eva unit zero

Uh. No. Not even close. You've vastly overrated these guys. I mean, if you're talking about playing style, maybe. But no defenseman on this team projects to be anywhere near as good as Brewer or McLaren. Kindl: Kindl thinks himself as an offensive defenseman. His stats don't agree. Way to early to say, but he's not ANYWHERE near Eric Brewer potential. Quincey: Think Steve Chaisson. Solid, second pairing defenseman if he pans out. Might not though. Might not ever stick in the NHL. He's NOT a sure thing. Miro Blatak: Think Dmitry Bykov. Could make it as a 5-6 D-man and maybe see some second PP unit time. Maybe. Time is running out on him as a Wings prospect. Meech: He'll be lucky to make the NHL. The new rules sure help him. But still. His defensive game leaves A LOT to be desired. And his supposed strength, his offense, hasn't really been evident yet in the AHL. He NEEDS to produce this year. Kolosau: IMO, he's a potential gem. He loves to hit. He's big and strong. But he has virtually NO offensive skills whatsoever. His skating isn't real bad. But considering the direction this league is going, he might have a tough time ever making the NHL. I actually had thought Chiasson for Quincey, but I decided to instead go with all current players for the comparisons. I don't think the Brewer comparison is far off for Kindl. Brewer is 26 and is only now attaining legitimate 'top-two' status around the NHL (meaning he is top 60 overall) Brewer will obviously get better, but Kindl will easily get into that group. Even hockeysfuture, notorious for underranking Wings prospects (Zetterberg as a career third liner, Datsyuk as a fourth liner are some of their past rankings) has Kindl, Quincey, and Blatak all reaching the 'top-three' defenseman position, and Kolasau making the no. 5-6 spot, with Meech as a no.7 pushing for a no.6 spot. Want me to give you another guy who more closely matches those potential outlooks, with any minor adjustments I might see? Kindl=Brewer Quincey=D.Markov Blatak=F.Kaberle Kolasau=Warrener Meech=Robidas That better? EDIT: BTW...Chiasson was an all-star and is one of the better defensemen in Detroit history. Quincey won't be.

what, you mean heading towards excellent numbers on terrible teams?

Yeah, I'm sure that Holland would have had Hudler picked as a Griffin this year, but I still think that if Hudler had worked his ass of in camp and during the pre-season, and played from the very beginning like he did late in the pre-season, then he would have had Babcock on his side and he would have made it very hard for Holland to send him down. My guess would be that Holland has seen his inconsistent game and attitude for a couple of years now, and going into camp he would have already decided that he needed another year in Grand Rapids. However, that could have changed had he shown consistency and proved that he was a new man in camp this year. I doubt that Holland doesn't think he has the skills to make it. I think the only reason Holland would have been planning on sending Hudler back would have been to make him improve his attitude and effort. If Hudler had shown during camp that he had already made those improvements, I don't see why Holland would have sent him back. Look at Lebda as an example. He wasn't anything special in Grand Rapids last year, and I get the impression that he was basically invited to camp to make up numbers. He wasn't expected by anyone to actually make the final cuts and get a roster spot. However, he busted his ass and showed Holland, Babcock and the rest of the staff that he was ready and they gave him a spot. I don't see any reason why Hudler wouldn't have been treated the same way if he had shown that he had improved enough on the areas that he needs to work on (consistency, effort, etc.) Lebda got a spot because: They didn't feel Quincey was ready and wanted him to get ready for the Griffins season, so Lebda made the second to last cut over Quincey. Lebda stayed up at that point because they wanted to keep some extras. Lebda made the Wings because, and ONLY because: Niklas Kronwall was injured. That left the team with seven defensemen on the roster at that point. They decided to find a replacement for Kronwall (Woolley) and rather than shuttle Quincey, Meech, or someone else back to Detroit, they just decided to keep Lebda on as he hadn't been sent down yet. If Kronwall doesn't get injured, Lebda never plays a game in Detroit.

You do know that the only defenseman we have bigger than Kindl is Fischer, right? Kolasau is close, we have a couple others near that range.

