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The players I have listed in bold do not belong anywhere near an "all-time" team. Neely? Seriously? He scored well in his prime playing with Janney and then Oates, but without them he didn't score much at all. Cheechoo situation much?

Brian Boucher is the best option for a new backup if it's not Osgood. Nabokov will never be a Wing, give it up.

I think Grant Clitsome is a good ace in the hole. He's not as good as the others I listed, but he's young, skilled offensively, has defensive ability, and can play a physical game. Definitely a good guy to look at if the Ehrhoff/Pitkanen plan fails.

I didn't ignore it. I recognized that he as doing poorly. He was also removed from the PP after ten games or so and then put back on once he improved his play. But I point again to the Franzen example. The Wings don't have a shortage of offensively skilled players, yet Franzen was eating up PP time at the end of the season and not scoring.

Philly should be in the same division as the Rangers if possible. That's pretty much why I changed them.

Divisions that make sense include the highlighted Northwest, and Southwest, a Central where Dallas replaces Detroit, and an Eastern conference where Detroit moves into the Northeast, Buffalo to the Atlantic, and Pittsburgh to the Southeast. The divisions you have here are neat, but ridiculous. Regular games between Florida and Western Canada? Seriously? That's a nightmare trip. Chicago to Montreal is the longest "Eastern" conference trip, and it's shorter than Dallas to Miami, which is an IN-DIVISION trip in the "Western" conference. Completely ridiculous. Cutting them up North/South instead, including the bottom two divisions plus Carolina, Chicago, Columbus, Pittsburgh, and Washington would make for much more equal travel. It also preserves most rivalries, although the Pens/Flyers, Wings/Blues, and Wings/Hawks are cut apart by it. It does bring back the Wings/Leafs rivalry, which most Wings fans would be more than happy to trade for. If the Atlanta sale falls through, Pittsburgh or Chicago ends up in the North, and a rivalry is saved.

Say what? D Lidstrom: UFA 2011. Likely retires by 2012. D Kronwall: $3m, UFA 2012. Soon to be the team's #1, assuming he re-signs next summer. D Rafalski: $6m, UFA 2012. Likely retires afterwards. D Stuart: $3.75m, UFA 2012. Declining play, will possibly no longer be playing at top-four level by 2012-13. So what long haul is this that they're all signed for? Sign one or two of Ehrhoff/Pitkanen/Bieksa please.

Huds wasn't given credit for being one of the team's best players in the second half until he was scoring like crazy on Datsyuk's wing. And even then, it was "he only plays well with Datsyuk" so to argue "what do people think of him now is a loaded argument. Hudler's last 35 games were FAR better than Franzen's last 35. Hudler outplayed Franzen against Phoenix even before Franzen's injury, and was better against the Sharks. Yet Franzen gets "Oh, it's ok, he was injured" for the playoffs and in the regular season it's "he'll be awesome in the playoffs" while Hudler is "he's too small/slow" or if he was knocked down it's "damn weakling, replace him with (insert random big-bodied player here)" so it's not really fair. People think Franzen is an elite scoring winger because of what he can do sometimes in the playoffs or the streaks he has gone on. It's not true. Filppula is the team's third-best forward, and Franzen and Hudler are about equal in ability. Cleary is just behind them in the #6 spot. Hudler played maybe 15-20 games in a top-six role. And he scored nearly a point-per-game for a stretch of about 30 games. Only two other forwards on the team scored at/near a point-per-game for the entirety of their top-six time this season. Z and Dats. Franzen, Cleary, scored close to 0.7 PPG. Bert, Flip, Homer and Huds all had about 0.5 per game. Huds was the only one who played outside the top six most of the year. Even with his 30-game scoring slump where he played a considerable amount on the fourth line, he still ended up tied for seventh in team points in the regular season. Give him a chance in the top-six and he'll tear it up. Not 105 points, but I would put him down for third on the team if everyone stays healthy.

Holland will have a good amount of cap space, and the D has underperformed for three seasons (McCrimmon was not fired for no reason) so I fully expect Holland to be looking at acquiring a higher end defenseman if possible, and those guys are at the top of the list for UFAs. The current top four will all be UFA at the end of 2012, which is a huge problem; Lidstrom and Rafalski will retire at that point, Stuart may not come back, and Kronwall will require a serious raise if he doesn't bolt. One, possibly two could be acquired. All three are under-30 and would be locked up for a few years at a decent contract. But Holland won't just be looking at defense. He'll be looking at forwards also. Some under-30 forwards who should end up at $3m or less are Brooks Laich (popular choice here), Jussi Jokinen, Scottie Upshall. Abdelkader/Helm/Upshall? Sounds good to me. Or there's everyone's favorite former Red Wing; Tomas Kopecky. Jokinen's the only one who doesn't bring a physical game, and he instead is another speedy, highly skilled defensive forward with good puck skills. Finally, if Holland pays Ericsson $2.5m per year, Ericsson better take Stuart's job, and Stuart better be traded for a solid grinding forward and the kind of defenseman Salei USED to be. Stuart is, at best, equal with Meszaros. Meszaros is seven years younger and costs about the same. Given Lids and Raf are about to retire, and we need to rebuild the D corps, I'd rather a player on the way up than a player on the way down. Stu in three years will look like Salei does now. Meszaros may be inconsistent, but he's getting better and will be a solid, stable all around defenseman in a year or two. The kind you can rely on in all situations. He'll probably get around $3m.

