haroldsnepsts

I think the NHL is avoiding being the first major sport to do it, but once another one does (football is my guess) they'll happily follow. It sucks thinking about the Red Wings sweater with ads plastered all over it.

I still can't believe Cleary scored in his first game back. Is that why the board is so quiet today? Stunned silence? Franzen's pretty lucky to not even get a phonecall. I didn't think he'd get suspended but I could've seen a fine. He's gotten away with a few pretty good cheapshots over the years.

My favorite portion (emphasis mine): Near the end of your career, you will fight a tough guy named Donald Brashear, after he takes some liberties with your captain. You will finish third in the fight, but do it anyway. Many establishments still give you free beer for this.

The thing you're missing is that some people actually think that Kindl and Lashoff weren't fine. I am among them though as I said, I don't single them out for the losses. They aren't the biggest problem on the team, but they aren't fine. You can dismiss any contrary opinion because you think people are just going along with the popular narrative, but it doesn't make it true. Regardless, I'm backing away slowly from this discussion. It's pretty clear you're lumping me in with some larger issue you have that has little to do with what I've actually stated.

I'm apparently too invested, but you keep wanting to discuss this? I don't understand why you're so invested in arguing that they've been fine. They may not have been directly responsible for a ton of goals in their three games so far (though you could argue Kindl was a big factor on one), but that doesn't mean they are fine. As you point out, Smith and Dekeyser play harder minutes. And let's not forget Dekeyser hasn't even played 100 games in the NHL. Yes he makes mistakes but he's playing incredibly well given his experience and the responsibility he's been given. Not to mention part of the reason they're playing harder minutes is because Kindl has been eating up a lot of protected ones. As I said, i'm not blaming Kindl-Lashoff solely for losses. I'm not saying they are the biggest problem on this team. I dont know why you're pursuing this from my one comment about the Kindl Lashoff pairing. They're not a good pairing. I was bummed Quincey was out and not happy to see them back together. Nothing I've seen so far changes that.

dude, I was trying to do the same. Mainly I don't know how me saying "ugh" became such a big deal. I have nothing invested in Kindl Lashoff not being good. They do that on their own. As I said in the GDT, they seem to bring out the worst in each other even relatively to bottom pairings. Mostly I'm frustrated Kindl is still even on the team. Can't we just agree we both want him gone?

I think they are definitely worse than Lilja Lebda. Lebda and Kindl are probably fairly equivalent. But Lilja was a much steadier defenseman than Lashoff. I actually like Lashoff, but he's an inexperienced defenseman who could be a decent bottom pairing guy at best. And to be overly clear, I'm in no way pinning losses on them. My problem with that bottom pairing is for whatever reason they seem to be a dynamic duo of mistakes together (even relative to an average bottom pairing). More than anything I just want the Wings to get rid of Kindl. If a bottom pairing guy is going to be playing sheltered minutes, I'd rather it be a prospect who could turn into a good NHL defenseman than a 5 year veteran who's never quite put it all together. And what makes Kindl even more frustrating is he actually has offensive and puck moving skills, which the Wings desperately need from their blueline, but still can't get it figured out.

It's the first time i saw the post actually. That is awesome about Kindl scoring the goal though! Did Lashoff get the assist? Oh, wait... it was a PP so it wasn't even the pairing I was referring to was it. Even in trying to taunt me, you can't seem to resist misrepresenting what I've said in order to make your point. I said nothing about Kindl on the PP. I said nothing about Kindl without Quincey. I was merely not looking forward to the Lashoff Kindl pairing. With good reason. It's really all I meant from "ugh."

I don't know if I'd go that far, but he used to be best on the team at actually getting a shot through traffic and on net. He seemed to have lost that ability last year but maybe with some PP time he's getting it back?

I'm starting to think Kindl and Cleary read this forum.

To be totally clear, I didn't say he was sheltered when playing with Quincey. I said his minutes overall are sheltered. Either way the argument still holds water because playing equal even strength minutes with Quincey doesn't prove he's not being sheltered. For example, at even strength Kindl takes offensive zone starts a whopping 72.8% of the time. The next closest on the team is Quincey's 61.2%. For reference point, of players who have been in at least 10 games, Kindl has the highest percentage offensive starts of anyone in the league. The bottom line is I made one three letter comment when posting a tweet about Kindl and Lashoff being paired. It was from watching them play together last year, and being worried how they'd fare together this season. Based on what I've seen so far, that fear wasn't unfounded. But you've taken one super minor comment and it turned it into something much larger than it was ever meant to be.

Apparently Kindl has one of those. but according to capgeek it's the real deal. Between Cleary, Franzen, and Zetterberg. Which one would you think has a NTC?? Oh and Weiss too (I should probably get this back on topic).

I know you're kidding about Cleary but the funniest part of the whole thing is he has a NTC.

Please let's not drag this thread into another conversation about pornstars and hockey players. One is plenty.

I didn't see a GDT yet and didn't think it was worth a new one, but here's what's going on at the Wings practice: Mule on the third line? Are they easing him in coming back from injury?

I think the silver lining is now Doughty and Kronwall are bff's.

For starters, this thread is about rating the defense. Why would I talk about Tatar, Sheahan, Jurco, etc. in a thread about the defense? I also disagree that the third pairing has relatively little effect on the team. I think they'll be sheltered less than before because prior to last night Kindl was playing about 4 fewer minutes than the next defenseman, who happened to be Quincey. Everyone else was already absorbing some of what would've been Kindl's minutes. Now with Quincey out it's even more minutes to pick up. Some may be absorbed by the other pairs, but I'm guessing Kindl's will have to increase as well. And I'm not complaining about just any third pairing. I'm reacting specifically that we lost Quincey so now the Wings have to go back to a pairing that wasn't good last season. But apparently I'm not supposed to complain about something that's obviously bad because it's "too easy?" I didn't realize legitimate concerns about the Wings had to be difficult or unconventional. I also made no statements about this teams' future falling on Kindl or Lashoff. I'm not sure why you're exaggerating it to that point other than to argue against something I never said. Maybe spend more time refuting the actual points and less time making yourself the arbiter of what is worthwhile to post.

Great to see Ericsson go after Nolan for that hit from behind. Had they actually squared off Ericsson would've had his hands full with Nolan, but I still like that he went right at him. Im' a fan of Nolan generally, but that was a clear hit from behind. Looking away isn't an excuse for hitting a guy in the numbers.

No reason to lament this other than their play last season when paired. And Kindl has looked fine because he's playing very protected minutes (with the exception of last night when they had a 4 goal lead in the first period and Q got injured). With Quincey out and Lashoff in, he'll likely be less protected and have to pick up more minutes, or at least split them with Lashoff. So I'm basing my opinion on actual information not "low hanging fruit."

ugh. Ansar Khan ‏@AnsarKhanMLive 21m 21 minutes ago Defense pairs: Kronwall-Ericsson, DeKeyser-Smith, Lashoff-Kindl.

Ansar Khan ‏@AnsarKhanMLive 2m 2 minutes ago Wings said Kyle Quincey won't return to the game due to lower-body injury.

This is a nice gesture. LA Kings retweeted Jon Rosen ‏@lakingsinsider 2h2 hours ago Touching support by the Wings and Wings fans:

Hey as long as they don't call a penalty too, that's progress.

They're fun to watch. They have 34 points between them in 10 games. Carter is the old man on the line at 29 years old. Pearson and Toffoli are both 22. Two great picks by the Kings.

Yup. Gaborik, and Kopitar, plus Voynov is still suspended. That's three major holes in their lineup. It really has been all about That 70s line right now. And Quick holding them in games.