hockeysattva

Yes there were blown calls, and it happens every year, series, and game. But, reading the posts in here is something else. I certainly hope that the team didn't lose the game because of a couple blown calls. Holmstrom gets away with some, and today he got a bad call, but Detroit could have been done a goal for a million reasons. That Datsyuk goal... well, the puck was out of sight and thats why it was whistled dead. It wasn't a goal because the whistle ended play before the puck crossed the line, period. I didn't like the game, but it wasn't a conspiracy -- the Wings could have won, but didn't and now we have to see if they can do it next game.

The 97 team played better, but 2002 was unstoppable IMO this team seems to have the best of both worlds. Where in 2002 I said anyone could have backstopped a Wings Cup I say this time is more like the 97 team with Osgood being an important factor, but with the offensive production of 2002. I think the Pens are going to test the Wings more than they have been given credit for, but I don't think its possible for them to get enough bounces and take advantage of "enough bad days" for them to steal the series. I am just looking forward to watching some good hockey.

I don't know what thread you guys are reading? The: All Red Wings Talk Goes Here..., Merged. Keep making them, we'll keep merging them. Shows lots of levelheaded posting, in fact a good number of these fans are worried about what they predict to be a Wings cup. "I have been waiting for this thread to pop up. From everything I see and hear and watch about Detroit, I feel like they will be to this years Pens, what Ottawa was to last years Pens. I just cannot see us beating them and I actually fear a sweep by detroit. I am totally a Pens fan, so this is not me wanting them to do poorly. I am curious why so many of you think they are better than Detroit? I want to be wrong..but, have you seen them play? They are like a machine and honestly I am worried about the next round. The Detroit team seems faster, tougher, and at a pace many steps up from all the teams who have played so far. Oh, did I mention I hate Detroit?' But, you can't expect every post to be like this...

To the person/s who use "***" as though it is synonymous with "bad" -- grow up. My biggest problem was the chip in the puck, many players said they could tell the difference and I am inclined to believe them. I just hope if they want to introduce tracking technology they can use smaller and more accurate trail. By no means do I think there should be a sensor for the line.

Weeks ago I said I was more worried about the Flyers than the Pens, not because I thought they were more skilled but because they weren't more skilled. The Flyers had the chance to be this years Ducks. Granted nobody is playing as bad/ dirty as Pronger... I could see some crazy things happening with Malkin and Crosby, and I am pretty sure against the Wings they would be on the ice at the same time (atleast in games 3 and 4) to mix things up, again. But, this really feels like 2002, and I just don't think there is any way that enough things could go wrong for the Wings that they wouldn't be able to Win it.

What about the not-a-goal that went through the net... can't remember the year...I think it was in 99.

On the one hand,Osgood has been denied credit in the past. But, he has also failed to achieve greatness. Vernon was called upon, and Vernon delivered... not my job to say whether or not that was the right call at the time. What I do have to add to this love fest is that there seems to be some misconceptions about how good this team is and what it takes to win a cup. Someone said the at Ozzie would get at least one more cup in the next three seasons as though it were guaranteed. Maybe you don't remember what happened when they had the most points ever... Anyway, 15 years in the league and Dallas Drake is getting to the conference finals for a second time. When Drake, Cheveldae, and a defenseman were traded Detroit got Bob Essensa. Osgood ended up starting in the playoffs because Essensa finished the season poorly. 93-94 GP W L MIN GA SO GAA 6 3 2 307 12 2 2.35 In 94-95 they had Vernon and he got swept in the finals by the Devils 95-95 he played well, but ... GP W L MIN GA SO GAA 15 8 7 936 33 2 2.12 96-97 Vernon won the cup after Osgood dominated during the season GP W L MIN GA SO GAA 2 0 0 47 2 0 2.55 97-98 Osgood earned it GP W L MIN GA SO GAA 22 16 6 1381 48 2 2.12 99-2001 Osgood had moment of brilliance and times when he was outshined by Manny Legace IMO. Hasek won the cup in 2002, and Osgood was no longer on the team... if he was (heck, just about any goalie in the league would have been able to win a cup 2002 wings) we wouldn't have been as good as Hasek, Hasek was stellar. Anyway, Osgood is a good net-minder, but this is only his third run to the conference finals, and Osgood has lost in the Game 7's he played in. To compare him with other goal-tenders who have stolen a series is ludicrous, .... I have no doubts that he will go to the Hall of Fame and I expect it will be on a first ballot, but saying he didn't get credit because the greatest coach ever went with a vetran in 97, or the league best in 2002 ain't gonna cut it.

