haroldsnepsts

This is only true if you qualify it with some number of seasons a goalie had to be on the team to count. By virtue of the length of his tenure here and position as goaltender, that alone puts Osgood in rarified air. If you are just talking about goalies who were Red Wings, Dominik Hasek was a Red Wings goaltender and relatively speaking Ozzy isn't fit to carry his jockstrap. You could make a case for Cujo being as good as Ozzy too. To the larger argument, there will be a lot of great players who come and go throughout the Wings history. It doesn't mean that all those numbers should never be worn again or we'd be into triple digits. Hanging a number from the rafters should only be for the best of the best. There was no one arguing Yzerman belonged up there and there will be no one arguing that Lids belongs up there. As for the fictional Osgood trade, who knows? who gives a s***? If Robitaille's shot had been an inch lower and scored instead of hitting the crossbar, would the Wings have won another Cup instead of getting swept by Anaheim in 03?

Strange, yes, but I don't see what's wrong about it. Greg Stefan wore #30 for nine years here in Detroit before Ozzy did. Kozlov was drafted by the Wings and wore #13 for ten years here, including for two Cup wins, but I think Datsyuk wore his number the very season after Slava was traded. The game goes on.

He wanted to be "the guy," so he signed with a team with Jaromir Jagr on it? With Yzerman retiring and Shanny coming off a 40 goal 81 point season, he very much still would've been "the guy" on the Wings as much as if not more than with the Rangers, given that Z and Datsyuk are certainly going to share the spotlight more than Jagr. I believe him when he said it was an instinct. It was the end of an era and I'm sure he felt he was in the twilight of his career. New York also made sense given his involvement in working with the league to improve the game.

Because $8.5 million was on the high side but considering the market and where the arbitrator landed at, it wasn't that far off the mark. But $4.5 million is grossly under any remotely realistic market value for Weber. For example, this off season James Wisniewsk signed for $5.5 million. So Wiz signs for $5.5 but $4.75 is anywhere near the mark for Weber? Jack Johnson makes $4.3 million, and the Kings have him signed for 7 more years. Weber is definitely worth more than Johnson, especially if you're only talking about a one or two year contract. Shea Weber was a friggin Norris candidate, had a great season, and is their franchise player. And they offered him a $250,000 raise. The point is, the Predators insulted Weber with their counter offer. The only question was if it was an intentional F you or if they're really that stupid.

This part of the article blows my mind. Unless the term was 15 years or something, they might as well just offered a bag of pucks. It would have been equally insulting.

Before getting claimed by the Islanders, Nabby's agent said he would play anywhere. Either he lied, Nabokov lied, or he changed his mind. Either way, that's the information Snow had to go on. Everyone in the hockey world knew that Nabakov would almost certainly never make it to the Wings. Him getting claimed by a team other than Detroit shouldn't have been a surprise. Snow made the idiotic contract with Dipietro, but a lot of the other previous terrible contracts were from previous GM's.

You guys are seriously pissed at Snow for picking up a goaltender, WHEN HE NEEDED A GOALTENDER? (trying to stay in the spirit of the thread). Nabokov knew what he was in for and would be subjected to waivers. Snow did not keep the Wings from getting Nabokov. All he did was keep another team from getting Nabokov. Nabby would've had to get past something like 22 other teams before the Wings could sign him. There's no way that was going to happen. And Nabby is getting off awful light for now saying he wasn't in game shape to play when he decided to come back. Probably just a lame excuse, but if it's true, was he thinking that if he did make the Wings it'd be okay to play crappy since they were going to make the playoffs? About the only part of your post that's accurate is he was a 9th round pick. He wasn't dropped by his KHL team. He chose to terminate his contract with them mid-season for "family reasons." His KHL team didn't drop him. And snow grabbing Nabby off waivers made a lot of sense given his goalie situation at the time.

I think it also sends a bad message to the fans and the rest of the team. Weber is the franchise. Not being able to come to terms with him could be seen as a lack of commitment to putting together a winning team. And it's not like this deal snuck up on them. They've had plenty of time to prepare for what it would take to sign him.

Center Ice is awesome. It sounds like the problem is with your local carrier. I have Directv and have gotten the center ice package several times. It's been great.

He's done an okay job with the league. He has a tough job, like dealing with some of these idiot owners who argue about not being able to make money but then go out and offer some of the stupidest contracts in pro sports. And I'm sure he also has to fight against a climate of "good ol boys" that can hold hockey back and make it look like a lower-tier sport. Guys like Colin Campbell who behave as if this was his kids pee wee league and not a multi-billion dollar sports operation. My main problems with Bettman are that he was a major component of both lockouts that cost a season and a half of hockey, and someone with more diplomatic and management skills likely could've salvaged at least some of those seasons. In particular the tone he set from the very start of this last lockout pretty much guaranteed we'd lose a season of hockey. He has increased the popularity of the league, but part of that progress has just been recovering from what was lost in the lockouts. Second, he comes off as a condescending ******. I get so tired of Bettman telling me what I think about the game. He's often full of s*** whenever he talks about what fans think. Pre-lockout, he was incessantly denying there were any problem with clutching and grabbing and would go on and on about the fans and players loving the game just as it is. Then there's the lockout and what do you know, major changes to reduce clutching and grabbing. Beyond that, I would bet that were he not commissioner of the league, he'd never even watch a hockey game, on tv or in person.

I think you get used to new players in old numbers the longer you watch the team. I started watching around the time when #30 was Greg Stefan and #5 was Darren Veitch. And I swear it took me a couple seasons not to think Datsyuk was Slava Kozlov, especially given their somewhat similar style of play. Seeing Chelios wear #24 in the Winged Wheel was odd too. I kept wanting him to beat the snot out of people.

