betterREDthandead

It would be cool to build up the Wings' international fanbase by doing that. But the Ducks got off to a horrible start last year partly because of all the travel from their London trip.....they had to take a conventional road trip immediately following the one to England.

Ulf Samuelsson!

Once again: Simply the fact that we have to debate Ozzie's qualifications, that alone disqualifies him for retiring the number. When a number goes up to the rafters, there should be absolutely no doubt to all watching that the honor is deserved.

FIFY

I always say this: If you have to debate it, the answer is no. Retiring a number is a greater honor than the Hall of Fame. Lidstrom, absolutely. Ozzie, no. I'm a big ol' Ozzie fan, but you keep the retired numbers for the really, truly special players.

As mentioned, his management position is probably good enough. If he weren't in management - no.

60-62 isn't "workhorse-like", it's about average for a starter. It's just slightly over two starts a week, with 20 being just slightly under one start a week.

Who, Ozzie, or Howard? Ozzie will definitely be the starter next year. Howard should see roughly 20 games as the full-time backup.

I was hoping Hasek would retire. I hated to feel that way, because Hasek's done a lot for the team. I think it would have made for another awkward goalie setup if he'd stuck around another year. Can't keep Howard backed up in a logjam forever. Thanks are in order from Red Wings fans to Dom. The guy won us a Cup, and make no mistake - he was absolutely crucial to this one too. He played excellent during the regular season. So here's to the Dominator. We're lucky, as Wings fans, to have had one of the greatest goalies of all time suiting up for us. It leaves one question - will Franzen reclaim the #39?

But can I get one in the glow-puck variety?

True....sort of. But in the parts that overlap, Hart Plaza is packed in '97 and thinned out in '08. See the tall twisty post? Surrounded by people in 97. Not in 08. See the street in front of the One Woodward building? Packed in 97. Not in 08. The intersection that was jammed with people in 97 is empty in 08. It's simply false that the photos have no areas in common. It doesn't take a lot of deductive reasoning to guess that the rest of Hart Plaza in 97 is as packed as the part that does show.

I don't get the impression that the Wings care much about need. Obviously nobody they pick is going to make the big club any time soon. 3 years, minimum - that's how long ago Helm, Abdelkader, and Ritola were drafted and they're just now breaking on the scene. At #30 you just take the best player available.

I think they killed that. Not going on any more. Between the NHL season, the WHC's every year and the Olympics every four, they weren't getting the players.

2nd was '97 actually. The one that was supposed to have 300,000 fewer than this year. I still cannot find an online copy of the picture I'm thinking of, but it is roughly the same only with a much wider view. I have the newspaper somewhere, only not here. Hart Plaza is packed and as you can see, so is Woodward. Jefferson is lined with people as well. I think the picture was taken after the parade and as the speeches on stage are going on, as people flood down Woodward toward Hart Plaza. The point is to show that there's no way the '08 parade exceeded the '97 parade. Look how many people on Woodward; look how packed the plaza is. It's packed this year too, but not like '97, which was said to have 1.1 million. I'm sure both events had people staring out the windows. I would guess about 600,000 for that first parade and about 200,000 this year.

Tampa and Anaheim bring in 20,000 people, and getting ten times that is an insult? Try something. Pick the year these photos were taken. They're two different years.

Then I suppose every single media outlet, including the News, the Free Press, ESPN, AP, Channel 7, Channel 2, etc. etc. are bashing Hockeytown, and you should go write nasty letters of protest. All of them spoke of "thousands" or "hundreds of thousands", not millions. One article claims an outrageous figure among many that don't, and everyone's ready to fall head over heels believing it. Use your head instead of just believing on face value everything you read.

So what makes you the pro, then? Where do you put a million people? And their cars? It's not degrading the parade to call bulls*** on the numbers.

It's actually an average of 106 points per season, not 113. Which is still ridiculous. Another way to look at it is: What percentage of possible points did the Wings get? The answer is almost 2/3, and the percentage works out to over 109 points in an 82 game season. I'm really shocked that the '01-'02 team had such a low amount of goals. Third-lowest total of all of them if you multiply the '95 season out to a full one.

Wasn't there a member or two who claimed Franzen was soft for not going out there in the conference finals because of headaches?

I don't think any of us expected a small turnout, nor did any media types predict one. I think the turnout was pretty standard for Hockeytown: excellent as usual. Is it really that important to pretend there were 10 times as many people as there really were? Of all places, Hockeytown shouldn't have to artificially inflate the numbers to pretend we're better than we are. It bothers me that people will just accept any old number without even putting the slightest amount of thought or questioning into it. I remember the picture from the 1997 parade. WAY more packed than the pictures from this one. The '97 parade, because it was the first, was the best-attended. And this parade supposedly had 300,000 more people. When we win the Cup in 2020, are they going to say 5 million? I wish I could find the old picture and put it up next to this year's for comparison. It was the most incredible gathering of people I've ever seen in this city.

You don't get three feet of personal space. You get two. Stand with your arms at your sides, it's about two feet from elbow to elbow. Three square feet comes from the foot and a half you get by adding the length of your foot (one foot) plus three inches on either side so you aren't dry humping the biker dude in front of you. Go build yourself a 24" by 18" box, stand in it, and see how you feel about your personal space then. If the crowd estimates of 1.4 million really come from the police, then the police are full of s***. I agree that our turnouts for the parade are really something, and much better than you'll get elsewhere. I've always said Detroit is not only the greatest hockey town but the greatest sports town in the country. It's a wonderful time to be had by all. But believe me: 1.4 million is a load of crap if you even put the tiniest bit of thought into it beyond "ya i was there it was hUGE!!!!"

Haha, which 5-on-3, the one in Game 4 or the one in Game 6? Both were equally crucial and put to rest any notion that the Pens' power play was some kind of unstoppable lethal force. Both were "if only" moments for the series. Probably the if only moments.

Take a look, people: That box represents the 4.2 million or so square feet that 1.4 million people would require. That box is nearly a mile long. To fit 1.4 million in there, it would have to be a solid wall of people. Not one of them fat and overweight Unmoving, not minding the sardine factor, pretending there are no buildings, cordoned off zones, cars to hold the players, or any such stuff. In reality that box would have to spread out like, uh, an octopus, through the streets. Is that really what you see in the pictures? Take a look at this one from 2002. Similar turnout this year, and similar absurd hyperbole. The box in the picture above would have to be completely filled with people to hit 1.4 million - clearly, it is not.

1.4 million? Bulls***. I know that'd be a nice thing to pretend about what great fan support we have but it's complete, total, 100% bulls***. Hart Plaza can only fit about 18,000 people and that's if you jam them in like sardines on every square inch, which they did not because the fountain was blocked off. Woodward between Jefferson and Campus Martius could maybe fit 25,000 if you jam them in like sardines and pretend that nobody in the back cares about seeing. I base these numbers on how many square feet the average person takes up (about 3) and how big these places are, thanks to Google Earth. This is also if you pretend that nobody at all moved from Woodward to Hart Plaza. Ever tried to park downtown for a Tigers game or a Lions game? It took us 45 minutes to leave downtown after the Motor City Bowl. 60,000 people. Where the flying hell is there parking for over half a million cars???? Get serious. I wouldn't even bet on 400,000, not even counting all the people watching from the windows at work or from their apartments. Maybe - MAYBE - 150,000.

Yeah.....and room for anyone to skate to the net at will. Anyone who bags on Lilja should stop a minute and go watch Rob Scuderi open the floodgates to let any Red Wing who felt like it take the puck right at Fleury untouched, and sometimes hand them the puck to let them skip the task of going to get it first. God was he brutal.