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Thank you, Holmstrom!

Go to the net!!!!

holmstrom?

You crack me up. You do realize these teams have played before, right? Did california start handing out free Pronger T-shirts or something in all the middle schools?

After the lecture you gave me on my ignorance of the history of hocky, your posts on Shanahan keep cracking me up Just try and take it into context. Of course I am talking about "judging" whether he is worthy to go to the rafters or not. A lot of people here do not want him up there because of the way he left. I even went on to clarify that statement later on in the post. This does sound like the "jilted ex-girlfriend" that was brought up earlier in the post. Fedorov still lives in Detroit and has family here. He hangs out with the team in the off-season, and regularly visits the Ilitches. His charity still operates in Detroit and he was quoted last year he would welcome the opportunity to play in Detroit again. If you feel this strongly about him, would him signing a "one day contract" with Detroit really help your opinion of him? To me, it seems about as necessary as polishing firewood, but I suppose it would be a nice public gesture. He handled the whole thing bad - but I am waaaay over it. So Fedorov was a bit of an imbecile when talking to the press. As we have learned from Datsyuk, Semin, Malkin, Kovalchuk and Ovechkin - a lot of russian players do not seem to ship equiped with the "PC Filter" that the rest of pro athletes come standard with.

Heh, I love how the small, skilled, soft euros are cheating by getting in the way of the big, tough, dirty Ducks. "Mr. Campbell, as Pronger was attempting to elbow Holmstrom, Jiri Hudler stepped in his way!" -- Randy Carlyle

Alright, I won't demand to see Chelios on the power play But I think he will be great to have out there when the Ducks are cycling down low.

I'm picturing Holmstrom as this lurching, 7'0 goon who's only purpose in hockey is to physically assualt goalies every moment he is on the ice, the way Carlyle is talking about him. Or perhaps redefine goalie interference as "standing in front of the crease" vs. the actual "running of the goalie" Aneheim employs, with players like Parros and Perry.

WTF? Me no likey. It's still a much better defense than we had in '07 but these mysterious injuries and flus are starting to get worrisome. And by the way, Chelios was rock solid in 2007 against Anaheim and playing over 20 minutes a night. He can still do the job when called upon.

Ultimately, a lot of us just react to the poor way he handled leaving differently. I know people who handle pressure with grace, and those that don't.... I try not to judge them based mainly on this. Brendan Shanahan really did the same thing as Fedorov did in '03, but he just handled it better (and most of us were secretly glad to see him leave). Face it, Shanahan has a lot of charisma -- the guy screwed his teamate's wife, later married her and he is one of the most liked players in the NHL. You want to talk about a cancer in the locker room? If merely wanting to leave the Red Wings to take on a different role is enough to cancel out all his merits as a player during his years in Detroit (for consideration of his number in the rafters), then there will probably be no convincing you otherwise. If it has more to do with his poor choice of comments at those times, I just think that will not seem as big a deal as the years wear on. Like I said before, he made a mistake in expressing his frustration at the time to the press.... I just do not think that is what he should be remembered for in Detroit.

Like the moon landing?

Is it ironic to anyone else at all that the coach of the dirtiest team in the league is preemptively accusing the other team of being stinking cheaters? I'm sorry, but this is like the school bully warning the pricipal that the foreign nerd might be a menace.

Wow. Nice post! (I liked that better than Mitch Albom's piece)

I bet that might have something to do with it - I'm not sure if Howe ever worked directly for the Red Wings following his retirement, but he was still certainly considered "part of the ogranization". It might have something to do with Kelly not having his number retired, as he did not have much to do with the Red Wings following his retirement... although coaching in the NHL and serving the canadian parliament are not exactly what I would consider black marks.

That's hilarious! I often drive my Lexus to the local municipality and set up a quaint little picnic for myself, unpack my steak dinner and enjoy a nice, well-aged pinot noir while laughing and pointing at those filing for unemployment. Is there anything funnier than that???

Well duh. My grandma could coach the Red Wings to a Cup. She could also play goalie/forward/defense and post numbers like Osgood/Datsyuk/Lidstrom.

Could be right -- the Ducks, with their size are very dangerous when cycling down low, and I think the wings especially have a hard time with that. However, the Wings are the best in the league at disrupting other teams' transition game, so they will severely limit those chances. And there are a few Wings whom have no problem "embellishing", which is actually a smart way to play a team who counts on the refs not calling all their infractions. Like it or not.

Fine points - though I still think the comparison is apt because it was Ilitch who retired Lindsay's number in 1991 and had a statue erected of Lindsay at the Joe only this past year. Both players would be retired by the same ownership (or family) using presumably the same set of standards. If I was comparing him to Larry Aurie, who was retired well over a half-century ago by a completely different owner, than I would be a lot more willing to cede the point. I think in both Lindsay's and Fedorov's cases (Lindsay being much worse), the good outweighs the bad, and they still deserve to be honored for their service to the organization.

