RedWingAbner

Until he puts up 50 points, let's not go crazy. He (at 0.62 points per game) would hit 50 if he played all 82 this year at his current pace, but he's only played 29. Not quite ready to make that leap. His career high is 40.

Is a solid 2-way guy who puts up 35 points a year worth $3 mill?

I know I've said it before, but I think it's so true, so I'll say it again. Flip is like a lap dance-- it's exciting, then disappointing. He did do a nice job drawing the penalty.

I took it that that's what you meant too-- maybe Helm, Lidstrom, Datsyuk, Zetterberg (with D or Z playing higher, but not full point, Lidstrom fully back). Have Helm dig it out and Z+D feed Lidstrom for one timers. Maybe even Helm, Holmstrom, Datsyuk, Lidstrom....but yeah.....Having Rafalski on the point sucks.

How about not. He's not exactly adept at hitting an open net, let's not throw him in there "with a goalie" and hope for the best. Flip is like a lap dance. You get very excited, but in the end, it's just a tease.

Agreed. Rafalski on the point is like playing with a forward back there all game long. Terrible positioning and constantly being beaten physically and speed-wise. I liked Rafalski in Year 1, but he has made me cringe in years 2-3. I can't believe we have 2 years of his crap after this one......at $6M per year.

Say what you want, but at least Burke is trying to make his team better. Was Toronto really bound for greatness next year? Probably not yet. But, maybe Giguere catches fire and it works out. Phanuef is only 24-- if he returns to form, he could be a #1 defenseman again. It could all blow up, yes, but the only long term deal they are saddled with would be Phanuef. Meanwhile, he axed the albatross contracts of Hagman and Blake and managed to get something potentially valuable for Toskala. Giving up Ian White sucks, but he will not be making $875,000 next year (he being a UFA this year). At least, as a GM, Burke doesn't just shut down and say "we are stuck at the cap, stay the course." I remember when the Wings made bold moves. I'm not trying to flame Ken Holland, but it's time to do something to spark the Wings. This "we won't be making moves" bs is lame.

Watch/listen for the following: Waffleboarded away! With a Drive! Sid the Kid Youngest captain to win the Stanley Cup (you would think this would only be said 1 time, but my guess is 4-5) Crosby draws the penalty This will make it a 5-on-3 for Pittsburgh This will make it a 5-on-3 for Pittsburgh, their second of the day We're going to video review.........the goal counts, the Penguins have scored We're going to video review.........no goal, the Red Wings came close but no goal If I had the chance, I would let Crosby have his way with me (if Emrick/Olczyk/Maguire don't realize their microphones are on).

Predictions: 75 clips of Sidney Crosby talking about his greatness 30 Doc Emrick made-up descriptions 3 penalties aginst the Wings that cannot be explained--- other than they are playing Pittsburgh 4-1 Wings win.

But wait.....a goalie can be a cup winner + the product of great defense and then not recover his old form when he is exposed for being washed up? Better not let Osgood supporters hear this, it voids their entire goaltending theory.

Well, it's nearly February and the Wings are seemingly locked into a sub-par season. I'm not saying that they won't do damage in the playoffs, but I haven't seen much to convince me that they will. Since the Stockholm games, when they blew leads to St. Louis, this has looked like a different team. Is it time to consider that our #1 defenseman is on the decline, that there is not a "playoff quality" starting goalie on the roster (easy, Osgood lovers), and that Datsyuk/Zetterberg have been less than effective without the depth of previous seasons. Is it time to take a look at this roster (Holmstrom, Osgood, Rafalski, Stuart, May, Draper, Maltby) and make some hard decisions? Don't get me wrong-- each of these guys is/has been vitally important to the team's success at some point (save May). My fear is the fact that the Wings seem dedicated to "stay the course." Yes, Abdelkader will be a fine Draper replacement. But have we really grown a shutdown defender or top-6 forward lately (save Filppula, perhaps, but he's a #3 center, really). We have so much cap tied up in guys like Rafalski, Stuart, and Draper that could be better spent elsewhere (Rafalski especially). I know there are NTCs. Those can be waived, it's really just a tool used by players to give them say. Is it time to rebuild the Wings?

So, 2 games a season makes? Franzen is that much of a difference maker (I'd love it to be true, I have his jersey). I disagree. But please don't feel targeted. It was more the frustration of lack of debate. My bad.