Taking away all of our 'experienced veterans' I'll start with a 7-man unit Fischer Kronwall Kindl Blatak Quincey Kolasau Meech Fischer right now is the best of the group, third best defenseman in the organization, and the only one who has shown he can handle ful-time NHL duty. And he's done it for five years, and has been getting 20+ minutes and was stellar during a Cup run. Kronwall is more talented offensively and is responsible defensively, physically aggressive, and a good skater. Both of these guys have the potential to be perennial all-stars or perhaps even win a Norris or two down the line. Kindl is a fresh draftee, but if he really puts it together he could be a star defenseman as well, maybe even the best of this bunch. One description of him calls him a more offense-oriented Fischer. Blatak should develop into a solid contributor who will get PP time and the occasional PK shift. He should become the kind of guy who is a solid, consistent contributor, neither a star nor a goat except on the rare good or bad night. Quincey is only going to see limited PP time and despite a good skill set will spend most of his special teams play on the PK. Kolasau is another guy who won't see PP time, but likely gets a good amount of PK time, using his size and strength to 'inform' the Holmstrom-types around the league that they are being evicted. Meech is the least defensively capable of the seven, but he has plenty of tools. When he does manage to get into the lineup, he will probably get some PP time so Fischer, Kronwall, Kindl, Blatak can take a rest. I left Lebda out of the top seven and here's why: Next year, Schneider, Fischer, Kronwall still around. Lidstrom possibly. That's our top four. Lilja may be resigned, Quincey, Meech, and Blatak all may be ready for a spot. Dmitri Bykov could potentially be resigned as well. after a year in Grand Rapids where he was unimpressive, then making the roster due only to injury at the end of the preseason (Lebda was to be the final cut, but Kronwall got injured) it's unlikely he'll beat out better defensemen for next year's roster. As for pairings: Fischer/Kindl--two 'total package' defensemen to start the defense corps. Kolasau/Kronwall--Kolasau's skill and attitude allows Kronwall offensive freedom. Blatak/Quincey--Quincey's defense and puck skills works with Blatak's game. Meech--Some extra offense to plug into the lineup. I think this is a very solid group of young defensemen. It's more likely than not one or two of them gets traded (Probably one or two of Blatak/Quincey/Meech/Lebda) as it will be a few years before our lineup consists entirely of these guys. You never know though...if Kindl gets back to his game and Meech and Quincey continue solid progression, we could see most of these guys next season.

Just a comment on the Milici thing.. Brown's issue was with any young players..Tayshaun was already a starter and there were no SF's even close to him on the roster. Did you notice Detroit had like 7 big men last year? With Sheed, Ben, and McDyess as the top 3, you'd think they could have found some time to get Darko in, instead of burying him. Back on topic: Hudler may not have been working hard at the beginning of camp, but he was also told by Holland he was almost certainly going to Grand Rapids this year--basically saying 'we don't care how good you do, you're not making it this year' Babcock's comments caught his attention, and in the preseason he was all over the place every game. How's he done in GR so far?

Wouldn't Grigorenko have to clear waivers as he has played in Russia after October 5th?

Jakub Kindl Kindl has it all. Size and strength, shot, puck skills, defensive ability, speed. He is especially effective as a power play quarterback, using his offensive ability and skating to control the play from the point. Needs to work on his physical game, but that will come with more confidence as the season progresses in Kitchener. Projection: Eric Brewer Kyle Quincey Quincey is a good skater with a hard shot from the point. He is sound positionally and reads the play well at both ends. Quincey is a tireless worker and will stick up for his teammates. But despite showing offensive capability in juniors, he is expected to a primarily defensive defenseman in the NHL who won't be a liability in the offensive end. Projection: Kyle McLaren Miro Blatak Blatak is a strong positional player with excellent puck skills. He is a good skater, excellent playmaker, and has good hockey sense. His hard shot and knowledge of when and when not to join the rush is also an asset. Blatak, however, plays a mostly finesse game despite his size (6-1, 190) and needs to add muscle if he is going to handle the bigger forwards in the NHL. Projection: Frantisek Kaberle Derek Meech Meech is an offensively skilled defenseman with a good shot who worked his way into the top four in Grand Rapids as a rookie. He makes smart decisions at both ends of the ice and can read the play well. He is small, however, and does not play a terribly physical game. He needs to ultilize the skills he does have if he wants to reach his potential. Projection: Bret Hedican Siarhei Kolasau Kolasau is a big, physical stay-at-home defenseman. He does not have good offensive instincts. He has a strong but inaccurate shot and is a god crease-clearer. Projection: Rhett Warrener

mowers, maltby, cleary, chelios, woolly. (or any combination of these, i would not complain.) Yeah, let's dump Maltby. Then our top notch penalty kill drops big time. Why don't we cut Draper too? He makes a lot more than Maltby does.

