for either of those guys in my opinion.

I don't disagree that the chances of any of our young players or prospects becoming as good or better than Zetterberg and Datsyuk are slim, however I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility either. It is possible that a couple could become somewhat close. I can definitely see Nyquist becoming a Zetterberg-lite and Jurco becoming a Datsyuk-lite. It's hard to imagine either of these young guys becoming elite / all-stars / future hall of famers but it is feasible. If they both continue to work on their two-way game, and they can become legitimate threats in all three zones, I think the potential is there, what they do with that, time will tell. Nyquist shows the same will and determination that Hank has. Despite being a smaller player, he can already protect the puck quite well with his lower body strength. If he adds another 10-15 lbs. of muscle, I think he will be unstoppable. Jurco has the hands, maybe not "Datsyuk-hands" but great hands nonetheless. He's already much bigger than Pav, and has already shown he is willing to give or take a check to make a play, as well as go to the dirty areas. I think both of these players have the potential to put up anywhere between 65-85 points per year while playing sound defensive hockey for the next 10+ years. Add to that, some of our other promising prospects and I believe the future is bright. I'm not necessarily saying I want to stand pat and have Hank and Pav retire, without making a real push for another Stanley Cup. But trading off a boat load of promising prospects could be dangerous. I know, no player or prospect should be untouchable and I do agree but there are definitely a few that I would need an extremely significant return, to give up. These include Nyquist, Jurco, Pulkkinen, Mantha, Sproul and Mrazek.

It may be the offseason but the negativity on here is sickening. I will bet any amount of money that that will not be the opening day roster. Say what you will about Mr. Holland but I would take him over just about any GM in the league and so would the rest of the league. I guarantee he makes a few key changes this offseason. 100%

Hey luvmnger, I wish I could "like" that post multiple times. Well said. I don't necessarily agree with every single little detail but definitely agree with the overall idea there.

Were you trying to prove my points or did you do that accidently?... Yes, he improves our team, he improves our puck movement from the back end, and no prospect can provide everything that he can immediately. Every one of our prospects (no matter how highly we, or scouts view them) are at the very least, two years away from being impact players. How are our young players not allowed to play/develop? That is exactly what the American Hockey League is for, to develop talent. Do you think Nyquist or Tatar could have stepped in and made such an impact if they weren't "over ripe"? Definitely not. I personally like the way the Wings management team do things and I think most of our prospects (including Sproul, Marchenko, Backman, Jurco and Pulkkinen) would benefit from another year in Grand Rapids. We don't draft high, so we rarely get a talent that is rushed into the NHL right away, and I think Mantha should spend a year down in GR as well. Anyway, back on Boyle, no he wouldn't be my first choice but he is an upgrade to our current defensive unit, so I would definitely welcome him... As for Carlson, I would absolutely love to have this guy in a Red Wings jersey but that just isn't going to happen. What would you give up to get him because a package of Tatar, Ferraro, Almquist and a first definitely isn't going to get it done. It will be more like, Nyquist, Mantha, Sproul, a first and probably another draft pick or prospect as well. I think that is over payment and I would rather keep Nyquist, develop Mantha and Sproul into the players I think they can be, and get another couple decent prospects with those picks. That is just my opinion though...

I accidently "liked" your post when I definitely disagree lol... I love Smith. He is one of my favorite players and I think he is a future top pairing defenseman. I also think Kronwall and Smith were a good top pair to end the season, but I don't think it is our best option when everyone is healthy. I don't think Babcock will break up the Kronwall - Ericsson pairing that has been great for us. I also don't understand why you would want two of your most offensive minded defensemen on one pairing and your two best shut down defensemen on the second pairing... I would much rather mix and match offensive minded and defensive minded. That is why I would stick with Kronwall - Ericsson and DeKeyser - Smith, I think they could be a great top 4. Also, I think a Ouellet - Marchenko third pairing would be a nightmare and everyone on here would be screaming to trade both for a bag of pucks if that happened...

