Richdg

Let's not put Trouba in the HOF just yet. Yes he is a talented young player and I would love to have him. But to date he is not a great player. In fact he is a second pair guy that could become more. There are others that may also be available: Fowler was rumored to be on the block before the trade deadline, Shattenkirk is a UFA next summer and the Blues might not be able to resign him, the Yotes and Canes are in full blown rebuild mode maybe we can steal-and that is what it would be, a OEL or Faulk? I am a little more worried about signing a Yandle do to his age/term/cap. Same is true for Weber BTW. he has 10 years left on his deal.... Yikes..... BTW moving Howard. Yes it sounds good, but I doubt it happens. Mrazek needs more time to develop. Moving Howard is hard to do with a big cap number and over 30. If we have to retain 50% to do so we will not gain anything. Might be 1 million ahead on the cap hit after signing a vet backup. In that case keep him.

All of the reasons you mention for coming here TOR also has and in some cases more. MLG is less than an hour from his house, TOR has more SC's than we do. The only area we might have an advantage is more young up and coming talent at F. That is a maybe that can be debated. Now this has changed a bit over the last 20 years or so but every english speaking kid in Canada has always dreamed of being a Leaf and every French speaker grows up dream of being a Hab. Just the way it is. As for the top pair Dman, we all want that. But will Holland act? We also want more talent/depth at F. Our O has sucked this year overall and it was largely the same group of guys. Same is true for the defense.

No I understand your point very well. Yes if we add "insert the name of your favorite superstar here" we would be a better team. That is true. Better players make a better team. That is part of why I haven't bagged on Babcock when he was here the past few years or on Blashill this year. They can only play the hand they have been given. The players still make or break a team. yes having a Weber makes us better on both ends of the ice. But he isn't coming. So we need to find 2 guys that can help for the same type of money-1 at F to help the O and 1 on the BL to help the D. Stamkos IMHO is 99.99% going to stay in TB or sign with Tor. It has nothing to do with what we offer. Why would he come here? he can stay with a Cup contending team in a nice city with great weather OR he can go home and help his fav team as a child rebuild. Tor has bottomed out. We haven't yet. There is 0 reason for him to come to detroit. Yes I would love to see it happen. But I would rather be surprised that he comes than to hope he does and doesn't.

True, but so would Gretzky. Neither are here nor are they coming. Same with Stamkos. So we need to look in other directions. I fear that the only way we will be looking is Grand Rapids.

Trueth is we need both. With Green, Kronwall, and Ericsson all on the wrong side of 30 and not performing this year, the only Dman we have that is top 4 worthy is Dekeyser. The rest are not worthy or gone soon. Now again I will bring up Marchenko. he has been playing on the second pair with Kronwall. can he handle that job full time? if the answer is yes, that gives us 2 guys for the top 4. BTW who caught Holland's comments on the radio today? he was on the Huge Show as they were starting to role out Eric Zane's new show. EZ for those that don't know is the PA guy for the Griffins. Eric asked Holland: "Is there any one area of the team that you are disappointed with this season?". Long answer cut short was: yes, the offense and the PP. Spent a lot of time talking about how we were 1 or 2 on the PP last year and nearly last this year, and how the O went from 9th overall to 20ish this year. He didn't mention the defense at all.

BTW.... http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1765908-ranking-the-top-25-defensive-players-in-the-nhl/page/2 How many of our Dmen have ever been considered top 25 by anyone defensively? Now granted that is one writers opinion, others disagree. But Schenn is a good Dman that has been playing on bad teams. He is also younger than Kronwall, Ericsson, Green, KFQ and Smith. 2 years ago we all had this debate about Stafford. He was available from the Sabres. But because his numbers were down, many thought he was done. Now playing with a much better group of talent with the Jets he is scoring 20+ again.

Didn't spin anything. I have mentioned that Tatar and Nyquist can be moved in the right deal and others quickly say no we can't do that it would hurt our O to much. To get you have to give.

