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Perhaps you should talk to Stevie. No? How 'bout Forsberg? Patrick Roy? Mario Lemieux? Is it MY turn to use the little "eye roll" smilie now?

Yes. As a matter of fact, there DOES appear to be an injury you're unaware of. It's been widely reported that Lids has been playing with a severe case of elbow tendinitis for at least the past 2 years. You DO remember last year, when he was penalized for missing the All-Star Game, because he wanted to stay home and rehab the elbow? He opted NOT to undergo surgery this off-season, probably for the reasons already stated. And while he's able to play DEFENSE with a wonky elbow, what he is NOT able to do is TAKE A SHOT with any kind of power behind it. Simply winding up for the shot is probably living hell, (pain-wise), for him. I can't believe you're unaware of the injury..... It's not like they've been keeping it a secret. Quite the opposite, in fact. From MLive in September 2009

There are a number of problems with that line of thinking. Firstly: He'd never be healed up in time for the Post Season to start. Even if he'd had the surgery LAST SUMMER, there'd be no guarantee of full recovery in time for the 2010 Play Offs. Secondly: He may not fully recover from the surgery AT ALL. It's not a 100% type of thing. Surgery will help with the pain, but if he opts for surgery, he may never get enough mobility in that arm to ever play again. Why do you think he hasn't HAD the surgery already? It's obvious that he's in pain. It's either play through the pain, or risk never playing again. That's a no-brainer, as far as I'm concerned.

Excellent sequence of saves by Howard. Now just need to score, guys. Come ON!

Oy! Easy there, easy!

The good news is, the Jax are just as offensively inept as the Wings are.

Igor is King Solomon, silly.

Unfortunately, he's busy with Team Canada right now.

This is ridiculous. Really. Even as banged up as they are, they're better than THIS! This is a confidence problem. Plain and simple.

Beat me to the punch..... However, the reason he hasn't had surgery on it is because it's touch and go as to whether surgery will make it better. Or worse. Surgery will make the pain better. But it might compromise the functionality of the arm. I don't think Nick thinks it's worth it. He'll probably put off surgery until after he retires. That is....unless the pain just becomes unbearable.

Yes. And No. He's playing through an injury. But it's already been disclosed. Elbow tendinitis. Rather severe case, by all accounts. He's been playing through it for the past couple of Seasons.

This is what happens when you keep Osgood on the bench for too long. Bonehead. He's been terrible this game. Just terrible.

You're not wrong. You're correct. Additionally, Howard has faced a significantly lower LEVEL of talent all Season long. His last Start, against Phoenix, was the first time he's faced a Team over .500 since the opening weeks of the Season. It's also only one of 4 Teams over .500 that he's faced ALL Season. And while the 'Yotes DO have a winning record, they're also one of the lowest scoring Teams in the League.

Couldn't agree more, gcom. Been sayin' it for years. (Most) Wings fans won't know what they had 'til it's gone.

Pffft. Puhlease. The little troll continues to support Charles Wang, who is a disgusting criminal and should be behind bars in Federal prison for his crimes.

You and me both, interminded. This is not like 2005, where Legace was handed the reins as the Starter before Osgood played a single game that Season. Firstly, it's not as though Osgood is playing poorly. He's not at his peak performance level, but he's playing well enough. Secondly, after everything that Osgood has shown over the past two Seasons in proving that he steps it up when he's called upon, I think he deserves at least a "fair chance". At least. Last year, Babcock used Conklin as the "stick" with which he "poked" Oz. But, let's face it, Conklin was never in the long-term plans, anyway. The Wings are hoping that Howard is. Babcock is making the same comments this Season as he made last Season, when it comes to how he prefers to "motivate" his players...... "The bottom line is there's nothing I can say to a player that brings the kind of urgency to a player that sitting out does," said Babcock. "Everybody wants a chance to display their talent. In order to get that, you have to compete hard enough and work hard enough to get that opportunity. When that's taken away from you, reality sets in." Hopefully "reality sets in" for Oz this year, as it did last year. Hopefully he's given the opportunity to take advantage of it. However..... LAST year it was pretty clear, (as I stated from the beginning), that Conklin was never viewed as a viable option as a Starter. Period. Howard, on the other hand, is a Wings drafted goaltender, and the Organization has invested FIVE YEARS into him. He'll get the opportunities that Conklin was never afforded by virtue of that alone.