I am going to go out on a limb that I have sat on before: Maltby and Draper have been the best penalty kill pairing of the last decade and the playoffs is their time to shine. That being said, I am not convinced he is 100%. If he was I think he would have gone in a game or two ago when he was still 85%. Also, I think Mac has gotten better every game except last night. Its hard to judge an individual's performance in the midst of a blow-out, but I saw him goof it a few times in the first, not nearly as bad as Chelli's give aways in game three but I am just saying. Also, I would expect to see some line changes by the time we get to games three and four of the next series. We will not be able to get the match-ups we want on the road that we did against the Avs. Babcock knows he has to play the other team, not worry about chemistry.

I read some pretty upsetting stories, some of them make me question some of the things I have said, done, or allowed to happen. The best advice I can give that you should be careful about drinking too much when you are a visitor. The next best thing I can say is that being a fan isn't so different from the rest of life. You just got to treat people the right way. Anyway, the year of the so called Stunner at Staples (I think, there were lots of playoff games in California those years) I was in line to piss. There was this guy really trying to give it to me, and he was all over the place. I remember "I oughtta beat your ass" kinda talk. I said, "Is this really what you want... do you want all these people -- these kids -- to see how bad a sport you are..." after adding a "you realize I am way bigger than you old man" I did my business. When I got out in the corridor I almost got escorted out of the game. Then the man who was behind me with his two boys said "he didn't do anything wrong, accept put on the wrong jersey... it was real good the way he handled himself in there" and I got to go back to my seat for the third period. I feel sorry for everyone who has gotten bullied or had kids cry and I kinda wish I didn't get coast through these situation just because I am a big tall guy.

The Good News is that Game one of the Western Conference Finals will likey be in Detroit on May 9th which is a Friday, with game two on Sunday the 11th... but there is a chance for game one to be on the 8th and two on the 10th. Anyway the good news is that getting there for the weekend guarantees (should Detroit get number 8) making a game. The bad news is that there aren't really any particularly cheap flights from PDX to Detroit unless you go Thursday to Tuesday, and I don't imagine you're heading up I-5... Its a pricey trip if count for tickets and everything ... it would be cheaper to go to San Jose (if they won) for game three or four. You ever feel like heading into Portland to watch a game, let me know.

I didn't go to the Prom when I was in high school but scoring would have definitely been on my mind... I mean the score would have been on my mind. Detroit's 96 playoff run had some problems, but well anyway... Bracelets, proms, scoring, whats next in the official LETAPOB thread? Carry-on.

Letting bygones be. (Since, I am not trying to be a troll.) So, it doesn't happen to me much up here in the North-West (guess its the whole grungier guy thing) but when I was living in California I used to get so many strange comments about the beard, or the "weird beard" since it has spent so many years as a sparse patchy thing. I am just wondering when you're going to start getting comments or if you already have. You know, "why all the strings on your wrists?" or "whats the string for?" Believe it or not, I am not against it.

I was afraid that I would come off the wrong way, but now that I think a bit more about "Ladies equivalent to playoff beard, Officially stamped " I am frustrated that you are trying to play such a trick with your words. I am glad you like hockey, and happy that you support the winged wheel, but seriously. You are on a hockey forum talking about tying string around your wrist being the same as growing a playoff beard. Do you expect this String-Theory to go over well? To be honest it sounds far-reaching. If you want people to know that you are a fan, just wear a jersey, or do whatever you want. My real issue is actually about the different colors for wins and loses, I don't trim my beard for loses; I shave it off the day they are knocked out... thats the point. But, you can do what you want, and I suppose that means you can compare string with growing a beard, heck why don't you come up with an alternative to throwing an octopus on the ice too. Alternative octopus throwing for scared-y-cats, instead of throwing one on the ice just eat a slice of pizza... with a thong on your head...

Not trying to be negative here but while you should feel free to wear bracelets string or even a lucky game-day-thong it isn't the same as having a playoff beard.

Hotdog throwing... You know I might have my first meal of octopus in less than I week; I am going to South Korea. Anyway, I came into the water cooler because I felt like complaining. I am just getting tired of some of the posters here. I am tired of wading through thread just to see that most people don't read what people write before they post. They don't care about threadjacking silliness, and generally speaking it seems too many modern day Wings fans are spoiled. I come back around and then I get fed up and I leave for a while, and come back and the cycle continues. The thing is that I think I disappear for longer the last couple years, and I get pissed off faster. Anyway, I had to leave a post, and so I played by the rules. Return to throwing hotdogs now.