Sure, my knowledge of hockey history is poor (definitely on the low end of posters on this site). Way to open up a post! Fedorov wanted to play enough in Detroit that he illegally defected from the Soviet Union and left his family and friends behind to come to a completely foreign country. Is that perhaps a "plus" in his column? His playoff record alone shows how much he wanted to succeed with this team. I just do not understand how his years of exceptional play in Detroit and service to the community is outweighed by wanting to leave and take on a new role at two points in his career. Because you don't like the way he went about doing so? I'll grant he does not exactly have the grace of Shanahan, but I don't feel that lessens his accomplishments and service while he was in Detroit. It's already been pointed out to you that you were wrong on your history with Shanahan... so gimme a break with your lecture on "ignoring/skewing" history when you can't even keep facts straight from only the past few years.

I think Chelios deserves this one - to come back from an injury at his age had nothing to do with money, lifestyle or unfinished goals. The guy literally loves playing hockey and will do anything he can to keep playing. I think he had ten times as many reasons as Sullivan and Zednik to hang 'em up.

I agree on Neely - but also think circumstances should be able to bump a borderline candidate like that in. Fedorov was better though. Here is how I have them rated: 1) Howe The clear number one. 2) Lidstrom 3) Lindsay 4) Yzerman 5) Sawchuk 6) Kelly These guys are all on a pretty equal level for me, and I change their order A LOT. 7) Fedorov 8) Abel 9) Delvecchio 10) Ullman I'll switch these guys around a lot also, and think they are on a pretty even footing for the most part. Goodfellow would be # 11. And I am only counting time with the Wings.

For such a proponent of fighting, you seem awfully ignorant of the actual practice of it. So a taller guy should always be able to beat up a shorter guy, is that it? Fischer grew up playing in Europe, where fighting was severely punished, unlike in north america where it is a part of the game. Is it possible actual experience fighting might be an advantage when actually getting in a fight? Could an experienced fighter possibly ever take down someone bigger and stronger than him? Good god, you come so far out of left field sometimes. Fischer had 3 inches and only 15 lbs on Hartnell, I don't consider that a David Vs. Goliath scenario. Fischer took the time to literally take boxing lessons from Joey Kocur and it paid off. WTF? I would have thought you would respect something like that? And you admit Jiri played better every year, but don't think he could have continued to improve. He was 24 when he retired and would be all of 28 today. How many Norrises had Lidstrom won by the age of 23? How about at 28?

You're right, those guys get the benefit of the doubt, as they should. But like them, it's just hard for me to muster up legitimate reasons to not retire the number of one of the greatest Red Wings ever. Fedorov was loyal to the Wings throughout every contract he had. And he was never under any contractual obligation to create charities in Detroit and fund them with millions of dollars. Sure he might not have played 100% during every single regular season game, but neither does Datsyuk. A smart player on a good team does save some for the playoffs. I think he made a mistake on how he handled everything and he should have put a leash on his dad, but I do not let that take away from his accomplishments here. So he is not near sainthood like Yzerman and especially Lidstrom, but not even Howe has that clean a closet. It's clear to me money was never the motivator for his leaving, which would have rubbed a bit more salt in the wounds. If Fedorov was injured in 2003 and forced to retire - I bet it would be near unanimous that his number deserved to be retired. He had accomplished more than enough to deserve that honor. But the fact was, it was obviously a goal of his to lead a team, and he was not going to get that in Detroit. I guess in my opinion, I do not view it as much different than had he retired in 2003. I appreciate the tone of these last couple pages and realize everyone is just presenting their opinion and hope it stays that way!

How many of you would be keen to retire the number of a dirty player like Ulf Samuelsson if he had played his entire career for the Wings (assuming he had HoF billing)? Lindsay was worse. I can compare them because both took actions that placed themselves and their goals in front of the team, resulting in them leaving the team. I just think as time goes on, like Lindsay, more will want to "lay claim" to Fedorov and honor his accomplishments while he was a Red Wing. It bothers me that Red Kelly's number is honored in Toronto and not in Detroit, where he accomplished a lot more. I want Kelly remembered and honored in Detroit, despite his falling out with Jack Adams and playing for another team.

Argh, I am not comparing Lids and Yzerman to Fedorov. Those guys are pretty unique. But I don't think Sakic should not be retired in Colorado because he signed an offer sheet either. If we are going to compare Fedorov to any players with their numbers in the banner, Lindsay is the best one - because Lindsay is ten times worse than Fedorov (Sawchuk was no angel, either). Ted Lindsay may be the dirtiest player to ever play in the NHL. New penalties were literally created because of his play. The guy was barred from Old-Timers games for a while because he was still playing dirty (lol, can you imagine?). He put his own interests in front of the team when he kept trying to form a union, despite knowing damn well it might get him traded or even blackballed from the entire league. Yes, it was ultimately altruistic of him, but I am sure it started off with, "damn, I deserve more money for doing this". The Red wings were a worse team because of his actions resulting in him being traded. Gordie Howe and other players spoke publicly against his actions.