Richdg

Now back to this topic. When we go ahead a couple of years, after Z and D are gone our top 2 lines will be built around guys like Larkin, Mantha, AA, and Svechnikov. All 4 of those guys are LHed, good skaters, good shooters, and play makers. That should be 2 good pairs of forwards for the top 2 lines. What do they lack? None of them are front of net players and none of them are RHed. If we look down on the farm, same thing is true. Yes Frk is RHed but again not a front of net guy. This is why to me Gauthier is the perfect fit for us this year. Big tough-but not a big PM guy, and loves to play in the box in front of the net. having a couple of guys like him working low makes the other 4 guys much better. Right now we have been using Mantha low and in front of the net but that is not his strong suite. He is a sniper and loves to drive the net. In our 1-3-1 PP he should be the middle guy in the 3 man row, not the 1 down low. But atm we don't have anyone else to do that job. Now that is not a put down of the other guys available. Jones is a guy that loves to skate and throw his weight around-need more of guys like that, Brown is a big tall 2 way C and could be Datsyuk's replacement. All would help us out.

As for Ericsson, as much as we may want to get rid of him we can't afford to buy him out atm. We need 1 more year then the big D contracts can be moved or start to expire. Kronwall can be traded next summer 2017, green is gone summer of 2018. Then we can afford to buy out Ericsson as well.

Back at the begining of the year when the goalie discussion started some of us mentioned that mrazek may not be ready to be the starter and that if we want to move Howard we all better hope he plays really well. How many GM's are going to trade for a G that lost his starting job, is over 30 and has 3 seasons at 5 million +? Quick answer...... None. The only way we are going to move Howard anytime soon is for either we eat 50% of his salary and he plays well. To trade him and only free up 2.5 million which then has to be spent on signing a new backup for 1-1.5 million only gains us maybe 1 million in cap space. In that case keep him and hope he plays better oveer next season and drives up his value.

In the 4 seasons since Nick retired we have averaged between 29.5 and 30.1 shots per game. That has always been between 18th and 24th in the league each year. The goals scored per game has been between 2.51 and 2.84 depending on the year, and we have always been in the bottom third of the league. That is 4 years of being below average offensively. Yes you are correct that there is nothing in the pipeline for the D. Same is now largely true about the O. There is no datsyuk or Z on the horizon. We hope that Larkin, AA, and Mantha become great players-I think they will, but all they do is replace the 80 goals per year that Z and Datsyuk used to produce. we haven't improved yet. Now Blashill is a more offensive focused coach than Babcock was. It hasn't helped. Our O is worse this year than last year while the D remains the same. Any way we look at it we are a below average team. We need help everywhere, both ends of the ice. We have 15 million to spend this summer, and enough pieces to make 1 or 2 trades. Plus whatever we get out of the draft. Between now and Sep 2017 we need at least 2 high end F's and 2-3 high end Dmen. That is a lot of work and Holland needs to get busy.

There is always a debate about what D men are supposed to do. Last summer everyone here was convinced that Green was going to make our O better. Hasn't happened and he is poor defensively-which we knew. Our point totals from our Dmen suck, but is that really on them? Most Dmen get about 90% of their points in the form of asists. If the F's are scoring goals then no asists for the Dmen. Now we are 22nd in goals scored, but we are 16th in shots per game. So we are under performing in our shooting abilities. The flip side is we are 18th in goals allowed and we are 14th in shots allowed per game. Now compare this years numbers to last years. 2014/15: GF: 2.82 per game GA: 2.57 per game Shots per game: 29.6 Shots allowed per game: 28.3 2015/16: GF: 2.54 per game GA: 2.67 per game Shots per game: 29.8 shots allowed per game: 29.9 We are scoring .30 goals per game less on the same number of shots while giving up .10 goals per game more 1 more shot per game. The raw numbers saw we have an offensive problem more so than a defensive one. Again we must improve BOTH ends. Don't take this personal, but the 22nd ranked O is not above average. It is bottom 1/3 of the league, that is below average. Our shots per game is the same as last year and our goals scored are down. Shooting % is almost 100% on the forwards not the D. If our shots were down then yes one can make the argument that the D isn't getting the puck to the F etc...

I am saying that right now today we are better at keeping the pucks out of our goal 18th in the NHL than we are at putting pucks in the other teams goal 22nd. Those are the numbers. 22nd in goals scored is not above average in any way shape or form. Both stats suck BTW and I am not saying that we don't need to improve both units because we do. When we started winning cups we won because we didn't give up many goals. Most our our D were good solid stay at home types. Some also helped in the O zone. fetisov was not a high end offensive Dman, nor was Rouse, Ramsey, ward, Pushor, Vladdy, etc... Yes we had Nicky, then later added Murphy and Chelios. But we won because the D was great. Nor some of that was the Left Wing Lock, some was the F's coming back, but most of it was the solid D played by the blueline corp.

ATM our D is still ranked better than our O is. One can also make the arguement that if the F's keep the puck in the O zone longer and score more that helps the D. Fact is this team needs a talent injection everywhere. No one player is going to turn that around. Not sure if 2 can do it. it is more like a 4-5 players needed thing.

So a daily would you question. Vesey isn't going to sign with the Preds. They of course are always looking for offense. Would you spin a Sheahan or tatar for Vesey, if he agrees to sign? We would be moving a young F that is a RFA either this year or next for another talented young F that is under control for several years. Thoughts?

The value isn't there in this years draft. Not to mention we need the help now not 3-4 years from now. I still beleive the draft F's and trade for Dmen is the best idea. Of course that does require Holland making some actual trades and not kicking the tires......