I don't really want Quincey back either, and I'm sure no one really thinks we should "definitely" bring him back. But I'm in the same boat as a few others, Quincey back would definitely not be the worst thing that we could do. Could we do better? Probably, but to say that "Q at ANY price is a bad deal" is ridiculous. My question to you is Have YOU watched him play? Actually better again Do YOU even watch the "Detroit Red Wings" on a regular basis or do you just catch highlights and check stats? Because some (most) of your posts on here make me believe (and I'm sure I'm not alone on this) that you don't "watch" many games... Quincey was one of our most consistent defensemen in the second half of the season. He was steady and reliable and bailed us out on a few occasions. There was a point where there wasn't a defender on our team that I would rather defend a two on one then Quincey. But in saying all that he was horrendous in the first half and his huge turnaround could very well have been due to it being a contract year. I would probably pass on Quincey, because I believe we will have better options and I also believe Quincey will have better options as well. If he was a righty I think I would probably be more inclined in keeping him around but he is not, so I think a player like Tom Gilbert would be a better option.

I never understood that sentiment, to me it makes zero sense. "Is player X going to win us a Stanley Cup? No, so you don't add him"... No single player can win a Stanley Cup, that is why you need to add "pieces". A better question would be, can player X help us win games? Will he make us a better team? Yes, so you add him. I think Boyle does make us a better team, but would he be my number one choice? No. Do we need to add other pieces besides a Boyle to help us win the Stanley Cup? Absolutely. With Boyle we could have something like... Kronwall - Ericsson DeKeyser - Smith Ouellet - Boyle Lashoff OR With Niskanen we could have something like... Kronwall - Ericsson DeKeyser - Niskanen Ouellet - Smith Lashoff Which one looks better? I like option two better but option one wouldn't be the worst thing, and is certainly an upgrade over last year, in my opinion...

Really Kip? Bringing up trading Smith again? I can't believe it... You should probably lay off on Mr. Smith a little though because love him or hate him, he isn't going anywhere, and I am thankful for that. I agree on everything else though...

Lol let's agree to disagree on this one, and like you said, I don't think either of us completely disagree with the other, just on some particular points. I've been reading here for a long time, pretty much whenever this site was first up and running, although I just signed up a few years ago and I very rarely comment but I do generally agree with most of your posts. Anyway, to comment on Almquist, I agree with both sides of the argument here. I think he definitely deserves a shot through training camp and preseason, but I think in the end he will be cut and for good reason. He will only receive a contract from the Wings if he is the 6th/7th best defenseman available or is willing to play in Grand Rapids again (which he clearly isn't). I think he will end up back in Sweden.

He's an offensive defenseman that doesn't score much because he hasn't really been utilized properly in my opinion. Sure he started getting top pair minutes toward the end of the season, but why he hasn't gotten any PP time is beyond me. He is a great puck moving defenseman and he will learn to protect his end of the ice more efficiently as he matures as a player. I wouldn't necessarily consider him a tough guy. He may have been earlier in his career but so are a lot of players until they reach the NHL and realize they can't intimidate and throw their weight around like they did in college / junior / AHL. I'm in no way saying that I know all about the sport or that I have an exceptional eye for talent and I should be an NHL scout or anything of the sort, but I will say that I loved Ericsson right from the beginning and never gave up on him. I knew he was going to be a top 4 defenseman in the league, even when everyone else was constantly bitching about his play. I think Smith has even more potential then I seen in E at the time and I believe he will be a top end talent in the near future.

kipwinger, I would by no means say that you are clueless, you definitely seem to be very knowledgeable, however you're hatred for Smith is laughable. I understand that he has made his fair share of defensive blunders, some even cost us games. But name a defenseman that hasn't done the same in his first year or two in the league? It happens to every young player and Smith is no exception. The fact that you refuse to see his improvements is quite humorous. He has steadily improved over the past two years, and I strongly believe he will be a top pairing defenseman in the near future. Only time will tell...

Why bother number9? It's a lost cause... The people that actually watch hockey and have an inkling of knowledge of the game, know that Franzen is a much better hockey player than he gets credit for. He absolutely is a top 6 forward in the NHL. People hate on him so much because people have hated on him so much... if that makes any sense... Basically it's the thing to do. Why bother actually watching the game, because I swear most of you don't, "Franzen sucks", "no heart", "lazy", "mental health issues", "can't play a lick of defense", "doesn't know how to set up a play", "the only thing he can do moderately well is score and he only does that when he feels like it", blah, blah, blah, blah, blaaah... I guarantee if you did a poll of the 30 GMs, 30 coaches, 300+ players, the TSN analysts, etc, etc, and asked the question, "Is Johan Franzen a top 6 forward in the NHL?" the majority (I would bet 90+%) would say "Yes". But because Richdg, DeGraa55, GoWings1905, Z Winged Dangler, and co think otherwise, he must really suck... I need to rethink this whole thing now... Maybe he really does suck...