Minnesota was due for a win...16 straight wins by Michigan over Minnesota. I still don't like the pass inteference calls that kept Minnesota's second TD drive alive....both were marginal at best. Especially the first one, where the Minnesota QB threw the ball behind the Michigan player (Hall I think) and he was called for pass interference when he didn't just let the Minnesota receiver run him over.

I believe Grigorenko's point totals are also similar to Evgeni Malkin's. That's something to be proud of. Kovalchuk is the best forward in the world...Malkin is a top prospect.

Yeah, that pick came out of left field. Like the Lofberg pick. He really didn't seem high on anyone's list at HF. But I've read some decent things about recently. I suppose one plus is that the Wings have his rights for four years instead of two. Meanwhile, I like what I'm seeing out of Jeff May and Darren Helm so far this year. he wasn't ranked high by HF...but CSS had him 25th of North American skaters while Latendresse had moved UP to 52. Less out of left field than Latendresse would have been based on those rankings, which are the primary ones used by NHL teams.

I voted Boston...They are solid up front and Raycroft is better than Grahame, Burke, Esche, Niitymaki.

still crying over spilled milk. If Michigan State had a kicker whom could kick....say....a 23 yard field goal, you would be crying over that game too. ITS OVER....DEAL WITH IT!!! Yes, because had Michigan State's kicker made the kick, Rivas would have missed his? Your logic makes a much sense as "Hull's goal in the 99 finals shouldn't have counted, therefore Buffalo should have won the Cup, even though games six would still be tied in overtime and Dallas would have a 3-2 series lead" Oh..and if Rivas hit the FG at the end of regulation, the game never goes to overtime. So YOU quit crying. Michigan beat MSU fair and square...when's the last time MSU beat Michigan like that?

They just need to do what they did against Michigan; Injure the 'one of the nation's best' RB early on...get a couple blown calls in their favor late. If that happens, they'll win.

He wore 52 in preseason...but he's obviously not on the final roster. So ultimately, Filppula does not wear any number with the Red Wings. On the subject of tryout numbers: Mathieu Dandenault wore 65 in preseason his first year with Detroit, before switching to 11 for the regular season after he made the roster.

I can't believe all the bitching about Carr. Michigan has been unranked a total of five weeks while Carr has been head coach. Four of those weeks were the beginning of the 1998 season, in which Michigan won the Big Ten title after opening the season 0-2. Carr's teams have also been ranked in the top ten almost 70 total weeks since he took over in 1995. That's basically one full year of every two. And can you name another program that went seven years until this month without being unranked? I can't think of one.

Wrong. Leech, Niedermeyer, Tarnstrom, Gonchar, Berard, Pronger, Zidlicky, Zubov... Just to name a few. I would consider Schneider a 2 way defenseman, and Lidstrom's definately defense. Yeah, 2 of the best offensive defenseman, if you want to add 15 other defenseman to the table. Schneider ranked 6th and 10th in defense scoring the past two years, scoring 50 and 46, and has averaged 45 points per 82-game season over his career and has been hitting that mark (.55 points per game) almost every year for over a decade...Lidstrom has been among the leaders almost every year of his career. Lidstrom has averaged around 60 points per 82-game season. Brian Leetch has averaged in the 70s...but since 97 his average has been 57, compared to Schneider's post-97 average of 44. Leetch has also been the sole offensive defenseman on the Rangers, except for a two-year period in which both Leetch and Schneider played there--both players' numbers suffered greatly. Schneider got second-unit time in New York, while Leetch was with the first unit. In Toronto, Mats Sundin was the only productive forward; Mike Johnson was second in team scoring with 47 points. In Los Angeles, Schneider shared PP time with Lubomir Visnovsky and Jaroslav Modry, and often ended up on the second unit because of their chemistry. Sergei Gonchar has averaged 52 points per 82 game season. Lidstrom's post-97 average is 61, Gonchar's is 55. I fail to see how Schneider is somehow not a capable offensive defenseman at all, and Lidstrom is a 'defensive defenseman' yet Gonchar and Leetch are 'the best' offensively. Since 1997 (82-game average): Lidstrom 61pt Leetch 57pt Gonchar 55pt Schneider 44pt Since 1997 (average GP, 7-season average) Lidstrom 81 GP, 60pt Leetch 71 GP, 49 pt Gonchar 72 GP, 48pt Schneider 74 GP, 40pt Not much difference between the last three..especially considering Leetch and Gonchar always got the bulk of PP time on their team. But "defensive defenseman" Lidstrom is FAR ahead...yet he is not the best offensively as well?