Got tired of copying... So right now we are not a good offensive or defensive club. We don't have the assets to make major improvements in both areas. But we can do so in one area. There is a reason why people say "defense wins championships", mainly because it is true. If the options are good defense with a poor offense OR a good offense with a poor defense, give me the former every time. I am far less worried about how many points we get from our D than I am about how many goals our D gives up. From a economical standpoint defensive Dmen are cheaper than offensive Dmen. If a team has 2 good offensive Dmen that is more than enough. Now we have made deep runs each way. The 95, 08, and 09 teams had D's that averaged about 2.6 points per game. The 97, 98, and 02 teams averaged about 1.9 points per game from the D. That is a big difference. But that goes back to question I asked a few pages back, is our D not scoring enough because of the D or because of the F's? Cases can be made for both sides. But when we come to the limited scoring side, that is far more on the D. If we had a top 10 D now we would be a good 10 points ahead in the standings. We also would be a team better built for the playoffs.

Some on here love circular firing squads. Our team needs to improve, yet at the same time we can't live without any of our players...... But hey the early tee times are coming. Now some of you young fellas a big into the new age statistics. if you use those Scheen would be our second best offensive Dman tied with Smith. It terms of points per 60 mins. The arguement isn't if Scheen is a top 50 Dman in the league-he isn't. The question is is he better than what we have? he would be our 3rd best Dman. You can balk all you want at 5 mil per year, but that is what the market bares. IE Ericsson at 4.75 mil and KFQ at 4.25 million. Both of which are older more mistake prone, and they are far less physical. Schenn has like 220 hits this season. We don't have anyone over 100 IIRC. That is a big and needed change. Now from managements stand point I can see them deciding that Marchenko is our 4th Dman. He is already playing on the second pair with Kronwall right now. He is younger and cheaper than Schenn. But is he better? Good question. For the record, I am not some huge Schenn advocate. he is merely an option that would make our defense better. Nothing more. He is also well under 30 which helps his cause. if he is signed to a 5 or 6 year deal, it expires in his early 30's, not late 30's like so many of our broken down vets have going on.

Lombardi and Sutter beg to differ. Since they have won 2 SC's in the past few years and could be ready to win their third I will respect their opinion. Not a fans or a sports writer of some blog. Scheen was on some really bad ML teams and then some below average Philly teams. Mantha and someone like Backes would more than make up for what we lose by trading Tatar and Nyquist. Cheaper as well. Then add in what we would gain by picking up another true top pair Dman and the team would be much better overall, which is the goal after all.

To get you have to give. Both can be moved without hurting us at F. Together plus Smith now you have a package that can get you a true top pair Dman. Then you add a couple of F's one high priced scoring guy and one glue guy. Think Backes and Martin as an example. Now you have the following: Z-Larkin-Abby Mantha-Datsyuk-Backes AA-Sheahan-Jurco Martin-Glendening-pick a young guy Miller Dekeyser-trade Kronwall-Schenn Ericsson-Green Oullett-Marchenko Mrazek vet backup That leaves Scvechnikov in GR, and our 1st round pick-Gauthier in junior.

now you are just assuming things. I have not at any point said that in any way shape or form. I have been very clear about making trades and signing UFA's and that this team needs at least 2 F 's and 3 Dmen between now and the start of the 17/18 season. That is on top of what we already have.

do the math. Z 6.1, larkin >1, Abby 4.25, mantha >1, datsyuk 7.5, AA >1, Sheahan 2, Jurco >1, Glendening >1, DD 6, Kronwall 4.75, Ericsson 4.25, Oullett>1, Green 6, Marchenko >1, Mrazek 3. That is about 50 million. We have another 1.1 on Weiss's buyout. cap will be around 75 million. That leaves us with about 24 million to spend. 7 open roster spots.

That is one writers opinion, which is fine. But I disagree. Schenn is 4 years younger, the cost would be similiar KFQ is a UFA this off season and made 4.25 per year on his last contract, Schenn is far more physical averages over 3 hits per game to KFQ's 1 per game. Takeaways and Giveaway's are about the same. So is blocked shots. Schenn is also RHed vs KFQ's LHed shot. Schenn is the much smarter move between the 2. If you want players to be brought in, which we all do you have to have cap space and give up something to get something. It is that simple. Now do I expect a ton of changes? Nope. In fact I expect 0. But hope springs eternal.