Hudler is moving to defense?

If Draper retires, Konopka's faceoff skills become very attractive as an advantage over Miller. Ultimately Konopka, provided he can skate with the team on the PK, which he should be able to given that he does it in the East, would be a better fit than Miller, fists or not. Lose a little offense, sure. But you get a big, key faceoff guy who plays physical and is good defensively. Konopka can be used for faceoffs against a guy like Thornton (big center, one of the best faceoff men in the league) instead of putting a guy like Draper or Filppula - someone who will be outmuscled - on that draw.

If Hudler played with Datsyuk all year, Datsyuk would get all the credit for Hudler's points. Hell, Hudler only spent three weeks with Datsyuk this season and Datsyuk gets credit for all of Hudler's points this year. Konopka would be a solid bottom-six acquisition. He's a good defensive player, excellent on faceoffs, and offensively aware if not skilled. He's like Franzen used to be, but he's also an enforcer.

I think he can score 105 points? It's certainly possible he could do it, but I don't think it would happen. What I have said is that in the eleven games he played with Datsyuk, he was on pace for a 105 point season. That's not the same as me saying "I think he would keep up that scoring all year!" but you don't seem to be one for accuracy. When have people mentioned stats to show support for Franzen? What stats?

That's my pick. He knows all aspects of playing as a defenseman, and has been working with the prospects for a while in a coaching capacity. Stuart? CRUCIFIED? Stuart is possibly the most overrated player on LGW. He was as bad or worse defensively than Rafalski this season and brought no offense, while Rafalski brought elite-level offense. Rafalski was generally considered a bum and washed up, while Stuart was praised as possibly the team's best defenseman other than Lidstrom; even though Kronner was holding that spot firmly all season. Part of it might be because I mention those two every time I post about possible FA acquisitions. If the cap raises $6m, we could potentially get both. As for Bieksa against those two, I don't see what need Bieksa fills that isn't also covered by Ehrhoff or Pitkanen. While on the other hand, Bieksa is the "big name" coming off of Vancouver's defense, while Ehrhoff is secondary. Other than those three, there are Wisniewski, White, Babchuk, and Clitsome as notable under-30 UFA defensemen. Bieksa gets a ton of hype and will be the "prize" defenseman. Wisniewski had a great offensive season and is physical, so he'll be a hot commodity. Pitkanen actually had a down year statistically, which is good for those interested in acquiring his services as a large, skilled two-way defenseman with physical presence. Ehrhoff is simply a really good defenseman who there isn't really much talk about. Which makes acquiring Ehrhoff and Pitkanen to replace Salei and Ericsson ideal.

You have a context issue. The full quote is: But the two parts you brought up should be pulled out as such: He's basically saying that he didn't feel that the existing situation in Detroit would allow him to develop to the level he wants to be at, and to develop into a player who can be relied upon by his team for offense. It's not "I should have been given 20 minutes a game in all of the best situations."

Ok, so remove all of the games Franzen played with Datsyuk. That's about half of his goals and points this season in the time spent before December 22th, as well as the few games after the HDC game was broken up. So Franzen has ~25 points in about 40-45 games. Take Hudler's Datsyuk time away, and it's 23 in 62. So Franzen, who plays about 50% more, scored about 50% more without Datsyuk. But Hudler was far better WITH Datsyuk. So why are we wasting that spot on Franzen?

What exactly didn't work out about Hudler? Holland signing one of his own RFAs who had just put up nearly 60 points? The fact that most teams in the league would love to have Hudler, and many would slap him right on their first line? The Wings having a plethora of skilled forwards is not a mistake Holland has made; it's exactly the opposite. I can think of nine forwards who played for the Wings this season who are top-six caliber, and another who should have been. If six players score 7 goals each, it's better than four players who score ten each and two who don't score at all.

So you're telling me that this season, when Hudler was excellent when given top-six time, proved he doesn't excel in a top-six role? Sure, anyone can score points playing with Datsyuk. But there's a difference between being an excellent scoring winger with Datsyuk and just grinding out a few points. In the 17 games prior to Datsyuk's return, Hudler scored 12 points. That's still a 60-point pace. So over 28 games, that's pace for almost 80 points. 28 games is a third of a season, so it's not really a short period of time. You obviously dislike him because he's not Eric Lindros, Gary Roberts or Keith Tkachuk, but he is still a skilled forward and given top-six time will provide plenty of offense. Well, if we're looking at this season, Franzen never had an 11-game stretch or longer where he managed better than a point-per-game. Furthermore, if you project Hudler's scoring stats to Franzen's ES and PP TOI, Hudler ends up with 13 goals and 36 assists for 49 points, compared to Franzen's 28-27-55. One of them spent most of the year with one of the world's three best centers. The other is Jiri Hudler. Hudler from December 27th to Feb 5th: 17 GP, 3g-9a-12pt, ATOI 15:52 Seems like he was hardly having trouble with his offense before he was placed on Datsyuk's line.