That came from a person I know in the front office of the Griffins. Not going to name the name here. But if the RW's miss the PO's the Griffins expect Larkin to be sent down to help them. There is more to it than wishful thinking on the Griffins part. Now that was the plan as of the 1st of March. Things can/will happen during a season. The only way Larkin and AA are going to become top level C's at the NHL level is to play C. Make their mistakes, take their lumps, and learn/grow from it. C is their future and they are our future. The future needs to be now!

Since KFQ is a UFA bench him and play Marchenko. Build for next eyar and so on. Unless KFQ is our big UFA signing.......again....... Its pretty simple. Z-Datsyuk-Abby Mantha-Larkin-Tatar Jurco-AA-Nyquist Helm-Sheahan-Glendening let richards a UFA sit with Pulks. BTW some end of season stuff. If the RW's miss the PO's everyone that can go to GR for the PO's will go down. That includes Larkin. if they make it then all go down when the run is done, but Larkin is going to be rested. This came from inside the Griffins front office.

Don't start trading these picks now.... We are finally getting to the top 10 or so, keep the picks draft and develop.

I think Blashill has done just fine for his first year on a team with declining talent. babcock-the best coach in hockey, barely got us in the last few years. Since Blashill isn't Babcock that means he is a lesser coach and we are having a lesser result. There are alwasy thing sgoing on behind the scenes we don't see. Effort in practice, phone calls from the GM/owner, injuries, etc...

I would take that bet. 99% it is either TB or Tor.

True. Inter division always costs more. But beggers can't be choosers either. Yes we are entering the beggers area..... Yikes......

Yes and no. Yes defense wins championships. But our D is still ranked above or better than our O is. BTW the Oilers in the 80's won a ton of Cups without playing D, we went to the Cup in 95 without playing D and other teams have done so as well. We have issues on both ends, we need a major injection of talent for both groups. But you also have to add what is available.

Every year we hear about stars that are available, we all debate what it would cost, then are shocked at how little teams pay. it happens all the time. Happened with Nash, Kessel, Hamilton, Kesler, etc....

Its not as far fetched as you might think. Pitt wants to free up cap to add depth to their team. Malkin is 29, Nyquist and Smith are both younger and would be adding depth. Now will they want more? of course. But it is possible. Even if we have to add another secondary piece like Sheahan or Jurco I would still do it. That is the point in the discussion. we need stars, Malkin is a star that could be available.

Here is one for you all. It has been widely rumored for 2 years now that Malkin is going to get moved. he is the type of player that we lack, is very expensive cap wise, and does come with some injury concerns. But all that set aside would you do a Nyquist+Smith to Pitt for Malkin and they retain say 1.5-2 million per year? If I could get them to retain 2 million per year I would. Next year you have the following top 6: Malkin-Datsyuk-Abby Z-Larkin-Mantha That is starting to look much better. Then in 2017/18 Datsyuk is gone, Malkin goes back to C and Schvenikov moves in on his wing.

With 7 games to be played we are drafting 14th, out of the PO's.

I don't think Nyquist or Tatar suck, I think they are good secondary players. But we lack the primary players. Looking just at numbers we have 0 primary players up front. Datsyuk and Z have dropped below that point and Larkin, Mantha and AA have not reach it yet. 50 points from your top line F's IS TERRIBLE! We may not have a single F get to 50. The leaders are at 45 IIRC. For anyone to say all of our problems are at one position is wrong. Yes the BL needs to be upgraded-#1 but so do the F's. If the puck is always in our zone is that on the D for not getting it out or on the F's for not keeping it in the other teams zone? True is it is both. I was listening to the game on the radio Saturday and the post game. Paul Woods talked a ton about the F's not keeping the puck in the O zone and putting pressure on the other team. As for the turnover, yes it is hard to turn over half the team in a year. But it needs to be done none the less. Much of the team is just average or below. The top 6 forwards and top 4 D all need to be upgraded. It is that simple-and that hard to do. Until this happens prepare for a streak of not making the PO's Because that is where we are at.

Just an example man. Tatar and Nyquist haven't scored 40 yet this year either. They might be just short. But the bigger point in this is guys that score 40 goals or 35 each year are the superstars that make other around them better by drawing all the attention. Guys like Nyquist and Tatar don't.

Buppy, Green juts got 6 mill per year last summer. Yandle is younger and another year of inflation gets added on, I would be shocked if he is under 7 million. If 2-3 teams get into a bidding war he could be 8+ easily. Trouba is not a great Dman today, but he is also 22 and there is plenty of talent there. I think a pair of Trouba and Dekeyser could be very good in about 2 years. But of course this would require Holland to make a trade or 2.....

Of course nothing is that cut and dried, but I understand your point. On that you are correct. Not enough top line guys. There is always a debate on are you better off with 2 good players or 1 great player? If you have 2 guys (Nyquist and tatar) that combined score 40-45 goals and make 8-9 million per year is that better than having 1 guy that scores 40+ and makes the same money? The hard part is the answer changes based on your team. If your team has 3 super stars then moving one for better depth makes sense. But that isn't us atm. We lack the stars so we need to trade/sign/develop some.

This is where Holland needs to go out and DO something. I like Yandle as a second pair guy. The trouble is he is a UFA and is going to get paid like a top pair guy. Is Yandle really worth 8million per year? That is the area I think he will be signed at. I would much rather make strong runs at Fowler and Trouba. If Holland landed both I might drive to Detroit and kiss him! I think I am safe on that front however.....LOL But those are the type of guys we should be going after. Guys that are close to being stars that we can control at a reasonable rate. Then come the summer of 2017 try to find another 1 or 2 Dmen. We need 3 over the next 2 summers, be it from trade, UFA or youth developing.