That's twice the Tigers fired Tram when he didn't deserve it. Quite the screw job.

You need a TiVo.

As far as lineups go, how about this for 06-07.... Hudler/Lang/Shanahan Williams/Datsyuk/Grigorenko Filppula/Zetterberg/Holmstrom Maltby/Draper/Franzen Bootland Lidstrom/Fischer Schneider/Kronwall Delmore/Lilja Meech Osgood Howard I'm not so sure I'd go with Zetterberg centering the third line. He's second line material at this point in his career already. The lines 1-3 can go in any order. They're all first-line level. They're all first-line level? I disagree. The Zetterberg line is probably the least 'first line' of the three, and that still stacks up well against a lot of 'first' lines around the league. Those three would be contributing around 60 goals and 150 points, which is not far off of the Doan line from Phoenix or even Iginla's line from 03-04 Calgary. Would you consider those lines "first" lines? Filppula and Grigorenko have played in 0 NHL games; as such, one has trouble in projecting their numbers with any sort of certainty. Of those nine players, perhaps three, maybe five of them are top-two line material. Two of them (Filppula and Grigorenko), we simply cannot tell yet. So, I'd say those lines are not all first-line material. let's see..three would be lang/datsyuk/zetterberg.....shanahan is still plenty top-two material, williams fits there, holmstrom can play top two, hudler definitely has the skill....not seein where you cut it off.

As far as lineups go, how about this for 06-07.... Hudler/Lang/Shanahan Williams/Datsyuk/Grigorenko Filppula/Zetterberg/Holmstrom Maltby/Draper/Franzen Bootland Lidstrom/Fischer Schneider/Kronwall Delmore/Lilja Meech Osgood Howard I'm not so sure I'd go with Zetterberg centering the third line. He's second line material at this point in his career already. The lines 1-3 can go in any order. They're all first-line level. They're all first-line level? I disagree. The Zetterberg line is probably the least 'first line' of the three, and that still stacks up well against a lot of 'first' lines around the league. Those three would be contributing around 60 goals and 150 points, which is not far off of the Doan line from Phoenix or even Iginla's line from 03-04 Calgary. Would you consider those lines "first" lines?

As far as lineups go, how about this for 06-07.... Hudler/Lang/Shanahan Williams/Datsyuk/Grigorenko Filppula/Zetterberg/Holmstrom Maltby/Draper/Franzen Bootland Lidstrom/Fischer Schneider/Kronwall Delmore/Lilja Meech Osgood Howard I'm not so sure I'd go with Zetterberg centering the third line. He's second line material at this point in his career already. The lines 1-3 can go in any order. They're all first-line level.

I would love to have Knuble back...Walz is a 'B' version of Draper. Good player but I dunno who I'd kick out in his favor.

As far as lineups go, how about this for 06-07.... Hudler/Lang/Shanahan Williams/Datsyuk/Grigorenko Filppula/Zetterberg/Holmstrom Maltby/Draper/Franzen Bootland Lidstrom/Fischer Schneider/Kronwall Delmore/Lilja Meech Osgood Howard That's not too unrealistic...with all the young players at capped levels, I wouldn't expect the payroll to exceed $45 million with those players...less if we succeed this year and players are willing to take a pay cut to return. With the salaries I have projected for those vets who are unsigned for 06-07 I expect this roster to come out around 36-37m.