Hey, when everybody just wants to repeat what has already been said why not quote yourself? Hockeysattva I totally agree with what you wrote except I don't think you took it far enough. From espn.com "McCarty listed his income as $2.1 million in 2003, $1.5 million in 2004 and $193,959 in 2005. According to court documents, McCarty received $538,729 from the Red Wings when they bought out his contract, but his ex-wife Cheryl received 75 percent of that -- $404,046." So, obviously his $190,000 of debt to casinos in Detroit and Vegas was his problem. Yeah kick a guy when he is down... you know for the thoughtless bulls*** in the last two pages... Darren had to sell his three cup rings at the end of last year to try and make things right and it seems most of you cannot even read through a thread.

As much as I am not impressed with "another 'bring darren back' thread" I cannot read enough "thats dumb" posts. I, for one, think report a new rumor -- even if it is a rumor and reported as such is thread worthy. I mean, seriously, its not like we have multiple threads about the subject that are on-going. You don't want to read it then DON'T. For what it is worth. I believe he could make some very substantial contrinutions to the team. But, I will present my points on the matter as well. 1. Darren has a huge heart. In terms of moral he brings the team up and there were definitely times last year when I thought we could use a guy like Darren on the bench and in the locker room. 2. We are not in a deficit when it comes to skilled players, and he would not be taking the spot of someone whom that was their purpose. He doesn't even get in the way of developing someone younger. We even got rid of Bootland... 3. I think you guys are really coming down pretty hard on him. The fact is that there are few (if any) players who were hurt more by the lock-out. I finally got into the first good contract of his career, and he lost a year of it. Then he was bought out. Yes, he was down, but if you don't think he can snap back then you haven't followed his career very long. 4. I have not been given any reason to think he isn't healthy. As far as I know he has made complete and full recoveries from everything that was hurting him. My only concern, and l do have one. Would he be able to forgive those who completely shat on him. I say yes, but I know that had to sting pretty bad.

I think it would be a disgrace to see Sean in Wings uniform again, plus he wouldn't fit with our team. Simply put: he is too much of a penalty liability.

For some reason I include 99-00 and not 89-90... I guess I am more worried about when a season starts than when it ends. Anyway, an interesting thing happens when you look at playoff numbers. I won't argue this means everything, but I will argue that it is not to be forgotten. Again, looking at years when we the wings were successful or as I am putting it when the make it past the 2nd round goal production is very similar, but Feds has considerably more assists. So, which players were 1st line from 95-95 -- 98-99?

Some stats to consider: Regular Season SY 50 + goals in 91 and 93 100 + pts 3 times SF 50 + in 94 100 + twice Playoffs: last six playoff runs of the 90's (isn't this really where the players are tested) because 91 lost first round in seven games, 92 win first round in seven and get swept 2nd round, 93 and 94 lose first round in seven (maybe 2000 shouldn't count according to this logic hmmm). .......... SY ................. SF ....... goals points goals points 94-95 .. 4 -- 12 ... 7 -- 24 ---- lost in Finals to Devils 95-96 .. 8 -- 20 ... 2 -- 20 96-97 .. 7 -- 13 .... 8 -- 20 97-98 .. 6 -- 24 ... 10 -- 20 --- cup 98-99 .. 9 -- 13 ... 1 -- 9 --- cup 99-00 .. 0 -- 4 ..... 4 -- 8 total .. 34 -- 86 ... 32 -- 101 And, there are a million ways to look at these numbers, but I hardly think they say "Case closed!"

Unfortunately I have not seen as much substance here as I would like to. The question is about the 90's, and I feel this is fair. The problem is that I am not sure how to value the different things these two offered. SF was in my mind a more substantial threat on the ice than SY was (remember we are talking 90's). However, without calling SF a locker-room cancer (which I never really believed) there is no way that he could have had the impact SY had. Now for the real tricky part. SF had the harder and more accurate shot as well as the faster legs. Accuracy was perhaps marginally better, but there is no doubt that he was a faster skater, and had a harder shot. So, what can you make of this? You ask the question who was more important to their team, and I say it was probably Yzerman. You ask who should be credited with reaching his potential and I say probably both of them. You ask who was more effective and I surprise you. They both did incredibly jobs, I really cannot think of a better Captain, but SF did a great job in a more difficult position. He was a square peg forced into a round hole. He played the role, but it was not the job for him. Hmmm.... maybe this can spark some reasonable discourse. I certainly don't think it is as cut and dry as some of you do.

There are many long standing traditions in hockey, however, the dark/ light or home/ away stuff is not part off it...

Come on now, say "I knew they could do it."

Come on now, say "I knew they could do it."

The consistency of the posters on this board kinda makes me think the NHL should do its recruiting for refs here. The game is not over, if you think back less than five years you know a team can score not two but three goals in five minutes. Two, you guys that I am refering to kinda make me sick. Not to mention PP and chances ... they score