I'm not saying that your assumption isn't logical, because it is. I'm only giving you my gut feeling. And my gut feeling is that Babcock is sending a clear message. I think he's going to stick with Howard, come Hell or high water. I think Osgood is going to have to play lights out in order to get more than one game a week. And that's if Howard doesn't completely crap the bed. I think Phoenix is a test for Howard. This is really the only halfway decent Team he'll have faced since the opening week of the Season. If he plays even reasonably well, I think Babcock sticks with him. Again, it's not that what you're saying doesn't make sense. I just happen to know how Babcock operates. He's shown a decided tendency to "poke" Osgood, since he's gotten here in 2005. Only this time, he's "poking" Oz with a goaltender who was drafted by the Wings, and one whom Management is HOPING, (for a change), will be more than just a stop-gap 'tender.

Just curious, but why would you think that Howard would get the call against Phoenix on Monday so that Osgood could face Tampa Bay on Thursday? I'm thinking Howard gets both. As a matter of fact, I'm betting he gets all but the 2nd of the back-to-backs. Babcock was pretty clear in his post game comments: "Ozzie was fine..... but Howard will get the Start against Phoenix (on Monday)."

I don't see Oz getting enough Starts to reach 400 by New Years Eve. I'm thinkin' Babcock will be sticking with Jimmy Howard for a bit, here. ***Edit*** Oh, and to the OP: It's 396 Wins, rather than 397.

Without going back through the whole thread.....any word on Danny Cleary?

Thank you, digitaljohn. What a novel concept. Another year of the "Osgood SUCKS!" crowd squealing that "he's not getting any better!", regardless of the fact that he's not actually PLAYING. Gotta PLAY in order to "get better". Stats don't improve from the bench, for the love of Pete.

No. But it helps to put Osgood's rookie year stats up against his Teammates stats for that year. Bob Essensa 13GP 778MIN 34GA 2.62GAA 4W 7L 2T 0.899SVP 1 SO Chris Osgood 41GP 2206MIN 105GA 2.86GAA 23W 8L 5T 0.895SVP 2 SO Tim Cheveldae 30GP 1572MIN 91GA 3.47GAA 16W 9L 1T 0.875SVP 1 SO Vincent Riendeau 8GP 345MIN 23GA 4.00GAA 2W 4L 0T 0.824SVP 0 SO Peter Ing 3GP 170MIN 15GA 5.29GAA 1W 2 L 0T 0.853SVP 0 SO

What you're really saying is "Someone say it's a good idea to go with Howard. Someone say the words. Say the words "We should go with Howard"." You're not even very good at disguising it. By the way.....as for Hasek "saving our ass" in the first 2 games against NSH in 2008? The Wings outshot the Preds 39-20 in Game 1, and won 3-1. They outshot the Preds 38-27 in Game 2, and Won 4-2. The only "ass saving" that was going on was on the OTHER side of the rink, where Dan Ellis was the only thing keeping the score respectable.

Not for nothin', but it was a widely held belief for YEARS that Curtis Joseph's "physical talent and ability" surpassed Osgood, too. Hell! Roberto Luongo's "physical talent and ability" surpasses Osgood by a MILE. Takes more than "physical talent and ability" to Win in the Post Season, Carman. Osgood is undersized for a goaltender, and he's never been the most skilled. Osgood has achieved what he's achieved in his career because he's got Heart. He's a battler. A fighter. And no matter how many times you knock him down, he keeps getting back up. Like it or not, Chris Osgood has the Heart of a Champion. That's a fact.

Check the flow of the conversation, Henry. The original comment was "about Osgood in the Play Offs", pertaining to his age, and to the fact that AT his age, we can't expect him to perform well, just because he has in the past. Pavel Hossyukstrom's question was "Why not. Osgood and Brodeur are the same age. What's stopping Brodeur from slowing down?" Again, when it comes to the PLAY OFFS, Osgood and Brodeur are almost IDENTICAL. And that IS what the original comment was pertaining to, after all. The Play Offs.