Not true at all. Right now we are going to have about 24 million in cap space after we resign our RFA's. Yes that is in a perfect world. But the point remains we have a good amount of cap room. Sing Schenn for say 5 million per, trade for or sign a #1 Dman for 8 million per year, that only comes to 13 million. Still have room to add more pieces to the F group and a vet backup G. We have 7 roster spots that could be open and need to be filled after moving out guys like Tatar, Nyquist, Smith, Sproul, Jensen, Howard, Andersson, etc.... All numbers are based on what generalfanger.com has posted.

The trouble or problem with Smith is, his talent doesn't equal production. As talented as he is he has never had a 20 point season. Ericsson produces as many points per year as Smith does. Its not like he hasn't been given a solid shot either.

I think we all know it will be for more money and years than that. He makes 2.5 million now, he will get at least 1 million more per year.

That is what scares me and why I would like to see him retire. It looks like Holland is so loyal-blindly so to our current guys that he thinks resigning them and filling up our capo space is progress. I have nothing against Helm as a 4th line checking C. he is very good at that. But that is not how we use him. he is also getting to the point of making big money. With Glendening and others on the team there is 0 reason to bring him back. He should have been moved at the trade deadline. Now he will either resign for 6 years at 3.5+ million per year or walk for nothing. Not happy with either of those ideas.

I am done with Smith and it looks like Blashill is as well. Smith turns 28 soon and is a UFA after next season. Now is the time to move him in a deal to give him a fresh start. Schenn is 26-younger than Smith and KFQ. it still bugs me to now end that KFQ and Smith make a combined 7 million per year!!!!!!!! As for the young guys yes some will have to be moved our we will lose them for nothing. None are waiver protected anymore. Keep 8 Dmen next season. DD-YTBD #1 Kronwall-Schenn Ericsson-Green Oullett-Marchenko/Sproul/Jensen. That frees up Smith, and 2 of the marcheko/Sproul/Jensen group for moves. Summer of 2017 we could then move Kronwall-not that I think it will happen-just could. Summer of 2018 Green is gone. At that point we are down to 1 bad contract on D in Ericsson.

This is were we differ to some degree. We have a #2 Dman in Dekeyser. if healthy Kronwall is a #3 Dman. Everyone else on the team is a 3rd pair guy at best. That means we need a legit #1 and a real #4. Schenn would be the perfect #4 to pair with Kronwall. He is a rugged stay at home defender that is a RH shot to work with the offensive mined LH shooting Kronwall. Also KFQ is gone after the season. I hope he is........ Schenn is his replacement and a upgrade. Now we filled a hole and still have our tradeable assets to try and find a #1 which yes will be a challenge.

he has played well for both Philly and now LAK. He is a better defender than E or KFQ, so that would be improvement.

I don't understand the trade for yakapov thing. Why waste trade assets to pick up a small euro F that hasn't produced? if that is what we want just keep Nyquist, tatar, and Pulk. Same type of players 2 of 3 have already out produced yakapov. As for Yandle I like him as a player but I don't like what it will take to sign him. 7 years and somewhere around 50 million. he turns 30 this summer. Do we want to add another big money contract for a guy until he is 37? That is older than Kronwall and Z now. How are they doing? If I was going to add a Dman in UFA I would go after Schenn. He is 26 and a very good defensive Dman. No he isn't going to ring up 40+ points per year. But he will be much cheaper, contract over at 33 and would make out D better. He is a legit #4 dman that could be Kronwall's partner for the next few years. That pushes Ericsson and Green to the 3rd pair and then we just need 1 more Dman to pair with Dekeyser on the top pair.

Most fans could run the Flyers better than what they have been. Although Hextal does seem to be turning the corner with that team. Same is true with the Islanders. I enjoy a good hockey fight as much as anyone. But I would rather have some Dmen that can clear out the crease and make the oher teams fowards pay when they go behind our net and in the corners. Same is true on the other end. Forwards that try to hit the other teams D behind the net and take up space in front of their net. Those are the types of things that win playoff series and Cups. Which is the goal after all. Or is it?

I tend to agree with you. What we as fans want to happen vs what will happen. Different as day and night.

So how is everyone doing on these?