haroldsnepsts

If it's so easy to fix, why haven't they fixed it? don't get me wrong, I don't think the sky is falling, but this team is not the same defensively responsible one we watched last season. There's still plenty of time for them to get it dialed in though.

It's nice that the Wings are in a similar place in the standings as last year, but assuming your numbers are correct, giving up 14 more goals in 21 games is a legitimate concern.

It's more that he's been playing a ton of minutes for LA, who are not exactly an incredibly talented team, and he's looked pretty good. I wonder how Lebda would look if he were on the ice for the Kings 20+ minutes a game. Or Lilja, for that matter (though I think Lilja's having a good season so far).

I didn't see the game, but the Kings got smoked by Calgary last night, and Quincey somehow managed to be +2 and played over 22 minutes in the game.

Sorry, by cup years I mostly meant the ones in a row. 97 and 98. You need to explain how that statement contradicts my entire argument. I never said the Wings wouldn't win a cup with this roster. I said they haven't replaced a lot of the size and toughness from those years. I'm not wrong. Take a gander at the 97 and 98 lineup. Look at the height and weight of those players. The guys who could hit hard and drop the gloves when necessary. Now look at the current lineup. We've got guys who are big and strong on the puck. It's not like I said they were powder puffs. But they still don't match those years. Or the current standard being set by Anaheim and San Jose, because players have gotten bigger in 10 years. And I know it's blasphemy to say, but it's no coincidence that the season the Wings won the Cup they didn't have to go through San Jose or Anaheim. I'm not saying they couldn't have beaten those teams, but they may have won the battle but lost the war.

How is he a weakling? Because he's old? So is Chelios. I think Datsyuk is strong on his skates, but that doesn't necessarily translate to fight strong. Roberts is old, but he's 6'2" and 215 lbs to Datsyuk's 5'11" 185 lbs. Roberts has been in a few fights each season since he entered the league, and Datsyuk has never been. I'm just saying with size mismatch and experience, if anyone's getting beatdown, it's not Roberts.

Nice! Makes me like Hossa even more. And yeah, Roberts would've killed Datsyuk had they actually squared off. But it would be stupid for Dats to do that. But a gloved punch to the face or the occasional two-hander is warranted to stick up for himself.

If you'd chill out and quit judging this whole board based on one thread, you'd eventually find out you've got plenty of support on thinking Bettman is bad for this league and doesn't understand the game. And on the issue of.. dare I say it (because it's such a controversial word here)... "grit." I'm not really into fighting for fighting's sake (like McCarty's fight the other night), but have said several times that this roster has lost a lot of it's size and toughness from the Cup years that's never been replaced. Unfortunately under the cap those guys are harder and harder to come by. guys who will hit and fight and can also play the game. And it's not a priority for Holland, which is frustrating. I wish they had kept Quincey and lost Lebda, even if Quincey was a bottom pairing guy. When Ericsson comes up, I like the idea of having some big kids in the lineup who will knock guys around and drop the gloves. But that's a whole other conversation. This is just Dmac getting sent down for a couple games to bring Helm up. EDITED for clarity, hopefully. I think fights belong in the game. But i prefer the ones that mean something versus guys just dropping them for no reason on a faceoff like the other night.

You don't remember the part in the first fight where Lemieux fell to the ice and ducked and covered instead of trying to fight? Jumped or not, most guys would've gotten the gloves off and swung back instead of turtling. Him not being a noted fighter is no excuse. When you live by the sword as Lemieux did, by agitating and the occasional cheapshot, there will be a day of reckoning. If he wanted to avoid those confrontations, he should've played a cleaner game.

Awww, I hope you don't leave. You're more perfect for this board than you realize. Lots of hyperbole and histrionics over a minor roster move. We do that here better than anyone else, and I'm not kidding. I tend to believe Babcock when he says they want Helm's energy in the lineup. Mac is slow and a shadow of his former self. And if people think this is a front office move forced onto Babcock, I really doubt he would continue coaching here if he had that little control over his roster, especially the season after winning a Stanley Cup.