So he makes almost as much as the NFL and NBA commissioners. That seems out of whack to me given that the total value of those leagues is probably much higher than the NHL's.

Out of curiosity, what site? I think Ozzy is on the bubble for getting in, but holy misuse of statistics. How about a little context? what's the sample size? Are you talking about when he was on the team but not starting? It doesn't mean that actually. And I'm curious who compiled the list of save percentage for every goalie in the league during the specific time of Ozzy's career, minus his stats of course. Seems unlikely they got that right. Doesn't mean much. It compares backups to starters. Backups usually face easier competition and don't start as many games. And again, it seems unlikely that someone piled that exact stat, accounting for the games where Ozzy started versus the other goalie on the team. This "stat" makes no sense. You're trying to make him look bad by using percentages where it's not a relevant measure. I could just as easily say that of the 4 Cups the Red Wings have won in the last 50 years, Osgood was there for three of them. So there seems to be a high correlation between Osgood and the Wings winning the Cup, right? That looks pretty damning, but I guess you forgot to list who was in front of him for losses. Roy, Brodeur, Belfour, Cujo, Hall, Moog, Vernon, Barasso, Esposito and Fuhr. Not exactly bad company. When you're in the playoffs a lot, you're going to lose more than a lot of goalies. Ty Conklin must be a great goalie because he's only ever lost one playoffs game, right? Actually a site I found had him listed at .539. That's still good enough for 6th on the all time list, ahead of Roy and Hasek. Dryden was #1 with .650. Dryden was a great goalie who spent his career on one of the greatest dynasties of all time. You didn't mention that puts him at #14 all time, with many of the goalies in front of him playing significantly fewer games. or that Hasek is at .546, Brodeur is at .547. I guess they don't belong in the hall either? Eva took care of this last one.

I'm actually a fan of Toews, but number 3?? He'd have to have a helluva year to justify that ranking. Same goes for Lecavalier. He's been one of my favorite players, but it seems unlikely he'll have the kind of season to justify that ranking. Before his concussion Crosby had 32 goals and 34 assists in 41 games. 66 points in 41 games is ridiculous. And it's not like he's just out there cherry picking and floating like a Patrick Kane. The list is about projecting for this coming season. After that kind of productivity, to have anyone other than Crosby at #1 would be a joke. And as others have mentioned, Z belongs in the top ten.

Much like the Ozzy thread, it's more about not being an ******* than the actual truth of the statement. I think it's best for the Wings to give young guys a chance and for Drapes to hang 'em up. But he's been a warrior for the Wings and no matter what's best for the team, it's at the same time a little sad to see him go. So there's a time and a place to dance a little jig about him retiring. Unless you're doing it just to bait people and troll, this pretty clearly isn't the place.

I'm an Ozzy fan, but no, his number shouldn't hang from the rafters. As I said in another thread, the Wings use an extremely high standard. They pretty much only retire the numbers of elite, franchise players. Ozzy was very good and played for the Wings for a very long time, but he was neither of those things.

To me it boils down to being very good for a very long time, but never elite. Is that Hall Worthy? My answer is, I honestly don't know. I'd be a little disappointed if he never got in, but I think he's definitely on the bubble so it wouldn't surprise me.

Osgood's personal achievements are light. That's the knock against him in the HHOF and retiring his number. He has an impressive resume, but he was never really a star in this league. He was never really considered among the top of his position. I really don't get your line of reasoning. It's as if you're trying to prove Ozzy's number should be retired by naming people who shouldn't have theirs retired. And what does trading Messier or Fuhr have to do with anything?? You're also putting way too much weight on being a Wing for a long time. Yes that's a factor, because you want to retire a number of a player who is associated first and foremost with that team and considered synonymous with the organization (unlike the Avs retiring Bourque's number), but it requires a lot more than that. And to be clear, I like Ozzy. I've been a fan over the years and defended him here countless times. But I still don't think he warrants having his number retired.

Actually that doesn't invalidate that argument, you just disagree with it. Because Ozzy played for the Wings for a long time and racked up an impressive resume does not some how erase the significance that in their entire history, the Wings have officially retired six numbers. The point still holds that the Wings use an extremely high standard for retiring numbers.

Double what he said. Maybe it's because I've been a Wings fan since the early 80s and seen a lot of players come and go, but just because a guy is a heart and soul Red Wings doesn't mean he deserves to have his numbers hung from the rafters. As others have mentioned, then dozens of numbers could be retired. But if the standard is Yzerman and soon to be Lidstrom, Ozzy just isn't in that elite class.

whether it is or not isn't really for you to say. And I'm not talking about how they ultimately deal with the substance abuse problem overall, I'm talking about specifically getting them into a program. Because I'm guessing a professional hockey player may be more reluctant to have a problem go public because of potential negative consequences on their career. Keeping it quiet at first seems like it would make it easier for a player to accept treatment. Ultimately it has to be an open acknowledged thing for it to be a success. But even then it doesn't mean they have to tell hockey fans. As much as it sometimes seems otherwise, we don't have personal relationships with these guys. And those are the people they need to tell, the ones close to them, not us.

If misleading the public makes it easier for a player to get help for his substance abuse problem, it seems like it's for the greater good to me.

What exactly is it I'm supposed to notice? Could you clarify for me?

Agreed. So I voted for the guy already under contract. Draper still has some qualities to offer, but with Eaves, Miller, and Abdelkader in the lineup they're redundant. Maybe Hudler will have a good season and pot some goals.

meh. If I wanted to read condescending, self righteous crap, I'll read Mitch Albom. He's pretty much cornered the market on it. More likely what happened is the guy went from being a sports fan as a kid, then returned and saw how it is as an adult. It's like people forget that the word "fan" comes from fanatic.