Probably no more than $750k if I had to guess. Given their personalities and roles on the team, the league minimum doesn't seem unrealistic either.

Holland is the best GM in the world, but he will be leaving. I think Yzerman will eventually become the Wings' GM, but not for a while and not necessarily right after Holland. As for the "players he played with" thing... Guys who Yzerman played 5 or more seasons with: Holmstrom, Draper, Lidstrom, Osgood Other guys who Yzerman played at least one full season with: Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Cleary, Kronwall That first group will be completely retired within the next two or three seasons, if not sooner. As for the second group... Franzen and Cleary played one full season as grinders during Yzerman's last year. A rookie Kronwall was injured in exhibition and came back to play just under 30 games that year. Leaving Datsyuk and Zetterberg as the two players Yzerman played any significant time with that he would have to make decisions about. Two of the five best forwards in the world. One of them is signed for life, the other is signed for a damn long time. So what "emotional" decisions are we talking about?

The argument was that Hudler wasn't capable of playing like a top tier offensive talent, to which I cited his post-Christmas streak which was followed by his time with Datsyuk. It wasn't "Is Hudler a top-tier player" it was "Hudler isn't capable of it." so a stretch where he didn't do it doesn't matter. Franzen's pathetic performance in the last couple months of the season and his floating in the playoffs are no better than Hudler's stretch at the beginning of the season. And before you pull out the ankle injury for Franzen; he looked no different in his effort before the injury in the playoffs... so when was his ankle injured? February?

For all of those saying the team needs to get younger; Jan Mursak has no more waiver options, so he will definitely be on the team next year as Modano's replacement. We also have Cory Emmerton, who is NHL-ready and also out of options. So he has a good shot at the roster, possibly replacing Drew Miller or Kris Draper. Now we factor in Jagr. If we assume Draper is returning, Emmerton is probably gone and Jagr takes that spot. If Draper retires, Jagr takes Draper's spot and Emmerton gets the last spot on the roster. Miller would be a constant scratch, while he could get a deal with another team (Buffalo?) to play regularly. So let's break this down by age. We've taken out Modano, Draper, and Miller and replaced them with Jagr, Mursak, and Emmerton. Jagr is two years younger than Modano. Over fourteen forwards, that's an average of 0.1 years younger among forwards if Draper stays and we replace Mo with Jagr; 0.4 if Emmerton replaces Miller. Draper retiring, the Wings keeping Miller and not signing Jagr is 2.5 years younger. But Miller is the 13th forward if he stays in any situation, so the difference in his age against Jagr's doesn't make that much difference. And it's likely that he would come at a cheaper price than the $5m that has been tossed around in this thread. I wouldn't expect Holland to sign him for more than $2m-$3m. How many "young" free agent forwards who bring anything close to Jagr's skill level would sign near that cap hit? My bet is on the number zero.

Big difference; Ericsson had a big playoff run, is two years younger, is much larger, is better at both ends, was ahead of Lebda on the depth chart in Ericsson's rookie season. Lebda's performance in Toronto has no bearing on Ericsson.

He produced at a rate that would produce 30 goals and 75 assists in 82 games. Franzen has only once performed that well offensively; the 09-10 playoffs. Who was he playing with? He also produced points at a higher rate than Datsyuk did while they were together. Deal with it. When Hudler is placed in a top-six role, he excels. This has been the case time and time again. How well would the Sedin twins do on a checking line? Not well? How about Crosby? Savard? Kovalchuk? Kane? Thornton? None of these guys would do well on a checking line with checking line wingers/center. They might score some points, but not at their current level. Why do you expect Hudler to do so well? People around here say I think he's some kind of otherwordly talent; yet I'm not the one who expects such ridiculousness from him. I fully realize that playing in a checking role will limit your offense, unlike many here.

If Lidstrom retires this offseason and Holland only signs a Brad Stuart-caliber defenseman, the Wings will instantly have the worst defense in the league. Unless you are talking Brad Stuart of two-three years ago and not Brad Stuart this year, in which case the Wings' defense will still be significantly worse at both ends. The big FA signing will be backup goalie? So what happens on defense? Ericsson is almost certainly not coming back, Salei basically lost his spot to Kindl, and wasn't terribly effective, so he probably won't be back. Osgood intends to come back, so the only way Holland signs a new backup is if Osgood simply can't play due to his injury. The Wings have ten forwards signed, with perhaps two checking line forwards. Eaves, Miller, Mursak, Emmerton, and possibly Draper are vying for those last three or four forward spots, so a new forward is unlikely. Which leaves a fair amount of cap space to load up on the defense, which was the team's biggest weakness these past couple of seasons. Also, after this coming season, our entire current top four (including Lidstrom) will go UFA, so having an Ehrhoff, Pitkanen, or Bieksa locked down would be a good start on the 12-13 team as well; Rafalski almost certainly won't be on that team, probably no Lidstrom either. So having Kronwall/Ehrhoff/Pitkanen already established would be better than spending a year fumbling around with the defense.