I wouldn't think so. McCarty was 35 when he came back and had missed less than a full season. Lemieux is 43 and hasn't played since the '03 season, prior to the lockout.

holy crap what a save. how did they not score?

meh. that was one of those fights where it's like, "what was that for??"

Nice turnover Lebda! you put it right on his tape.

That link is the HD with the wider aspect ratio, which is nice because you can see more of the ice. Plus the yahoo link kept lagging for me.

The San Jose Sharks signed Lemieux to a tryout contract. He's expected to report to their AHL affiliate this week. http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=257195&amp...s=headlines_nhl

Exactly. This thread overlooks that the team in front of them is not the same as it was last year. Last season the team was really solid defensively, even early in the season, and Hasek struggled. This season the team is struggling defensively and Ozzy is struggling a little in net. He's been okay, not great. I wouldn't fault him for many goals really, but it'd be nice if he could step up to help stabilize this team a little as they're struggling to find their defensive form. Just in case people have selective memory about how this team played defensively in front of Hasek while he struggled. here's some SOG through November when he was really struggling. 15 SOG 2 GA 27 SOG 3 GA 20 SOG 2 GA 29 SOG 3 GA 28 SOG 5 GA 16 SOG 1 GA 12 SOG 4 GA 16 SOG 4 GA 29 SOG 3 GA Ozzy has started 2 games where the Wings held an opponent to fewer than 20 shots. He's also started 5 games where the opponent had 30 or more SOG. Comparing the start of last season to this season isn't apples to apples. The team in front of the goaltender is playing much different.

I agree that's probably the heart of it. Not to mention with how good the Wings power play is at the moment, calling a penalty on the other team is practically like giving Detroit a penalty shot.

Typical Bettman. "Pay no attention to the facts. Listen only to the sound of my voice. Everything in the NHL is, has been, and always will be perfect while I am commissioner. I know more than you do, ignorant fans. Don't worry your little heads."

Pests usually agitate other players, not refs. I don't think Maltby whines a lot. How often do you watch Crosby play? Because while I don't get to see him a whole lot, but when I do I honestly don't see him whine any more than any other player, especially captains. Watch Chelios during a game. Is that not whining? Yzerman used to ***** to the refs a lot, especially late in his career. When he retired, he even joked that they were probably glad to see him go. I'm not saying he never whines. But I think it's a reputation he got his first couple seasons that's stuck. Now any time he complains, its "all the time." It's almost always wrapped up in some bias against him because he's the league's golden boy and hyped by the media.

That's it exactly. This season it seems like the standard for penalties is directly related to the goal differential, especially in the third period.

To be clear, it wasn't so much that I thought they should swallow their whistles late in the game. It's that the inconsistency of the calls is even more annoying, and even more of a deciding factor in the game when it happens in the final minutes. The play was a one-handed reach that tapped Selanne's gloves. They had let more than that go all night, but decided to whistle this one. Not surprisingly, the Ducks were down a goal at that time so it gave them a great chance to tie the game up in the final minutes, which they did. To me it was another case of a team getting handed a chance by the refs late in the game to tie it up. Thankfully the Ducks lost in OT, but they didn't deserve the charity point. The Blues soundly outplayed them all night.

Refs make themselves a factor again tonight in the St. Louis-Ducks game. The Blues are up by a goal and they call a very late hook. The blues player literally had one hand on his stick and tapped Selanne around the gloves, they call the hook. The Ducks pull the goalie and have a 6-on-4 powerplay, crash the net. Cory Perry plows into Legace and Niedermayer scores with less than a second left. Now we're in OT. The call on Selanne was unbelievably weak for the last few minutes of a game.

If he turns into a second line D-man, I think we probably lost too, because the guys ahead of him aren't going to be second line d-men. Lebda, Chelios. Lilja might be on another team, but Quincey still would've been cheaper.

Their best dman is definitely the 18 year old Doughty. Right now he's also looking like he's a great choice for the Calder too. The kid's good.