Lidstrom is a guy that I that I will concede the point on. It's just that we expect so much of him and he wasn't putting up the offensive numbers that he had in the past. Ozzie is not the goalie he once was. That's something I'll agree to disagree on. Regarding Jimmy, I'd love for him to do well, but it is very rare for a rookie goalie to succeed in the playoffs. Regarding Draper specifically.....he is a role player making 2nd/3rd line money. In a cap world, that's my only knock on him. Regarding Maltby and May, I agree that they are good at what they do-- but it's not as if it's not replaceable-- any my point is, maybe developing a guy like Abdelkader or signing a younger guy to fill May's role may allow the team to transition gracefully. It feels as if we are holding onto Maltby because of what he accomplished. But that's another agree to disagree things. Kindl, from what I have seen/read, is streaky....even in GR. While I would love for him to be top-2, top-4, I really think that he may be a #5 or a #6-- not really saying much, considering that these guys aren't what anchors a team. I like Tatar, I saw him in the WJCs and was ecstatic the Wings got him.....but success on the big pond doesn't guarantee transition to the big club. Rafalski is getting paid FAR too much to fill the role he is filling. He is paid as a #2 and he looks like a #5. When I say rebuild, I don't mean scrap the structure, just get some replacement pieces.

I wasn't speaking specifically of you. I did mention that I tended to see your point, albeit without quoting you, on page 1.

There's no name calling. It's just identification. When I said that this had descended into nothingness and there was a theme (new posters). You followed up by picking a fight, on the internet.......which you bemoaned in the same sentence. I don't remember using the term "kids," I did say "assface" to describe blatant, "you suck" type stupidity. (EDIT: I re-read. I did use the term kids to describe childish behavior. My bad on forgetting.) I never implied my opinion was better or higher. I just developed it and explained why I did. You would think new members wouldn't jump into an argument whilst basically doing everything that was aggravating about responses in the thread to begin with. Welcome to LGW. What do you think should be done? Why? Let's get this thread back on track.

Nice edit on the post to add that line. Next time, just reply to me. Still waiting for your insight.

Thanks for proving my point, poster who joined two weeks ago. I know people don't agree with me. I'd like to see reasons why, not stupid filler-- which you just provided. Nice job.

I love how LGW is just a place for kids who joined in 2009 to post thier stupid "facepalm" crap. Instead of an actual debate, let's just be assface losers and give this thread 1 star. Anyone want to discuss anything about what I actually said? I can agree that Lidstrom may not be declining, perhaps his numbers are weaker because he is playing safer to cover for the lack of depth. But really guys, this is one of the best "healthy" teams in the league? When was this team impressive this season? Love the Wings, love Franzen and hope he can help when he gets back, but willing to face reality.

I'm saying, really, that how long can we tell ourselves that injuries are to blame? We've had flip for a month now, Ericsson, Kronwall (recently)......Is Jason Williams really the guy who is gonna put us back into contention? Or, can we see that this is a 6th-8th playoff team that had some injury problems?

Yes, I know that cliche' as well. Injuries have certainly hurt, but you can't blame the entire thing on injuries. Do you really think that this team is a contender when we get excited about Jason Williams returning?

Killer bunny. Nice. Pointless, but nice.

Great call on Osgood guys. It's much easier to just know you are going to lose when you tune in at 7 PM than to see the time earn a point with a disappointing OT loss.

Globe Arena West The Place Where The Blues Lose or....I am thinking of figuring a way to make a billion so that my new company, Sidney Crosby Is An Overrated *****, Inc. can sponsor the building.

Osgood? The Wings are still very much in the playoff picture, guys. Why give up now? Yes, you read that right. Osgood has shown, time and time again, that he is done. Yeah, the Wings played great in that Washington game, and Osgood shat the bed. I think the lingering image from last night's collapse is seeing Brad Stuart look sad after getting burned on each goal. Howard is the reason the Wings aren't in lottery territory right now. Osgood was once a starting goalie. So was Curtis Joseph. Time to move on.

I hate Crosby because the league is forcing him down everyone's throat. Watching that game, good God, it's like they are just determined that ALL WILL LOVE CROSBY. Pronger is what he is. Crosby is just what the league made him.